WEBVTT

00:00:00.719 --> 00:00:05.919
two one boom and we're live first of all

00:00:03.439 --> 00:00:08.480
cheers gentlemen let's have a little

00:00:05.919 --> 00:00:09.759
toast relax bob thank you very much for

00:00:08.480 --> 00:00:10.880
doing this i really appreciate it i

00:00:09.759 --> 00:00:13.279
understand

00:00:10.880 --> 00:00:15.440
that you've told this story many many

00:00:13.279 --> 00:00:17.278
times you've been grilled many many

00:00:15.439 --> 00:00:19.600
times and it's very stressful for you so

00:00:17.278 --> 00:00:22.079
i really really appreciate your time

00:00:19.600 --> 00:00:24.400
for people who don't know the story

00:00:22.079 --> 00:00:26.879
there is a documentary

00:00:24.399 --> 00:00:30.000
jeremy corbell has a documentary out

00:00:26.879 --> 00:00:32.320
right now it's called bob lazar area 51

00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:35.519
and ufos and flying saucers and flying

00:00:32.320 --> 00:00:36.480
saucers bombs are air 51 and flying okay

00:00:35.520 --> 00:00:39.120
um

00:00:36.479 --> 00:00:40.878
i first heard your story decades ago

00:00:39.119 --> 00:00:43.039
i've i told you last night we went out

00:00:40.878 --> 00:00:44.558
to dinner i've seen pretty much every

00:00:43.039 --> 00:00:46.878
interview you've ever given i've

00:00:44.558 --> 00:00:48.959
followed the story incredibly closely

00:00:46.878 --> 00:00:53.280
but for people who don't know the story

00:00:48.960 --> 00:00:54.719
let's give them the bullet points you

00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:58.799
used to work

00:00:54.719 --> 00:00:59.920
at area 51 in area 51 you got you you

00:00:58.799 --> 00:01:01.358
went like

00:00:59.920 --> 00:01:04.719
well you know we want to be accurate

00:01:01.359 --> 00:01:07.118
okay area s4 s4 okay it's about 15 miles

00:01:04.719 --> 00:01:08.079
south of area 51. okay

00:01:07.118 --> 00:01:08.959
um

00:01:08.079 --> 00:01:10.478
you

00:01:08.959 --> 00:01:11.279
worked

00:01:10.478 --> 00:01:13.359
in

00:01:11.280 --> 00:01:14.560
what would you how would you describe it

00:01:13.359 --> 00:01:17.519
i i guess

00:01:14.560 --> 00:01:19.920
within the area 51 compound you can call

00:01:17.519 --> 00:01:22.158
that a subset of area 51.

00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:23.759
and you got that job before that you

00:01:22.159 --> 00:01:25.920
were working

00:01:23.759 --> 00:01:28.478
before that i had worked at los alamos

00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:30.640
right national labs in new mexico and

00:01:28.478 --> 00:01:32.640
you were involved in what kind of work

00:01:30.640 --> 00:01:35.439
nuclear weapon development physics i

00:01:32.640 --> 00:01:37.118
mean that's they do everything there so

00:01:35.438 --> 00:01:39.279
how do they approach you

00:01:37.118 --> 00:01:42.239
to say hey bob once you come on out to

00:01:39.280 --> 00:01:42.239
the nevada desert

00:01:42.319 --> 00:01:47.118
well the way this went down was

00:01:45.200 --> 00:01:49.920
um

00:01:47.118 --> 00:01:51.599
at that time it was 1982

00:01:49.920 --> 00:01:52.719
i

00:01:51.599 --> 00:01:56.719
had put

00:01:52.719 --> 00:01:59.599
a jet engine in my my honda

00:01:56.719 --> 00:02:01.118
and los alamos put it on the front page

00:01:59.599 --> 00:02:02.879
of the paper

00:02:01.118 --> 00:02:05.280
said you know uh

00:02:02.879 --> 00:02:06.158
los alamos man physicist at the lab you

00:02:05.280 --> 00:02:08.719
know

00:02:06.159 --> 00:02:11.120
built this 200 mile an hour you know on

00:02:08.719 --> 00:02:11.919
the jet car that i drove to work every

00:02:11.120 --> 00:02:15.120
day

00:02:11.919 --> 00:02:16.719
so uh so i was known in los alamos the

00:02:15.120 --> 00:02:19.439
guy with the weird car and you know you

00:02:16.719 --> 00:02:21.759
could hear it from you know a mile away

00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:23.520
anyway

00:02:21.759 --> 00:02:24.639
the day that came out on the front page

00:02:23.520 --> 00:02:26.879
of the paper

00:02:24.639 --> 00:02:28.958
was the day edward teller the father of

00:02:26.878 --> 00:02:30.159
the hydrogen bomb was giving

00:02:28.959 --> 00:02:32.080
a lecture

00:02:30.159 --> 00:02:34.079
down there at the lab

00:02:32.080 --> 00:02:36.239
and we didn't have much going on that

00:02:34.080 --> 00:02:38.000
day in our group and i asked if i could

00:02:36.239 --> 00:02:39.920
go down there

00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:42.560
and

00:02:39.919 --> 00:02:44.238
i went down there early and ed teller

00:02:42.560 --> 00:02:46.318
was outside

00:02:44.239 --> 00:02:48.480
leaning on a brick wall there and

00:02:46.318 --> 00:02:50.000
reading the front page of the paper now

00:02:48.479 --> 00:02:52.238
there's a guy out of history so i

00:02:50.000 --> 00:02:53.598
introduced myself hey i'm the guy you're

00:02:52.239 --> 00:02:55.519
reading about there and we talked for a

00:02:53.598 --> 00:02:57.518
little while and it was cool

00:02:55.519 --> 00:02:59.680
uh you know fast forward to years later

00:02:57.519 --> 00:03:02.719
i had moved out to las vegas

00:02:59.680 --> 00:03:04.239
and had you know left los alamos and

00:03:02.719 --> 00:03:05.840
you know went on to other things and i

00:03:04.239 --> 00:03:08.000
wanted to get back into the scientific

00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:09.759
community yeah i left start other

00:03:08.000 --> 00:03:12.479
businesses and

00:03:09.759 --> 00:03:13.759
and that sort of thing so i sent resumes

00:03:12.479 --> 00:03:17.199
out and one of them went out to ed

00:03:13.759 --> 00:03:19.519
teller and referenced our meeting

00:03:17.199 --> 00:03:22.479
you know back back in that the day

00:03:19.519 --> 00:03:23.280
and uh anyway he remembered me

00:03:22.479 --> 00:03:25.280
and

00:03:23.280 --> 00:03:26.800
gave me a reference somebody to contact

00:03:25.280 --> 00:03:29.919
at egng

00:03:26.800 --> 00:03:30.879
and that's pretty much how it started

00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:33.518
so

00:03:30.878 --> 00:03:36.079
you get a phone call or a letter like

00:03:33.519 --> 00:03:36.080
what do you get

00:03:36.158 --> 00:03:41.359
well i got a

00:03:38.000 --> 00:03:43.519
what did i get i got a letter initially

00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:45.280
and um went down for an interview

00:03:43.519 --> 00:03:48.959
probably a couple times and it was down

00:03:45.280 --> 00:03:50.959
at eg g special projects which was um

00:03:48.959 --> 00:03:53.039
at mccarran airport at that time out in

00:03:50.959 --> 00:03:54.878
las vegas and did they give you any sort

00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:59.199
of job description of what you were

00:03:54.878 --> 00:04:00.959
applying for um they said it was for ed

00:03:59.199 --> 00:04:03.119
i can't remember exactly what they did

00:04:00.959 --> 00:04:04.799
this was a long time ago but i i think

00:04:03.120 --> 00:04:06.719
it was um

00:04:04.799 --> 00:04:08.719
advanced propulsion or something like

00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:11.120
that something relatively generic and

00:04:08.719 --> 00:04:12.000
they said it's in a remote area

00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:14.080
um

00:04:12.000 --> 00:04:16.720
you know it's gonna be some days on some

00:04:14.080 --> 00:04:18.879
days off and um

00:04:16.720 --> 00:04:21.280
you know it was kind of a

00:04:18.879 --> 00:04:22.959
it was kind of uh not exactly a

00:04:21.279 --> 00:04:25.119
full-time job but you might have to be

00:04:22.959 --> 00:04:27.758
out there for two weeks at a time and

00:04:25.120 --> 00:04:29.040
take two weeks off so it was kind of uh

00:04:27.759 --> 00:04:30.240
the work schedule would be kind of

00:04:29.040 --> 00:04:32.560
broken up

00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:34.400
and did this seem attractive to you or

00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:36.399
did it seem weird

00:04:34.399 --> 00:04:37.839
no it really wasn't weird because people

00:04:36.399 --> 00:04:39.839
that work at the test site anybody

00:04:37.839 --> 00:04:41.918
that's familiar with the area up there

00:04:39.839 --> 00:04:44.719
um you know working at the nuclear test

00:04:41.918 --> 00:04:47.359
site uh or at the tonopod test range

00:04:44.720 --> 00:04:49.840
north of there uh that's typically how

00:04:47.360 --> 00:04:51.680
things go so you had known about it from

00:04:49.839 --> 00:04:53.679
the scientific community because the

00:04:51.680 --> 00:04:55.918
area 51 at that time was no they didn't

00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:57.840
say anything about area 51. okay so they

00:04:55.918 --> 00:05:00.000
just said it was in a you know in a

00:04:57.839 --> 00:05:02.478
remote location and you just know it was

00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:04.319
up at the test site right so but there

00:05:02.478 --> 00:05:05.519
was no mention of area 51 at that time

00:05:04.319 --> 00:05:08.159
so they've done

00:05:05.519 --> 00:05:10.719
hundreds of nuclear tests in nevada and

00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:12.400
nevada that whole area was there's been

00:05:10.720 --> 00:05:14.240
there's giant chunks of nevada the

00:05:12.399 --> 00:05:16.079
people yeah there's a big piece of

00:05:14.240 --> 00:05:17.759
nevada and it's split up into different

00:05:16.079 --> 00:05:20.560
areas there's a nuclear test site

00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:22.000
there's area 51 there's the tonopod test

00:05:20.560 --> 00:05:23.839
range north of that there's little

00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:25.680
sub-areas there's areas where they test

00:05:23.839 --> 00:05:27.519
chemical weapons and things like that so

00:05:25.680 --> 00:05:29.600
it's all broken up as a you know

00:05:27.519 --> 00:05:31.839
gigantic test area so take me back to

00:05:29.600 --> 00:05:33.360
first day on the job

00:05:31.839 --> 00:05:34.959
you accept a job

00:05:33.360 --> 00:05:36.000
they take you out there

00:05:34.959 --> 00:05:39.319
yeah

00:05:36.000 --> 00:05:39.319
it's um

00:05:39.519 --> 00:05:42.799
the first day really i didn't really get

00:05:41.199 --> 00:05:44.560
to see a whole lot the first day was

00:05:42.800 --> 00:05:47.038
essentially just paperwork that's when i

00:05:44.560 --> 00:05:50.399
flew into area 51 proper

00:05:47.038 --> 00:05:51.918
and i left mccarran airport

00:05:50.399 --> 00:05:52.879
and flew what they call the janet

00:05:51.918 --> 00:05:54.799
flights

00:05:52.879 --> 00:05:56.959
just um

00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:59.280
you know a passenger plane from las

00:05:56.959 --> 00:06:02.239
vegas to area 51

00:05:59.279 --> 00:06:05.279
and it was really just going through

00:06:02.240 --> 00:06:08.720
a mountain of paperwork that day

00:06:05.279 --> 00:06:09.758
from security clearances to um

00:06:08.720 --> 00:06:11.520
god there was

00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:13.520
it was like two or three hours of just

00:06:11.519 --> 00:06:16.560
solid paperwork and that was that was

00:06:13.519 --> 00:06:20.839
really an uneventful first day

00:06:16.560 --> 00:06:20.839
when did things get weird

00:06:21.038 --> 00:06:25.759
when did you realize that at what point

00:06:23.360 --> 00:06:27.120
in time did you say hey

00:06:25.759 --> 00:06:30.000
this is not

00:06:27.120 --> 00:06:32.879
normal work like this doesn't even seem

00:06:30.000 --> 00:06:34.639
like it's from this planet

00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:36.319
that i can't tell you what day that

00:06:34.639 --> 00:06:37.439
occurred on because so much time has

00:06:36.319 --> 00:06:39.840
gone by

00:06:37.439 --> 00:06:42.160
the days have kind of fused into one and

00:06:39.839 --> 00:06:44.000
i can't separate the days was it a slow

00:06:42.160 --> 00:06:45.439
burn or was there a moment of

00:06:44.000 --> 00:06:47.600
recognition

00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:50.319
well the

00:06:47.600 --> 00:06:52.000
the first inkling i had was when i i

00:06:50.319 --> 00:06:54.080
came in normal there's this facility

00:06:52.000 --> 00:06:56.478
that is at s4

00:06:54.079 --> 00:06:57.680
it's in the side of a mountain

00:06:56.478 --> 00:07:00.719
and

00:06:57.680 --> 00:07:02.079
normally we had pulled in with the bus

00:07:00.720 --> 00:07:04.720
and gone around the front through a

00:07:02.079 --> 00:07:06.159
normal double door

00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:08.160
this time that i went in there were

00:07:06.160 --> 00:07:10.160
hangar doors open

00:07:08.160 --> 00:07:12.560
i went into the hangar door and in the

00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:14.560
hangar door was the disc the flying

00:07:12.560 --> 00:07:16.959
saucer that i worked on

00:07:14.560 --> 00:07:18.959
i saw it sitting there and we walked by

00:07:16.959 --> 00:07:21.439
it had a little american flag stuck on

00:07:18.959 --> 00:07:23.359
the side and i thought oh my god this

00:07:21.439 --> 00:07:25.360
finally explains all the flying saucer

00:07:23.360 --> 00:07:28.160
stories this is just an advanced fighter

00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:31.038
and it this is [ __ ] hilarious right

00:07:28.160 --> 00:07:32.639
so i went by i slid my hand alongside it

00:07:31.038 --> 00:07:34.079
i got reprimanded immediately for

00:07:32.639 --> 00:07:35.918
touching the thing

00:07:34.079 --> 00:07:37.279
and uh there was a guy an armed guard

00:07:35.918 --> 00:07:39.439
that followed us in and just said keep

00:07:37.279 --> 00:07:41.918
your eyes at forward and your hands at

00:07:39.439 --> 00:07:44.079
your side and just walk in the door so

00:07:41.918 --> 00:07:47.198
that was the first time i had seen

00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:49.359
anything that was weird

00:07:47.199 --> 00:07:51.520
it was some time later that i was

00:07:49.360 --> 00:07:53.919
introduced to my um

00:07:51.519 --> 00:07:55.839
my lab partner barry

00:07:53.918 --> 00:07:57.439
and we had some of the subcomponents of

00:07:55.839 --> 00:07:58.560
the craft

00:07:57.439 --> 00:08:01.360
in the lab

00:07:58.560 --> 00:08:03.519
and barry was very anxious to get a new

00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:04.800
lab partner so he was very talkative and

00:08:03.519 --> 00:08:07.439
couldn't wait to show me different

00:08:04.800 --> 00:08:10.160
things and it was in the demonstration

00:08:07.439 --> 00:08:13.279
of the reactor working where it caught

00:08:10.160 --> 00:08:15.120
my attention to where

00:08:13.279 --> 00:08:17.519
this is technology that doesn't even

00:08:15.120 --> 00:08:19.598
exist

00:08:17.519 --> 00:08:20.719
so i mean that was the first time i knew

00:08:19.598 --> 00:08:23.598
that this is

00:08:20.720 --> 00:08:25.280
really something different what was it

00:08:23.598 --> 00:08:28.800
what was it what was a

00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:31.918
what was it about this reactor that made

00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:31.919
you think that it didn't exist

00:08:32.158 --> 00:08:35.679
technologically well it was the i

00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:37.278
actually have to back up because there

00:08:35.679 --> 00:08:38.838
were some briefings that i read it

00:08:37.278 --> 00:08:40.639
before that

00:08:38.839 --> 00:08:42.560
that

00:08:40.639 --> 00:08:44.000
you know certainly gave me the

00:08:42.559 --> 00:08:45.518
impression that this was going to be a

00:08:44.000 --> 00:08:47.039
weird job but this was the first

00:08:45.519 --> 00:08:49.120
hands-on thing

00:08:47.039 --> 00:08:51.039
this was a small reactor about the size

00:08:49.120 --> 00:08:52.240
of a hemisphere about the size of a

00:08:51.039 --> 00:08:55.838
basketball

00:08:52.240 --> 00:08:57.759
on a metal plate and when it was running

00:08:55.839 --> 00:08:59.519
it produced a gravitational field a

00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:01.600
gravitational field of its own now this

00:08:59.519 --> 00:09:04.720
is something that we can't do we can't

00:09:01.600 --> 00:09:07.360
produce any gravity the only way we get

00:09:04.720 --> 00:09:09.278
gravity is from large quantities of mass

00:09:07.360 --> 00:09:11.600
but there's no machine we can have that

00:09:09.278 --> 00:09:12.480
turns on that makes gravity like

00:09:11.600 --> 00:09:14.720
you know you can turn on an

00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:16.560
electromagnet and it makes a magnetic

00:09:14.720 --> 00:09:19.120
field we can't make a gravitational

00:09:16.559 --> 00:09:21.838
field anyway this device was producing

00:09:19.120 --> 00:09:23.919
that and barry said

00:09:21.839 --> 00:09:26.080
almost like he was bragging go ahead try

00:09:23.919 --> 00:09:27.759
and try and touch the sphere and i i

00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:29.440
couldn't it would it pushed my hands

00:09:27.759 --> 00:09:31.439
away just like two like poles of a

00:09:29.440 --> 00:09:32.720
magnet so that was uh so like when you

00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:34.560
take two magnets and try to press them

00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:36.800
together yeah you have this each other

00:09:34.559 --> 00:09:38.399
yeah kind of cushion feeling but you

00:09:36.799 --> 00:09:39.838
can't you can't get them together the

00:09:38.399 --> 00:09:41.120
closer you put them the more they push

00:09:39.839 --> 00:09:43.120
but then you felt that physically with

00:09:41.120 --> 00:09:44.720
my hand yeah now there's nothing there's

00:09:43.120 --> 00:09:46.639
nothing that does that

00:09:44.720 --> 00:09:49.440
and that immediately caught my attention

00:09:46.639 --> 00:09:51.600
going wow this is something else what

00:09:49.440 --> 00:09:53.680
was your thought like when you felt that

00:09:51.600 --> 00:09:55.920
and you knew that there was nothing that

00:09:53.679 --> 00:09:57.759
you were aware of that could produce

00:09:55.919 --> 00:09:59.120
that connected me to the briefings that

00:09:57.759 --> 00:10:02.958
i read

00:09:59.120 --> 00:10:04.799
on the the first day at s4 was that uh

00:10:02.958 --> 00:10:06.559
you know everything that i had read was

00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:08.000
apparently accurate

00:10:06.559 --> 00:10:11.199
what were you reading

00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:12.639
i read it was kind of an overview

00:10:11.200 --> 00:10:15.040
this project

00:10:12.639 --> 00:10:17.600
was to back engineer

00:10:15.039 --> 00:10:20.000
the alien craft and

00:10:17.600 --> 00:10:22.000
specifically it was to try and back

00:10:20.000 --> 00:10:26.159
engineer and see if we can duplicate the

00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:28.639
technology with available materials

00:10:26.159 --> 00:10:29.838
now to do this they split the project

00:10:28.639 --> 00:10:31.919
into

00:10:29.839 --> 00:10:33.519
you know many different pieces for

00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:36.559
several reasons they do this on all

00:10:33.519 --> 00:10:38.560
classified projects so uh nobody has the

00:10:36.559 --> 00:10:40.719
complete story but uh they

00:10:38.559 --> 00:10:43.039
compartmentalize everything now we had

00:10:40.720 --> 00:10:44.879
the power and propulsion system so what

00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:46.958
the briefings they gave me were like a

00:10:44.879 --> 00:10:49.278
one or two page overview of some of the

00:10:46.958 --> 00:10:51.359
other projects that were going on you

00:10:49.278 --> 00:10:53.439
know on the craft the only reason they

00:10:51.360 --> 00:10:55.759
do that is just in case what you're

00:10:53.440 --> 00:10:57.360
working on is connected intimately in

00:10:55.759 --> 00:10:58.639
some way that we don't know of to one of

00:10:57.360 --> 00:11:02.159
the other projects you have to know

00:10:58.639 --> 00:11:03.919
there excuse me their existence so

00:11:02.159 --> 00:11:05.278
um

00:11:03.919 --> 00:11:08.399
you know i but

00:11:05.278 --> 00:11:11.120
again everything from metallurgy to

00:11:08.399 --> 00:11:13.919
um you know weapon potential the craft

00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:16.399
and these were all you know essentially

00:11:13.919 --> 00:11:19.120
very short briefings but mine was just

00:11:16.399 --> 00:11:21.759
power and propulsion and

00:11:19.120 --> 00:11:23.200
it made it very clear that what i read

00:11:21.759 --> 00:11:25.278
was accurate

00:11:23.200 --> 00:11:28.000
so when you're reading that before you

00:11:25.278 --> 00:11:29.278
actually saw the reactor

00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:32.000
what were your thoughts on what they

00:11:29.278 --> 00:11:32.000
were describing

00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:35.679
if you knew that something like that

00:11:33.919 --> 00:11:36.639
didn't exist

00:11:35.679 --> 00:11:38.078
and they're describing it in the

00:11:36.639 --> 00:11:40.000
briefings

00:11:38.078 --> 00:11:42.479
what did you think you were going to see

00:11:40.000 --> 00:11:44.078
i really i i didn't know at the time i

00:11:42.480 --> 00:11:45.920
mean i was reading i thought is this

00:11:44.078 --> 00:11:46.719
just some kind of test

00:11:45.919 --> 00:11:48.559
um

00:11:46.720 --> 00:11:50.000
see if you're crazy well not to see if

00:11:48.559 --> 00:11:51.838
i'm crazy to

00:11:50.000 --> 00:11:53.919
you know a lot of times they'll take in

00:11:51.839 --> 00:11:54.720
real high security

00:11:53.919 --> 00:11:57.360
uh

00:11:54.720 --> 00:12:00.000
jobs i mean they'll intentionally insert

00:11:57.360 --> 00:12:02.320
nonsense into them um whether it's to

00:12:00.000 --> 00:12:03.679
confuse the fact or if for someone was

00:12:02.320 --> 00:12:05.519
to leak it out

00:12:03.679 --> 00:12:07.439
they would carry that information along

00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:08.399
and know where it came from so

00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:10.880
i

00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:12.879
read through the documents but you know

00:12:10.879 --> 00:12:16.320
i didn't know if this was you know part

00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:18.320
of some kind of test or um

00:12:16.320 --> 00:12:20.000
you know or what or was it potentially

00:12:18.320 --> 00:12:22.160
realistic i mean i really didn't

00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:25.519
consider it being

00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:27.120
all that possible as far as being uh

00:12:25.519 --> 00:12:29.278
the actual thing that i was going to

00:12:27.120 --> 00:12:30.480
work on at the time how did they turn it

00:12:29.278 --> 00:12:32.958
on

00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:34.720
the the reactor yeah the reactor can be

00:12:32.958 --> 00:12:37.278
turned on or turned off in a lot of

00:12:34.720 --> 00:12:40.399
different ways um the way barry showed

00:12:37.278 --> 00:12:42.078
me at the hemisphere is removed

00:12:40.399 --> 00:12:44.159
there's a small tower in the middle when

00:12:42.078 --> 00:12:45.439
you put the hemisphere on the reactor

00:12:44.159 --> 00:12:48.399
activates

00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:51.680
the reactor shuts down it's it's load

00:12:48.399 --> 00:12:53.679
sensing so if there's if there's no load

00:12:51.679 --> 00:12:56.319
on the reactor at all it shuts down when

00:12:53.679 --> 00:12:58.719
there's a load present on it it starts

00:12:56.320 --> 00:13:01.278
up again load meaning

00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:02.959
you can consider it an electrical load

00:13:01.278 --> 00:13:06.078
so

00:13:02.958 --> 00:13:08.239
although it doesn't necessarily operate

00:13:06.078 --> 00:13:10.000
electrically there's no wiring that

00:13:08.240 --> 00:13:11.680
connects any of the sub components

00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:14.720
together whatsoever they just have to be

00:13:11.679 --> 00:13:18.000
in the immediate vicinity it's uh

00:13:14.720 --> 00:13:20.720
it is but the stuff is borderline magic

00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:23.039
and that's essentially where we left it

00:13:20.720 --> 00:13:25.759
you know when i left the project

00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:27.360
so there was no progress made

00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:29.278
there was some progress i mean we did

00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:30.720
identify at least we think some

00:13:29.278 --> 00:13:33.039
processes and

00:13:30.720 --> 00:13:35.200
and had a rough idea we think of what

00:13:33.039 --> 00:13:37.199
was going on but

00:13:35.200 --> 00:13:39.600
i think this is a problem

00:13:37.200 --> 00:13:40.959
that they've had for a long time

00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:43.519
and um

00:13:40.958 --> 00:13:45.599
you know i was replacing somebody

00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:47.679
that barry worked with prior to me and i

00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:49.440
think there was some horrific accident

00:13:47.679 --> 00:13:51.359
that i didn't have a whole lot of

00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:53.040
information on but you know barry

00:13:51.360 --> 00:13:54.879
alluded to that

00:13:53.039 --> 00:13:57.439
horrific accident like where someone

00:13:54.879 --> 00:13:59.120
died or yeah where somebody died because

00:13:57.440 --> 00:14:01.440
they were trying to tamper with things

00:13:59.120 --> 00:14:03.440
or figure out how something worked yeah

00:14:01.440 --> 00:14:05.920
the reactor in particular

00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:07.760
but yeti let you touch it

00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:10.639
yeah i think what they were trying to do

00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:12.399
was cut into one now they had they had

00:14:10.639 --> 00:14:14.159
more than one there and they that was

00:14:12.399 --> 00:14:15.679
supposedly there was an unannounced

00:14:14.159 --> 00:14:16.480
nuclear test

00:14:15.679 --> 00:14:18.559
and

00:14:16.480 --> 00:14:19.680
that's what it was at the time remember

00:14:18.559 --> 00:14:22.799
they would still do an underground

00:14:19.679 --> 00:14:24.638
nuclear test at the test site um but

00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:26.799
from what i understand according to

00:14:24.639 --> 00:14:28.399
barry there was an attempt made now this

00:14:26.799 --> 00:14:30.799
must have been a pretty desperate intent

00:14:28.399 --> 00:14:32.958
because it's not a very scientific

00:14:30.799 --> 00:14:34.639
process to cut you know analyze

00:14:32.958 --> 00:14:36.239
something that way but it looked like

00:14:34.639 --> 00:14:38.159
they used a plasma cutter or something

00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:40.000
like that to cut into an

00:14:38.159 --> 00:14:42.480
operating reactor how many of these

00:14:40.000 --> 00:14:45.039
things did they have they had nine nine

00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:47.920
craft altogether i only got hands on

00:14:45.039 --> 00:14:50.000
with one of them so i can't really

00:14:47.919 --> 00:14:52.399
say what the how the others operated did

00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:54.720
you see the other ones yeah at one time

00:14:52.399 --> 00:14:57.120
and only one time the bay doors that

00:14:54.720 --> 00:14:59.680
between the hangers were all open and i

00:14:57.120 --> 00:15:00.639
could see all the way through

00:14:59.679 --> 00:15:02.479
and

00:15:00.639 --> 00:15:05.278
were they all exactly the same no they

00:15:02.480 --> 00:15:07.680
were all different different shapes yeah

00:15:05.278 --> 00:15:09.360
but they were all from somewhere else

00:15:07.679 --> 00:15:10.239
yeah absolutely

00:15:09.360 --> 00:15:13.519
now

00:15:10.240 --> 00:15:14.799
did anyone make any attempt to explain

00:15:13.519 --> 00:15:17.839
or to

00:15:14.799 --> 00:15:19.838
to tell you where they came from no no

00:15:17.839 --> 00:15:21.519
no one is the least bit interested in

00:15:19.839 --> 00:15:23.120
letting everybody know

00:15:21.519 --> 00:15:25.198
all the facts they want to give you the

00:15:23.120 --> 00:15:27.039
minimum information that's necessary to

00:15:25.198 --> 00:15:28.399
complete your task so

00:15:27.039 --> 00:15:30.559
you're not getting the story of where

00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:32.559
they came from you're not getting the

00:15:30.559 --> 00:15:35.359
story of what how much progress other

00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:37.278
people are making you just focus on

00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:38.480
the small component but they gave you

00:15:37.278 --> 00:15:41.278
some indication that they've been

00:15:38.480 --> 00:15:43.199
working on these for a while yeah

00:15:41.278 --> 00:15:45.039
when do you think they

00:15:43.198 --> 00:15:47.278
acquired these

00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:50.559
i really couldn't say

00:15:47.278 --> 00:15:51.360
i think they've been around for a while

00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:54.399
so

00:15:51.360 --> 00:15:57.278
they bring you into this room you

00:15:54.399 --> 00:15:59.440
see this reactor working you you realize

00:15:57.278 --> 00:16:02.320
this is nothing that as far as like the

00:15:59.440 --> 00:16:05.040
scientific community at current time

00:16:02.320 --> 00:16:06.399
has the ability to create

00:16:05.039 --> 00:16:08.399
we still don't

00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:09.839
what is your life like from that moment

00:16:08.399 --> 00:16:11.759
on is that where everything changes

00:16:09.839 --> 00:16:13.920
because you do you i mean i would

00:16:11.759 --> 00:16:15.919
imagine the moment you actually make

00:16:13.919 --> 00:16:17.519
contact with something that's

00:16:15.919 --> 00:16:19.278
extraterrestrial whether it's an object

00:16:17.519 --> 00:16:22.000
or a being something where you can

00:16:19.278 --> 00:16:23.198
actually absolutely be certain it's not

00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:26.240
from here

00:16:23.198 --> 00:16:28.319
your whole paradigm the whole world you

00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:31.198
live in is now a different place well

00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:33.199
this is the only time it became exciting

00:16:31.198 --> 00:16:34.479
you know the rest of the time the it was

00:16:33.198 --> 00:16:37.039
really

00:16:34.480 --> 00:16:38.399
an ominous feeling being at work but it

00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:41.278
at that time

00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:43.679
it was exciting i mean this was now i

00:16:41.278 --> 00:16:45.838
knew we were on the absolute be actually

00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:46.879
beyond the cutting edge of science and i

00:16:45.839 --> 00:16:49.759
was

00:16:46.879 --> 00:16:52.720
i was so absolutely excited to be there

00:16:49.759 --> 00:16:54.800
every single time i was um

00:16:52.720 --> 00:16:57.839
you know it would this was a fantastic

00:16:54.799 --> 00:16:57.838
opportunity and

00:16:58.000 --> 00:17:04.400
however

00:17:00.320 --> 00:17:06.720
in short order it began to concern me we

00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:07.839
really have no idea what we're talking

00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:09.679
about

00:17:07.838 --> 00:17:12.558
and

00:17:09.679 --> 00:17:14.000
the excitement kind of turned to dread

00:17:12.558 --> 00:17:16.318
at some point

00:17:14.000 --> 00:17:19.838
because the amount of power we're

00:17:16.318 --> 00:17:22.480
dealing with is astronomical i mean to

00:17:19.838 --> 00:17:25.359
affect gravity to produce the effects

00:17:22.480 --> 00:17:29.120
like this equipment does takes huge

00:17:25.359 --> 00:17:30.798
amounts of power and i've given the

00:17:29.119 --> 00:17:32.879
example before of

00:17:30.798 --> 00:17:34.879
you know taking a small portable nuclear

00:17:32.880 --> 00:17:36.799
reactor and you know putting it back

00:17:34.880 --> 00:17:39.520
into victorian times you know with the

00:17:36.798 --> 00:17:41.599
scientists of the time and just dropping

00:17:39.519 --> 00:17:43.918
it in a room and they come and look at

00:17:41.599 --> 00:17:45.678
it and see that it's producing power

00:17:43.919 --> 00:17:47.200
and wonder how it works so they start

00:17:45.679 --> 00:17:48.240
taking it apart

00:17:47.200 --> 00:17:49.440
and

00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:50.960
as soon as they get some of the

00:17:49.440 --> 00:17:52.558
shielding off the people are going to

00:17:50.960 --> 00:17:53.600
drop dead because of the radiation

00:17:52.558 --> 00:17:56.399
inside

00:17:53.599 --> 00:17:58.719
now the people have no idea that

00:17:56.400 --> 00:18:00.400
radiation even exists back then

00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:03.360
but anybody that comes in to check on

00:18:00.400 --> 00:18:04.640
him will also drop dead and

00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:06.558
you know

00:18:04.640 --> 00:18:08.960
there's no reason that that exact

00:18:06.558 --> 00:18:11.759
scenario couldn't happen with what we're

00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:14.480
dealing with we have no idea how the

00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:16.480
physics operate within this thing the

00:18:14.480 --> 00:18:18.558
power levels are are like i said

00:18:16.480 --> 00:18:20.400
astronomic like it's incredibly

00:18:18.558 --> 00:18:21.200
dangerous to tinker with something like

00:18:20.400 --> 00:18:23.679
that

00:18:21.200 --> 00:18:25.519
and you know in some respects we were

00:18:23.679 --> 00:18:28.400
guinea pigs just try to find out how to

00:18:25.519 --> 00:18:29.918
make this thing so they had a series

00:18:28.400 --> 00:18:31.919
as far as you're

00:18:29.919 --> 00:18:33.759
surmised that a series of different

00:18:31.919 --> 00:18:35.280
scientists try to back engineer this

00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:36.960
thing try to figure out what this thing

00:18:35.279 --> 00:18:39.678
was and they would bring in new people

00:18:36.960 --> 00:18:41.279
and like let's throw bob at it yeah yeah

00:18:39.679 --> 00:18:42.880
and they i know i don't know how many

00:18:41.279 --> 00:18:45.678
but i knew there was certainly one

00:18:42.880 --> 00:18:47.679
before me and i knew he died

00:18:45.679 --> 00:18:51.120
during the analysis of the or the

00:18:47.679 --> 00:18:53.440
reactor itself and

00:18:51.119 --> 00:18:54.879
you don't know how many have worked on

00:18:53.440 --> 00:18:56.960
it and no one

00:18:54.880 --> 00:18:58.559
gave this could have been there for

00:18:56.960 --> 00:18:59.919
50 years it could have been there for

00:18:58.558 --> 00:19:02.079
five years when they're giving you

00:18:59.919 --> 00:19:03.038
instructions what are they saying like

00:19:02.079 --> 00:19:04.240
when they're giving you direction

00:19:03.038 --> 00:19:05.919
they're showing you all the stuff like

00:19:04.240 --> 00:19:08.240
what what are they saying what

00:19:05.919 --> 00:19:10.559
specifically what are they asking of you

00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:12.640
well essentially what they ask is is

00:19:10.558 --> 00:19:14.480
what i said all we are just to gather as

00:19:12.640 --> 00:19:16.000
much information as possible find out

00:19:14.480 --> 00:19:18.079
how it operates and see if we can

00:19:16.000 --> 00:19:20.798
duplicate it so but they always realize

00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:24.079
you where it was from they never let you

00:19:20.798 --> 00:19:25.038
ask questions about where it's from well

00:19:24.079 --> 00:19:26.798
if

00:19:25.038 --> 00:19:29.119
the information i read in the briefings

00:19:26.798 --> 00:19:29.839
was accurate now what i do have to say

00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:32.159
is

00:19:29.839 --> 00:19:33.759
the information that pertained directly

00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:36.960
to the reactor

00:19:33.759 --> 00:19:38.480
was accurate what i read

00:19:36.960 --> 00:19:41.679
did

00:19:38.480 --> 00:19:42.960
i mean did jive with reality um in terms

00:19:41.679 --> 00:19:45.280
of how

00:19:42.960 --> 00:19:48.480
in terms of how it was made how what we

00:19:45.279 --> 00:19:50.240
saw how it operated the materials how it

00:19:48.480 --> 00:19:52.558
you know turned on and what was

00:19:50.240 --> 00:19:54.160
discovered uh

00:19:52.558 --> 00:19:56.079
discovered about it

00:19:54.160 --> 00:19:58.320
i'm sorry the migraine is really making

00:19:56.079 --> 00:20:00.000
it hard for me to thank you sorry no

00:19:58.319 --> 00:20:01.439
we talked that before the podcast you

00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:02.880
tell her buddy bob is getting a migraine

00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:03.919
i know you're very stressed out by this

00:20:02.880 --> 00:20:05.360
which is one of the reasons why i

00:20:03.919 --> 00:20:07.120
appreciate you doing this

00:20:05.359 --> 00:20:08.719
um

00:20:07.119 --> 00:20:10.399
where was i already we were talking oh

00:20:08.720 --> 00:20:11.919
right yeah explained it

00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:15.120
and uh

00:20:11.919 --> 00:20:17.280
so there was some paperwork that

00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:20.639
indicated that this was from the zeta

00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:24.079
reticuli star system now

00:20:20.640 --> 00:20:26.400
yeah now how they obtain that i haven't

00:20:24.079 --> 00:20:28.158
i haven't the slightest idea but it

00:20:26.400 --> 00:20:29.759
wasn't just from the zeta reticuli star

00:20:28.159 --> 00:20:32.240
system it was

00:20:29.759 --> 00:20:35.679
what they called zr3 so it was a third

00:20:32.240 --> 00:20:37.679
planet in that star system so

00:20:35.679 --> 00:20:39.759
there was no other information about it

00:20:37.679 --> 00:20:41.840
other than that supposedly where the

00:20:39.759 --> 00:20:43.279
craft came from now is that true i don't

00:20:41.839 --> 00:20:45.119
know i have no way of verifying that but

00:20:43.279 --> 00:20:47.839
that was printed in the same materials

00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:50.158
that referenced the reactor now i looked

00:20:47.839 --> 00:20:51.359
that stuff up when i went home

00:20:50.159 --> 00:20:54.720
and

00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:56.959
zeta reticular is a binary star

00:20:54.720 --> 00:20:58.319
two stars that orbit orbit one another

00:20:56.960 --> 00:21:00.000
and it's only visible in the southern

00:20:58.319 --> 00:21:02.639
hemisphere and it's about thirty some

00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:04.240
odd light years away so that's literally

00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:06.480
all the information i have about that i

00:21:04.240 --> 00:21:08.400
don't know how they found out it came

00:21:06.480 --> 00:21:10.720
from there and you also probably have

00:21:08.400 --> 00:21:12.159
some suspicions that they give you some

00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:15.600
disinformation like you were talking

00:21:12.159 --> 00:21:17.360
about before they would yeah yeah to

00:21:15.599 --> 00:21:19.038
i mean if you ever decided to talk about

00:21:17.359 --> 00:21:21.759
this they added a bunch of nonsense to

00:21:19.038 --> 00:21:24.158
make whatever is factual look ridiculous

00:21:21.759 --> 00:21:26.000
right or be able to trace it down like

00:21:24.159 --> 00:21:28.080
hey this facts came out and you know

00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:30.480
this lazar guy said it you know came

00:21:28.079 --> 00:21:32.960
from zeta reticulate so they knew it was

00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:36.319
when we read zeta reticulate we're like

00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:37.919
what in the [ __ ] is this well reading

00:21:36.319 --> 00:21:39.678
all of this stuff it was what in the

00:21:37.919 --> 00:21:40.640
[ __ ] is this you're like why did i sign

00:21:39.679 --> 00:21:41.519
up for this

00:21:40.640 --> 00:21:43.600
no no

00:21:41.519 --> 00:21:45.759
to me this was cool this is interesting

00:21:43.599 --> 00:21:47.519
i said i was just excited to be out in a

00:21:45.759 --> 00:21:49.359
secure area you know in the middle of

00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:50.720
the desert i said this is awesome how

00:21:49.359 --> 00:21:53.199
old are you

00:21:50.720 --> 00:21:54.720
i get as in my 20s

00:21:53.200 --> 00:21:56.798
yeah so you're probably

00:21:54.720 --> 00:21:59.440
totally geeked out oh yeah

00:21:56.798 --> 00:22:01.200
this was this was great i mean i i was

00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:02.798
excited so i didn't care

00:22:01.200 --> 00:22:04.240
reading through everything and so you

00:22:02.798 --> 00:22:05.599
read through all the zeta reticuli thing

00:22:04.240 --> 00:22:07.359
but then when you see the actual

00:22:05.599 --> 00:22:10.079
starship with the little american flag

00:22:07.359 --> 00:22:12.959
sticker on it well that was

00:22:10.079 --> 00:22:14.480
was that later or before

00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:17.120
that

00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:18.798
that was before so before so you see the

00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:20.319
thing before and you say oh this is

00:22:18.798 --> 00:22:22.960
where what's that before

00:22:20.319 --> 00:22:24.399
hard so many years yeah i can't

00:22:22.960 --> 00:22:26.319
either way it doesn't matter the days

00:22:24.400 --> 00:22:28.798
have fused together it's so hard to

00:22:26.319 --> 00:22:30.158
separate what happened in each visit do

00:22:28.798 --> 00:22:32.400
you remember the thought process when

00:22:30.159 --> 00:22:34.960
you read that it's from zeta reticuli

00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:37.038
yeah it it it it didn't hit me like a

00:22:34.960 --> 00:22:38.400
ton of bricks or anything it's just like

00:22:37.038 --> 00:22:40.319
yeah okay

00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:42.080
you think it was [ __ ] i don't know

00:22:40.319 --> 00:22:44.240
this is where i don't know now i don't i

00:22:42.079 --> 00:22:45.839
mean because when i read it i hadn't

00:22:44.240 --> 00:22:47.839
verified anything and this was just a

00:22:45.839 --> 00:22:49.199
bunch of stuff i was reading and i

00:22:47.839 --> 00:22:50.879
thought maybe after this they're just

00:22:49.200 --> 00:22:53.519
going to give me a test and see what i

00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:55.760
can remember in right crazy information

00:22:53.519 --> 00:22:57.839
and it would but

00:22:55.759 --> 00:22:59.359
like i said when i finally

00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:01.199
went in with barry

00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:02.879
um

00:23:01.200 --> 00:23:04.640
and had hands-on

00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:05.679
experience with what they were talking

00:23:04.640 --> 00:23:07.280
about

00:23:05.679 --> 00:23:09.759
it taught on a completely different

00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:10.798
meaning so there's a plate there's this

00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:12.960
thing that looks like a half a

00:23:10.798 --> 00:23:14.720
basketball and when it's on you can't

00:23:12.960 --> 00:23:16.558
come anywhere near it you can't touch it

00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:17.679
right how is

00:23:16.558 --> 00:23:20.000
what is

00:23:17.679 --> 00:23:21.519
gravity about that like the the concept

00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:22.960
of gravity to most people gravity is

00:23:21.519 --> 00:23:25.119
bringing something towards it right well

00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:28.240
i guess you would say it's anti-gravity

00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:29.839
it's gravity shifted 180 degrees it's uh

00:23:28.240 --> 00:23:31.200
you know

00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:34.319
anti-gravity

00:23:31.200 --> 00:23:36.720
and did they have any understanding

00:23:34.319 --> 00:23:38.000
about what could possibly create this

00:23:36.720 --> 00:23:39.440
effect

00:23:38.000 --> 00:23:42.558
did they have any

00:23:39.440 --> 00:23:45.038
areas where they'd like you to look into

00:23:42.558 --> 00:23:45.038
no they

00:23:46.079 --> 00:23:50.079
well

00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:52.079
they knew there was a fuel source in it

00:23:50.079 --> 00:23:53.918
and they were proficient

00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:55.759
at making it work

00:23:53.919 --> 00:23:58.080
and again my analogy to something like

00:23:55.759 --> 00:23:59.839
this is you can drop a motorcycle off in

00:23:58.079 --> 00:24:01.918
the wagon train days and just leave it

00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:04.000
with the keys parked outside you know

00:24:01.919 --> 00:24:05.679
somebody's place everybody will come

00:24:04.000 --> 00:24:07.679
around it and they'll poke and prod and

00:24:05.679 --> 00:24:09.840
eventually they'll turn the key get it

00:24:07.679 --> 00:24:10.880
to start and become proficient at

00:24:09.839 --> 00:24:13.599
writing it

00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:15.440
yeah but they won't be able to

00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:17.519
understand what the hell's going on they

00:24:15.440 --> 00:24:19.360
won't be able to make the plastic fender

00:24:17.519 --> 00:24:21.759
much less anything else and i think

00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:23.359
that's exactly the state we were at we

00:24:21.759 --> 00:24:25.278
played around with the parts long enough

00:24:23.359 --> 00:24:27.918
before i got there where they could make

00:24:25.278 --> 00:24:30.480
the reactor operate

00:24:27.919 --> 00:24:32.559
take the fuel out and know that it makes

00:24:30.480 --> 00:24:35.360
it work

00:24:32.558 --> 00:24:36.960
how exactly what was going on

00:24:35.359 --> 00:24:39.918
in the reactor

00:24:36.960 --> 00:24:42.720
remained a mystery at the time

00:24:39.919 --> 00:24:45.440
i think we made some progress on

00:24:42.720 --> 00:24:47.519
what was going on inside but i don't

00:24:45.440 --> 00:24:49.600
think anybody really knew anything they

00:24:47.519 --> 00:24:52.319
could just watch what was going on and

00:24:49.599 --> 00:24:54.719
make note of it how long were you there

00:24:52.319 --> 00:24:56.558
i'd say about six months or so and what

00:24:54.720 --> 00:24:57.759
what progress was made while you were

00:24:56.558 --> 00:25:01.759
there

00:24:57.759 --> 00:25:03.759
well we came up with a bunch of

00:25:01.759 --> 00:25:05.359
reasonably good ideas about how the

00:25:03.759 --> 00:25:08.079
reactor worked

00:25:05.359 --> 00:25:10.000
and one of them was the base the square

00:25:08.079 --> 00:25:11.839
base of it was essentially like a

00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.640
cyclotron which is a small particle

00:25:11.839 --> 00:25:16.158
accelerator a circular one particle

00:25:14.640 --> 00:25:18.640
accelerators linear particle

00:25:16.159 --> 00:25:20.080
accelerators are just a you know

00:25:18.640 --> 00:25:21.759
long tube essentially and they

00:25:20.079 --> 00:25:23.918
accelerate particles with high voltage

00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:26.240
and you know radio frequencies till they

00:25:23.919 --> 00:25:29.600
reach high speeds but a cyclotron does

00:25:26.240 --> 00:25:31.359
that in a smaller circular area and

00:25:29.599 --> 00:25:34.158
there is this

00:25:31.359 --> 00:25:35.759
very heavy element fuel element 115

00:25:34.159 --> 00:25:36.720
something that wasn't on our periodic

00:25:35.759 --> 00:25:39.759
charts

00:25:36.720 --> 00:25:42.159
at the time but it is now it is now yeah

00:25:39.759 --> 00:25:44.079
when did it become on the periodic table

00:25:42.159 --> 00:25:46.400
now the way the charts now you know i

00:25:44.079 --> 00:25:47.918
don't remember do you remember when they

00:25:46.400 --> 00:25:49.840
2004

00:25:47.919 --> 00:25:51.759
durhamstat germany i think is where they

00:25:49.839 --> 00:25:54.079
first fabricated four atoms they lasted

00:25:51.759 --> 00:25:56.480
220 milliseconds with the atoms it's

00:25:54.079 --> 00:25:57.759
nothing right and then it later was

00:25:56.480 --> 00:25:59.759
discovered a couple more times they

00:25:57.759 --> 00:26:01.519
could fabricate it then they gave it

00:25:59.759 --> 00:26:03.359
they gave it a place then on the

00:26:01.519 --> 00:26:06.240
periodic chart after that called it

00:26:03.359 --> 00:26:08.839
muscovium so they told you about this

00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:12.880
stuff in

00:26:08.839 --> 00:26:16.000
1982 yeah well we can 82 what what year

00:26:12.880 --> 00:26:18.000
was this it was 88 and 89 when i was

00:26:16.000 --> 00:26:21.278
there 82 is one 82 was when you're in

00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:22.640
los alamos i'm sorry yeah so 88.89 they

00:26:21.278 --> 00:26:24.400
told you about this stuff so this was

00:26:22.640 --> 00:26:26.320
not like no they didn't they didn't tell

00:26:24.400 --> 00:26:28.240
me about it that's one of the things

00:26:26.319 --> 00:26:30.480
that this group came up with

00:26:28.240 --> 00:26:31.679
the um

00:26:30.480 --> 00:26:33.440
um

00:26:31.679 --> 00:26:34.480
i keep losing my train of thought with

00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:37.679
this thing

00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:41.038
so this one area this

00:26:37.679 --> 00:26:44.400
this element 115 was the fuel yeah it

00:26:41.038 --> 00:26:44.400
was the fuel um

00:26:50.960 --> 00:26:54.319
the the world will forgive you for

00:26:52.480 --> 00:26:55.599
having a migraine i can i just it's

00:26:54.319 --> 00:26:57.119
really hard to think throughout this

00:26:55.599 --> 00:26:58.558
case

00:26:57.119 --> 00:27:00.879
i just want to say one yeah definitely

00:26:58.558 --> 00:27:02.480
as i said one thing you know but for the

00:27:00.880 --> 00:27:04.159
last 30 years

00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:05.919
people have just been on the attack on

00:27:04.159 --> 00:27:08.240
bob you know getting to know him the

00:27:05.919 --> 00:27:10.080
personal effects on his life it's really

00:27:08.240 --> 00:27:11.599
hard to understand unless you meet his

00:27:10.079 --> 00:27:13.599
family and his wife

00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:16.000
i mean this is the last thing he wanted

00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:17.839
to [ __ ] do was have to talk yeah we

00:27:16.000 --> 00:27:19.119
should explain that jeremy you and i had

00:27:17.839 --> 00:27:20.639
this conversation i watched your

00:27:19.119 --> 00:27:23.119
documentary

00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:25.200
we had this conversation and i said i

00:27:23.119 --> 00:27:27.839
have to talk to him yeah the document

00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:29.278
there's there's been detractors there's

00:27:27.839 --> 00:27:30.639
been a bunch of people that called

00:27:29.278 --> 00:27:33.119
[ __ ] on many of the things that

00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:35.759
you've said but over time

00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:38.639
many of the things that you talked about

00:27:35.759 --> 00:27:40.400
even in the 80s have proven to be true

00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:42.960
things that people said were not true

00:27:40.400 --> 00:27:44.480
were proven to be true element 115 was

00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:46.558
one of them

00:27:44.480 --> 00:27:50.000
right right right

00:27:46.558 --> 00:27:51.519
element 115 the fuel they had was stable

00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:54.398
in other words it didn't decay it wasn't

00:27:51.519 --> 00:27:57.519
emitting radioactivity um when they

00:27:54.398 --> 00:28:00.319
synthesized the two or three atoms of

00:27:57.519 --> 00:28:02.798
the 115 uh it did decay

00:28:00.319 --> 00:28:04.000
and it was not a stable element so

00:28:02.798 --> 00:28:06.000
they're they're kind of two different

00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:07.359
things but this is kind of typical

00:28:06.000 --> 00:28:09.599
elements

00:28:07.359 --> 00:28:12.479
always have or pretty much always have

00:28:09.599 --> 00:28:14.879
uh stable isotopes and unstable isotopes

00:28:12.480 --> 00:28:17.759
like i think cesium has like

00:28:14.880 --> 00:28:19.278
30 unstable isotopes to it so all right

00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:22.398
well hydrogen for example you're

00:28:19.278 --> 00:28:24.558
familiar with hydrogen gas

00:28:22.398 --> 00:28:28.000
it's stable it's not radioactive but

00:28:24.558 --> 00:28:30.960
there's also two other types of hydrogen

00:28:28.000 --> 00:28:33.119
deuterium and tritium and deuterium

00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:35.440
isn't radioactive it's another

00:28:33.119 --> 00:28:38.079
stable isotope hydrogen but tritium is

00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:39.360
radioactive now they're all hydrogen but

00:28:38.079 --> 00:28:42.480
they just have a different amounts of

00:28:39.359 --> 00:28:45.199
neutrons so it's the same thing with

00:28:42.480 --> 00:28:48.558
other elements n element 115. depending

00:28:45.200 --> 00:28:48.558
on the amount of neutrons it has

00:28:48.640 --> 00:28:55.520
designates the isotope but it's 115 they

00:28:52.079 --> 00:28:58.639
will continue to take

00:28:55.519 --> 00:28:59.839
or experiment and try and make 115 at

00:28:58.640 --> 00:29:01.440
different isotopes and i'm sure

00:28:59.839 --> 00:29:04.000
eventually they'll come up with a stable

00:29:01.440 --> 00:29:05.600
version but it's the stable version that

00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:08.558
has the properties that we're talking

00:29:05.599 --> 00:29:10.480
about so they somehow or another had

00:29:08.558 --> 00:29:12.000
acquired a stable version did they say

00:29:10.480 --> 00:29:13.759
that the stable version had come with

00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:17.440
this craft it absolutely came with the

00:29:13.759 --> 00:29:19.679
graft yeah so at the time you having a

00:29:17.440 --> 00:29:21.278
firm knowledge of the periodic chart and

00:29:19.679 --> 00:29:23.679
knowing what was real and what wasn't

00:29:21.278 --> 00:29:26.480
real what was your reaction to having

00:29:23.679 --> 00:29:28.240
this stable element 115 that wasn't even

00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:30.880
supposed to exist well everything was

00:29:28.240 --> 00:29:33.440
impossible right i mean down down to the

00:29:30.880 --> 00:29:36.399
metal i i did get a chance

00:29:33.440 --> 00:29:40.320
uh to look inside the craft on only one

00:29:36.398 --> 00:29:42.239
occasion and this was important because

00:29:40.319 --> 00:29:43.839
where the reactor sat

00:29:42.240 --> 00:29:46.079
might have been critical to how it

00:29:43.839 --> 00:29:47.918
operated since everything operates

00:29:46.079 --> 00:29:50.000
without any interconnection so the

00:29:47.919 --> 00:29:52.480
placement of components might be

00:29:50.000 --> 00:29:55.119
critical so they allowed me to go inside

00:29:52.480 --> 00:29:56.159
and and look at it

00:29:55.119 --> 00:29:58.079
um

00:29:56.159 --> 00:30:00.880
dude again i forgot where the hell i am

00:29:58.079 --> 00:30:02.319
so you're going into this craft and what

00:30:00.880 --> 00:30:05.840
are you thinking when you're inside of

00:30:02.319 --> 00:30:09.519
it like what are you seeing it's um

00:30:05.839 --> 00:30:11.599
it's a very ominous feeling because it's

00:30:09.519 --> 00:30:13.599
there are no at first of all everything

00:30:11.599 --> 00:30:14.558
is one color it's like a dark pewter

00:30:13.599 --> 00:30:17.918
color

00:30:14.558 --> 00:30:20.240
and there are no right angles anywhere

00:30:17.919 --> 00:30:23.120
it's as if somebody took uh i've said

00:30:20.240 --> 00:30:23.759
this before somebody took a a model out

00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:26.000
of

00:30:23.759 --> 00:30:27.839
and fashioned it out of wax and then

00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:29.519
heated it just for a short time so

00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:31.199
everything melted everything looks like

00:30:29.519 --> 00:30:34.639
it's fused together everything has a

00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:37.919
radius of curvature where two uh items

00:30:34.640 --> 00:30:38.960
meet it's uh it's a really weird looking

00:30:37.919 --> 00:30:41.278
thing

00:30:38.960 --> 00:30:42.640
but um

00:30:41.278 --> 00:30:44.558
uh

00:30:42.640 --> 00:30:47.840
there was almost nothing

00:30:44.558 --> 00:30:48.798
other than a small foldable hatchway

00:30:47.839 --> 00:30:51.119
that

00:30:48.798 --> 00:30:52.398
that looked recognizable everything was

00:30:51.119 --> 00:30:54.319
uh

00:30:52.398 --> 00:30:57.678
was really unworldly

00:30:54.319 --> 00:30:59.439
depicting it a way to describe it so you

00:30:57.679 --> 00:31:01.038
you get inside this thing and it's

00:30:59.440 --> 00:31:02.640
designed for something that's much

00:31:01.038 --> 00:31:04.079
smaller than a human being yeah you

00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:05.600
can't really stand up till you get to

00:31:04.079 --> 00:31:06.319
the very center of it and how tall are

00:31:05.599 --> 00:31:08.959
you

00:31:06.319 --> 00:31:11.359
i'm 5 10. and what do you think this was

00:31:08.960 --> 00:31:13.600
designed for i'd say something close to

00:31:11.359 --> 00:31:14.879
half my height wow

00:31:13.599 --> 00:31:16.959
so these little

00:31:14.880 --> 00:31:19.360
three foot tallish creatures

00:31:16.960 --> 00:31:21.440
yeah and the the seats were small too i

00:31:19.359 --> 00:31:25.359
mean obviously it was made you know for

00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:27.519
something something small but there's no

00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:29.839
like there's there's nothing else in

00:31:27.519 --> 00:31:31.599
there there's just seats the reactor and

00:31:29.839 --> 00:31:33.519
some of the sub components there's no

00:31:31.599 --> 00:31:35.199
there's no control panels there's no

00:31:33.519 --> 00:31:38.398
bathroom there's no

00:31:35.200 --> 00:31:40.720
no decorative uh components or artwork

00:31:38.398 --> 00:31:43.439
or anything that you would recognize or

00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:46.960
trim i mean it's just a very bare bones

00:31:43.440 --> 00:31:49.519
thing you're not seeing any screens

00:31:46.960 --> 00:31:51.440
well there are archways around it that

00:31:49.519 --> 00:31:52.640
are part of the superstructure

00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:54.880
and

00:31:52.640 --> 00:31:56.559
that one of the archways can become

00:31:54.880 --> 00:31:58.159
transparent

00:31:56.558 --> 00:32:01.839
when i was in there there was another

00:31:58.159 --> 00:32:04.000
group working on one of the archways and

00:32:01.839 --> 00:32:04.959
you could call that a screen more or

00:32:04.000 --> 00:32:07.599
less

00:32:04.960 --> 00:32:10.640
so through that archway it would be it

00:32:07.599 --> 00:32:11.759
would maintain the solidity the the

00:32:10.640 --> 00:32:14.080
solid

00:32:11.759 --> 00:32:16.798
whatever metal it was yeah but you could

00:32:14.079 --> 00:32:18.879
yeah it just became transparent yeah i

00:32:16.798 --> 00:32:20.398
saw that happen once or twice before i

00:32:18.880 --> 00:32:22.240
left did you ask any questions about

00:32:20.398 --> 00:32:23.918
what the phone no there's no there's no

00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.599
asking questions no

00:32:23.919 --> 00:32:27.759
but when you watch something become

00:32:25.599 --> 00:32:29.278
transparent and you realize it's still

00:32:27.759 --> 00:32:31.679
there but you could now see through it

00:32:29.278 --> 00:32:33.359
yeah i mean now that's not that

00:32:31.679 --> 00:32:35.519
impressive we do have some liquid

00:32:33.359 --> 00:32:37.678
crystal materials that are like that

00:32:35.519 --> 00:32:39.519
you know they are seen in smart glass

00:32:37.679 --> 00:32:41.679
yeah they call it smart glass so this is

00:32:39.519 --> 00:32:42.720
just uh and i don't know if the craft is

00:32:41.679 --> 00:32:45.278
made of

00:32:42.720 --> 00:32:47.200
you know an advanced metal or a ceramic

00:32:45.278 --> 00:32:49.359
it was cold to the touch

00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:50.960
so um you know i would lean in more

00:32:49.359 --> 00:32:52.240
towards the metal you're not allowed to

00:32:50.960 --> 00:32:54.798
ask questions

00:32:52.240 --> 00:32:57.519
no the only there they work on the buddy

00:32:54.798 --> 00:32:59.278
system so i can only exchange ideas and

00:32:57.519 --> 00:33:02.159
talk to barry

00:32:59.278 --> 00:33:03.599
now this really interferes with science

00:33:02.159 --> 00:33:05.919
because science is based on free

00:33:03.599 --> 00:33:08.079
discussion and ideally you get a bunch

00:33:05.919 --> 00:33:09.600
of guys together exchange ideas work on

00:33:08.079 --> 00:33:10.398
problems and that's how things move

00:33:09.599 --> 00:33:13.278
forward

00:33:10.398 --> 00:33:16.158
but they're so over the top concerned

00:33:13.278 --> 00:33:17.200
about security they split everything off

00:33:16.159 --> 00:33:20.640
and

00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:23.360
everybody becomes stagnant it it

00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:26.399
it just destroys any of the progress you

00:33:23.359 --> 00:33:28.319
can make or at least makes it go so slow

00:33:26.398 --> 00:33:30.239
um they i think they wind up shooting

00:33:28.319 --> 00:33:31.439
themselves in the foot which is probably

00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:33.519
why they

00:33:31.440 --> 00:33:35.919
arrived at this bottleneck that they

00:33:33.519 --> 00:33:37.759
needed to get this madman with a jet

00:33:35.919 --> 00:33:39.360
powered honda to come in and see what he

00:33:37.759 --> 00:33:41.200
could do i think that was an act of

00:33:39.359 --> 00:33:43.038
desperation i think they wanted someone

00:33:41.200 --> 00:33:45.120
that thinks out of the box and let's

00:33:43.038 --> 00:33:47.119
just give this guy a try here because

00:33:45.119 --> 00:33:47.918
they weren't and uh they might have done

00:33:47.119 --> 00:33:50.558
this

00:33:47.919 --> 00:33:52.080
four more times since uh you know up to

00:33:50.558 --> 00:33:54.158
the point in time today assuming they're

00:33:52.079 --> 00:33:57.439
still working on this thing

00:33:54.159 --> 00:33:59.440
and when you see this craft and you're

00:33:57.440 --> 00:34:01.759
inside was there any

00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:04.240
indication that there was an area that

00:34:01.759 --> 00:34:06.480
they would use to control it to pilot

00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:08.398
was there a pilot seat

00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:11.039
was there's there were three seats they

00:34:08.398 --> 00:34:12.638
sat around uh the reactor was in the

00:34:11.039 --> 00:34:14.800
dead center of it

00:34:12.639 --> 00:34:16.320
and then equidistant around there were

00:34:14.800 --> 00:34:19.519
three seats

00:34:16.320 --> 00:34:21.599
so and that's all there was a a large

00:34:19.519 --> 00:34:24.960
you would they're not consoles there are

00:34:21.599 --> 00:34:27.838
large rectangular objects also spaced

00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:29.280
equidistant around the center um there's

00:34:27.838 --> 00:34:31.119
nothing on them there's no buttons

00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:33.359
there's no lights and they control the

00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:34.879
same color everything is the same color

00:34:33.358 --> 00:34:36.559
different shape right

00:34:34.878 --> 00:34:38.239
and um

00:34:36.559 --> 00:34:41.199
directly underneath them there's three

00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:43.358
levels in the craft uh the main level is

00:34:41.199 --> 00:34:44.638
what we're talking about directly under

00:34:43.358 --> 00:34:46.559
that

00:34:44.639 --> 00:34:48.960
those are the gravity amplifiers the big

00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:51.440
rectangular objects underneath them are

00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:53.119
the gravity emitters that look like for

00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:55.760
lack of a better word a trash can

00:34:53.119 --> 00:34:58.079
hanging on a pipe three of those and

00:34:55.760 --> 00:35:00.160
then the top layer

00:34:58.079 --> 00:35:02.400
i this is just my personal belief i

00:35:00.159 --> 00:35:04.399
think that has to do with a

00:35:02.400 --> 00:35:08.240
a navigation or their version of a

00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:10.160
computer uh with some planar panels

00:35:08.239 --> 00:35:11.919
sensor panels around the craft that we

00:35:10.159 --> 00:35:14.159
would call portholes but they're not

00:35:11.920 --> 00:35:16.800
portholes they're just black areas and i

00:35:14.159 --> 00:35:18.719
think that just determines its

00:35:16.800 --> 00:35:21.519
you know position in space

00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:24.559
but i was i i physically was in the

00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:26.320
center section and i stuck my torso in

00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:27.599
the bottom section and hung upside down

00:35:26.320 --> 00:35:29.519
so i could see

00:35:27.599 --> 00:35:30.400
how the gravity amplifiers were

00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:32.239
positioned

00:35:30.400 --> 00:35:34.480
what is the the roughly the size of this

00:35:32.239 --> 00:35:37.519
thing it's a i think it

00:35:34.480 --> 00:35:40.159
i don't remember from being there but um

00:35:37.519 --> 00:35:42.000
after all this stuff was over i had uh

00:35:40.159 --> 00:35:44.319
john andrews a guy from the testers

00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:47.280
model corporation and you know we sat

00:35:44.320 --> 00:35:48.559
down and tried to figure out from what i

00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:49.680
saw

00:35:48.559 --> 00:35:51.759
um

00:35:49.679 --> 00:35:54.639
and known sizes of things and we came up

00:35:51.760 --> 00:35:56.720
with 52 feet in diameter

00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:59.519
so i think that's really small yeah so i

00:35:56.719 --> 00:36:00.959
think that's a fair a reasonable guess

00:35:59.519 --> 00:36:02.960
now you said there's nine of them and

00:36:00.960 --> 00:36:05.440
you got a brief glimpse at the other

00:36:02.960 --> 00:36:06.480
ones were they how are they different

00:36:05.440 --> 00:36:08.000
oh

00:36:06.480 --> 00:36:10.400
they looked completely different one

00:36:08.000 --> 00:36:12.719
looked like i called it jello mold and

00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:14.800
it it looked like a classic jello mold

00:36:12.719 --> 00:36:16.559
with the rippled sides to it one was a

00:36:14.800 --> 00:36:18.800
very flat disc

00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:20.239
um

00:36:18.800 --> 00:36:22.160
you know like a

00:36:20.239 --> 00:36:24.159
oh i don't like a straw hat or something

00:36:22.159 --> 00:36:27.199
like that that was sitting up on its

00:36:24.159 --> 00:36:30.480
edge and the thin part of it had looked

00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:32.319
like a projectile had been fired through

00:36:30.480 --> 00:36:34.639
the edge of it so i don't know if they

00:36:32.320 --> 00:36:37.359
were attempting to see if the metal

00:36:34.639 --> 00:36:38.400
could be penetrated or if something or

00:36:37.358 --> 00:36:40.000
if that's

00:36:38.400 --> 00:36:42.800
where the thing came from maybe it was

00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:44.719
shot down um but that was the only one

00:36:42.800 --> 00:36:46.720
where i saw there was you know actual

00:36:44.719 --> 00:36:49.039
physical damage to it

00:36:46.719 --> 00:36:50.639
and that one was roughly the same size

00:36:49.039 --> 00:36:52.880
they're all uh they were kind of too far

00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:54.639
away to tell

00:36:52.880 --> 00:36:56.400
and did

00:36:54.639 --> 00:36:57.759
there was several teams that were

00:36:56.400 --> 00:36:59.119
working on the propulsion system so

00:36:57.760 --> 00:37:01.839
there was different teams that were

00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:05.280
working on these different aircrafts i i

00:37:01.838 --> 00:37:06.799
don't know i could only assume

00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:08.400
now when you're

00:37:06.800 --> 00:37:10.720
sitting in this thing

00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:12.720
and you're looking at this

00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:14.559
otherworldly craft

00:37:12.719 --> 00:37:17.039
your your goal is to try to figure out

00:37:14.559 --> 00:37:19.599
how this thing functions your goal is to

00:37:17.039 --> 00:37:21.599
try to figure out how this reactor

00:37:19.599 --> 00:37:23.200
i mean but you would imagine they would

00:37:21.599 --> 00:37:25.680
give you more time than just one day to

00:37:23.199 --> 00:37:26.879
check that out oh yeah it wasn't one day

00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:29.440
right

00:37:26.880 --> 00:37:31.760
yeah i mean this is barry was there

00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:33.358
i think barry was sleeping there i'm

00:37:31.760 --> 00:37:35.040
sure they had now

00:37:33.358 --> 00:37:36.639
that that isn't weird i mean up at the

00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:40.159
toenap test range where they work on

00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:42.480
stealth fighters you know you go i think

00:37:40.159 --> 00:37:44.239
three weeks on one week off and you stay

00:37:42.480 --> 00:37:46.880
up there too so it's not weird to stay

00:37:44.239 --> 00:37:48.719
up at the test site right so um yeah i

00:37:46.880 --> 00:37:50.720
think he pretty much didn't he acted

00:37:48.719 --> 00:37:52.239
like he's been up there for a long time

00:37:50.719 --> 00:37:54.879
yeah um

00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:57.199
but he's still there yeah who knows do

00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:59.920
you do you have contact with this guy no

00:37:57.199 --> 00:38:03.039
oh no i wish i did i kind of thought he

00:37:59.920 --> 00:38:06.400
was going to come out after i did right

00:38:03.039 --> 00:38:09.039
and i think i took so much flack and

00:38:06.400 --> 00:38:11.039
it's so much [ __ ] for what went on

00:38:09.039 --> 00:38:13.279
i think i actually i wound up helping

00:38:11.039 --> 00:38:15.519
security there and everybody became

00:38:13.280 --> 00:38:17.119
afraid of you know doing or saying

00:38:15.519 --> 00:38:20.079
anything after that

00:38:17.119 --> 00:38:21.760
so what kind of reports did you have to

00:38:20.079 --> 00:38:22.960
give like so you're not making much

00:38:21.760 --> 00:38:24.320
progress right you're just trying to

00:38:22.960 --> 00:38:26.639
figure out what this thing is and it

00:38:24.320 --> 00:38:28.800
seems impossible so well we didn't

00:38:26.639 --> 00:38:31.039
personally make them i mean we were

00:38:28.800 --> 00:38:32.400
always there was never a lot of

00:38:31.039 --> 00:38:34.639
information

00:38:32.400 --> 00:38:35.760
that we gained um

00:38:34.639 --> 00:38:37.358
the guy

00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:39.280
you would call him our supervisor his

00:38:37.358 --> 00:38:42.319
name was dennis mariani

00:38:39.280 --> 00:38:44.880
and kind of a military looking guy and

00:38:42.320 --> 00:38:47.680
he would routinely pop in you know

00:38:44.880 --> 00:38:50.240
during the day and you know hey what's

00:38:47.679 --> 00:38:52.480
going on guys and he would essentially

00:38:50.239 --> 00:38:54.000
relay any information anything new we

00:38:52.480 --> 00:38:56.480
came up with i mean he was our

00:38:54.000 --> 00:38:58.320
go-between you know where we presented

00:38:56.480 --> 00:38:59.679
him the information then he took it to

00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:00.559
wherever they were

00:38:59.679 --> 00:39:02.399
you know

00:39:00.559 --> 00:39:04.480
assembling all the data from everybody

00:39:02.400 --> 00:39:06.400
no i assume you're working normal days

00:39:04.480 --> 00:39:07.119
like an eight-hour day no

00:39:06.400 --> 00:39:09.760
no

00:39:07.119 --> 00:39:11.519
no it was really weird that i would be

00:39:09.760 --> 00:39:13.680
only called in on certain times and

00:39:11.519 --> 00:39:15.199
certain days and they would be weird

00:39:13.679 --> 00:39:16.719
hours too

00:39:15.199 --> 00:39:18.639
most of the time was later in the

00:39:16.719 --> 00:39:20.480
evening i mean i can get a call at 11

00:39:18.639 --> 00:39:22.400
o'clock at night and they'll say you

00:39:20.480 --> 00:39:23.760
know it's now 11 o'clock

00:39:22.400 --> 00:39:26.559
um

00:39:23.760 --> 00:39:29.119
by 11 45 you need to be at mccarran

00:39:26.559 --> 00:39:31.440
terminal and um

00:39:29.119 --> 00:39:33.200
you know we'll let you know when

00:39:31.440 --> 00:39:35.760
we have more information but what did

00:39:33.199 --> 00:39:37.118
you do while you were there if you're

00:39:35.760 --> 00:39:38.560
looking at this

00:39:37.119 --> 00:39:41.119
object this

00:39:38.559 --> 00:39:43.039
reactor and you can't figure out what it

00:39:41.119 --> 00:39:44.720
is or how it works other than the fact

00:39:43.039 --> 00:39:46.400
that it works on this element that we

00:39:44.719 --> 00:39:48.000
don't even know about sure i mean the

00:39:46.400 --> 00:39:50.800
thing was to

00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:52.239
what you do in you know

00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:54.079
with anything if you're trying to

00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:55.439
analyze it all you can do is perform

00:39:54.079 --> 00:39:57.920
tests

00:39:55.440 --> 00:40:00.000
and all we did is try and come up with

00:39:57.920 --> 00:40:03.440
every kind of test we possibly could i

00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:05.039
mean we tested you know it

00:40:03.440 --> 00:40:06.880
it violated

00:40:05.039 --> 00:40:09.679
a lot of what we thought was impossible

00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:12.400
to violate i mean one of the first laws

00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:14.480
of thermodynamics i mean essentially any

00:40:12.400 --> 00:40:16.320
machine any device that operates always

00:40:14.480 --> 00:40:18.880
makes extra heat

00:40:16.320 --> 00:40:20.800
nothing works at 100 efficient

00:40:18.880 --> 00:40:23.119
even the headphones you're wearing

00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:24.880
anything that takes power some of that

00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:27.440
power is going to be con converted to

00:40:24.880 --> 00:40:29.358
heat and it's just wasted

00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:31.280
this didn't i mean we looked at back

00:40:29.358 --> 00:40:32.960
then we had infrared cameras they're

00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:34.640
different today but back then you had to

00:40:32.960 --> 00:40:37.440
pour liquid nitrogen

00:40:34.639 --> 00:40:38.639
into the camera to cool the sensor down

00:40:37.440 --> 00:40:40.320
and um

00:40:38.639 --> 00:40:41.279
and get these infrared images you've

00:40:40.320 --> 00:40:43.680
seen

00:40:41.280 --> 00:40:46.880
but it never got no matter what the load

00:40:43.679 --> 00:40:48.639
was on the reactor it never got above

00:40:46.880 --> 00:40:52.079
the ambient temperature which is

00:40:48.639 --> 00:40:54.799
impossible i mean you're you know

00:40:52.079 --> 00:40:57.680
pulling out huge amounts of power and

00:40:54.800 --> 00:40:59.599
nothing ever gets warm

00:40:57.679 --> 00:41:01.598
we tried measuring magnetic fields and

00:40:59.599 --> 00:41:04.000
there was was nothing there so we

00:41:01.599 --> 00:41:05.920
started playing around with the

00:41:04.000 --> 00:41:07.280
emission from the emitters the gravity

00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:10.159
wave itself

00:41:07.280 --> 00:41:12.800
and saw what we could do with it and how

00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:14.399
it was focused so we really spent all

00:41:12.800 --> 00:41:16.160
our time

00:41:14.400 --> 00:41:18.559
just trying to see

00:41:16.159 --> 00:41:20.799
what the stuff can do and what we can

00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:22.400
control so you were seeing what it could

00:41:20.800 --> 00:41:24.318
do but you couldn't ever figure out how

00:41:22.400 --> 00:41:27.200
it was doing it

00:41:24.318 --> 00:41:29.358
no not really i mean we really we really

00:41:27.199 --> 00:41:31.519
could only use a or come up with a best

00:41:29.358 --> 00:41:34.559
guess and

00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:36.480
now i can't say we really

00:41:34.559 --> 00:41:39.119
that i could absolutely state for

00:41:36.480 --> 00:41:40.719
certainly or certainty how anything

00:41:39.119 --> 00:41:41.920
actually worked

00:41:40.719 --> 00:41:44.799
now

00:41:41.920 --> 00:41:47.838
how do did you know at all how they were

00:41:44.800 --> 00:41:50.079
piloting it because some they were doing

00:41:47.838 --> 00:41:50.960
some tests where they're having these

00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:53.039
things

00:41:50.960 --> 00:41:54.318
fly around in the sky

00:41:53.039 --> 00:41:56.960
and this is

00:41:54.318 --> 00:41:59.838
what gets us deeper into your story

00:41:56.960 --> 00:41:59.838
right um

00:42:00.880 --> 00:42:04.720
i was out there for uh

00:42:03.119 --> 00:42:05.519
one test

00:42:04.719 --> 00:42:08.318
um

00:42:05.519 --> 00:42:11.599
right in fact i was in with barry in the

00:42:08.318 --> 00:42:13.199
lab and dennis came in and said uh we're

00:42:11.599 --> 00:42:15.599
about to run the test why don't you guys

00:42:13.199 --> 00:42:18.000
come out or i think he said barry why

00:42:15.599 --> 00:42:21.119
don't you come out here and bring bob

00:42:18.000 --> 00:42:24.079
with you uh we went out there and

00:42:21.119 --> 00:42:27.440
the craft was already outside the hangar

00:42:24.079 --> 00:42:29.440
and was just preparing to lift off now

00:42:27.440 --> 00:42:31.760
they were in communication with somebody

00:42:29.440 --> 00:42:33.599
in the craft so there's a person in the

00:42:31.760 --> 00:42:35.920
crowd yeah there was

00:42:33.599 --> 00:42:37.599
certainly a person in there now it's not

00:42:35.920 --> 00:42:39.760
a comfortable place to be in because

00:42:37.599 --> 00:42:42.160
it's small so the guy has to be sitting

00:42:39.760 --> 00:42:44.079
on the floor in the middle uh my best

00:42:42.159 --> 00:42:45.440
guess and this is the same specific

00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:46.640
craft that you heard that was because

00:42:45.440 --> 00:42:48.639
you were that was the only craft that

00:42:46.639 --> 00:42:50.960
you were the only one that i i touched

00:42:48.639 --> 00:42:53.519
and worked on um

00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:56.318
and it it quietly lifted off the ground

00:42:53.519 --> 00:42:58.639
which was incredibly impressive to see

00:42:56.318 --> 00:42:59.440
quietly or silently

00:42:58.639 --> 00:43:01.920
what's

00:42:59.440 --> 00:43:03.200
well quietly because it

00:43:01.920 --> 00:43:05.680
didn't make sense

00:43:03.199 --> 00:43:07.439
it produced um

00:43:05.679 --> 00:43:09.358
a little corona discharge from the

00:43:07.440 --> 00:43:11.920
bottom a corona discharge is kind of a

00:43:09.358 --> 00:43:13.759
high voltage brush little bluish glow

00:43:11.920 --> 00:43:16.000
discharge as it was lifting off the

00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:17.520
ground you can hear a slight hiss sound

00:43:16.000 --> 00:43:19.280
now as soon as it cleared the ground by

00:43:17.519 --> 00:43:21.280
about five or ten feet

00:43:19.280 --> 00:43:24.640
maybe even less than that the hissing

00:43:21.280 --> 00:43:26.640
stopped and the blue gold disappeared so

00:43:24.639 --> 00:43:28.480
it lifted off quietly and then it

00:43:26.639 --> 00:43:29.598
hovered silently if you want to be

00:43:28.480 --> 00:43:32.480
specific

00:43:29.599 --> 00:43:33.519
wow so then what kind of maneuvers was

00:43:32.480 --> 00:43:35.760
it doing

00:43:33.519 --> 00:43:38.079
it took uh for that particular time it

00:43:35.760 --> 00:43:39.760
took off moved a little around around to

00:43:38.079 --> 00:43:40.560
the left and right and then sat back

00:43:39.760 --> 00:43:42.480
down

00:43:40.559 --> 00:43:44.719
the um

00:43:42.480 --> 00:43:46.480
the craft itself

00:43:44.719 --> 00:43:48.799
um

00:43:46.480 --> 00:43:52.318
they communicated with it with a reg

00:43:48.800 --> 00:43:54.880
because i saw the guy talking

00:43:52.318 --> 00:43:57.519
in a regular vhf radio

00:43:54.880 --> 00:43:59.838
to the person in the craft and i even

00:43:57.519 --> 00:44:02.079
saw the frequency that was on the

00:43:59.838 --> 00:44:04.239
the frequency counter of the uh

00:44:02.079 --> 00:44:05.280
communication the transceiver there

00:44:04.239 --> 00:44:07.118
um

00:44:05.280 --> 00:44:09.519
but what's weird is

00:44:07.119 --> 00:44:13.280
he shouldn't be able to communicate

00:44:09.519 --> 00:44:14.880
with the craft with a radio the radio

00:44:13.280 --> 00:44:17.519
the radio wave should bend around the

00:44:14.880 --> 00:44:20.559
craft i mean it shouldn't be possible

00:44:17.519 --> 00:44:22.719
every single thing about these the craft

00:44:20.559 --> 00:44:25.039
and the way they operated

00:44:22.719 --> 00:44:26.799
didn't make any sense to us i mean

00:44:25.039 --> 00:44:28.639
that's something we talked about for a

00:44:26.800 --> 00:44:30.160
while after why should the frequency

00:44:28.639 --> 00:44:31.440
bend around the craft

00:44:30.159 --> 00:44:32.960
well

00:44:31.440 --> 00:44:35.039
you really have to look at the way the

00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:37.440
gravity wave comes out of the craft

00:44:35.039 --> 00:44:39.519
there's a the reactors in the center and

00:44:37.440 --> 00:44:41.280
there's a waveguide that goes up to the

00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:43.199
top there's actually a small appendage

00:44:41.280 --> 00:44:44.800
that sticks out at the top of the craft

00:44:43.199 --> 00:44:46.480
and it produces a heart-shaped

00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:49.200
gravitational distortion around the

00:44:46.480 --> 00:44:52.000
craft now if the craft is sitting in the

00:44:49.199 --> 00:44:53.039
air and you walk underneath it and look

00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:56.159
up

00:44:53.039 --> 00:44:58.559
you actually cannot see the craft the

00:44:56.159 --> 00:45:01.920
light bends around it your bending

00:44:58.559 --> 00:45:03.519
gravity bends light it bends radio waves

00:45:01.920 --> 00:45:06.079
it's um

00:45:03.519 --> 00:45:07.920
it it shouldn't be possible to

00:45:06.079 --> 00:45:10.400
communicate with a craft that has an

00:45:07.920 --> 00:45:11.838
envelope around it that's distorting all

00:45:10.400 --> 00:45:13.119
forms of energy

00:45:11.838 --> 00:45:15.039
but

00:45:13.119 --> 00:45:17.358
they were apparently in contact with it

00:45:15.039 --> 00:45:19.358
somehow or another through some

00:45:17.358 --> 00:45:21.119
unexplained way that they don't bother

00:45:19.358 --> 00:45:22.639
explaining to you

00:45:21.119 --> 00:45:24.480
so this thing gets up it just does some

00:45:22.639 --> 00:45:26.159
very simple maneuvers left right left

00:45:24.480 --> 00:45:27.519
right goes down

00:45:26.159 --> 00:45:29.279
um and

00:45:27.519 --> 00:45:30.639
did they discuss this with you i mean

00:45:29.280 --> 00:45:32.800
they said they wanted you to see it no

00:45:30.639 --> 00:45:35.039
they they just wanted no they they

00:45:32.800 --> 00:45:37.119
didn't discuss anything with me it said

00:45:35.039 --> 00:45:38.719
it sat down we looked around for a bit

00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:40.640
and barry said let's go back we went

00:45:38.719 --> 00:45:41.279
back in the lab all we got to do is see

00:45:40.639 --> 00:45:42.719
it

00:45:41.280 --> 00:45:45.519
um

00:45:42.719 --> 00:45:47.598
fast forward

00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:49.838
to some months later

00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:51.838
i did have the test flight schedule of

00:45:49.838 --> 00:45:54.799
the craft now they had times they had

00:45:51.838 --> 00:45:56.480
designated high performance tests this

00:45:54.800 --> 00:45:59.280
obviously wasn't one

00:45:56.480 --> 00:46:02.000
that was a high performance test the

00:45:59.280 --> 00:46:04.319
high performance test went goes above

00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:05.760
the mountain range and they do much more

00:46:04.318 --> 00:46:09.358
radical moves with the thing look this

00:46:05.760 --> 00:46:10.480
is a prized item and they're not doing

00:46:09.358 --> 00:46:12.078
anything like taking it out of the

00:46:10.480 --> 00:46:13.838
atmosphere or flying around to other

00:46:12.079 --> 00:46:15.280
countries or anything like that

00:46:13.838 --> 00:46:17.119
they just play with this thing right

00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:19.040
over the test site

00:46:17.119 --> 00:46:19.920
but they were doing some radical moves

00:46:19.039 --> 00:46:22.159
with it

00:46:19.920 --> 00:46:24.880
and since i had the test flight schedule

00:46:22.159 --> 00:46:24.879
statistically

00:46:25.119 --> 00:46:28.000
the

00:46:26.159 --> 00:46:30.639
amount of traffic and the surrounding

00:46:28.000 --> 00:46:32.639
areas on the highway was lowest on

00:46:30.639 --> 00:46:34.480
wednesdays and that's why

00:46:32.639 --> 00:46:36.719
dennis told us that

00:46:34.480 --> 00:46:39.199
all the test flights occurred only on

00:46:36.719 --> 00:46:40.639
wednesdays because it'd be the least

00:46:39.199 --> 00:46:41.759
chance that anyone would see what's

00:46:40.639 --> 00:46:44.159
going on

00:46:41.760 --> 00:46:47.119
and this was before the the government

00:46:44.159 --> 00:46:50.078
had expanded the forbidden territory

00:46:47.119 --> 00:46:51.680
around area 51 and papoose lake and all

00:46:50.079 --> 00:46:53.839
that stuff right

00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:56.159
yeah i think that occurred

00:46:53.838 --> 00:46:58.318
after my story came out then people

00:46:56.159 --> 00:47:00.559
started going up on the mountaintops and

00:46:58.318 --> 00:47:02.079
trying to look down into there and they

00:47:00.559 --> 00:47:04.880
kind of freaked out and then did the

00:47:02.079 --> 00:47:07.200
land grab and pushed everybody back but

00:47:04.880 --> 00:47:08.559
yeah that i think all that occurred long

00:47:07.199 --> 00:47:10.799
after

00:47:08.559 --> 00:47:11.759
i'm sorry that i came out

00:47:10.800 --> 00:47:13.839
so

00:47:11.760 --> 00:47:15.280
you're working there and while you're

00:47:13.838 --> 00:47:16.639
working there you're under this crazy

00:47:15.280 --> 00:47:19.359
schedule

00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:20.159
forgive me for explaining your story but

00:47:19.358 --> 00:47:22.239
you

00:47:20.159 --> 00:47:26.318
uh would get these phone calls you would

00:47:22.239 --> 00:47:27.279
have to go to the to the airport at 11

00:47:26.318 --> 00:47:29.119
p.m

00:47:27.280 --> 00:47:31.599
and your wife started thinking that you

00:47:29.119 --> 00:47:33.358
were having an affair

00:47:31.599 --> 00:47:36.400
yeah apparently so

00:47:33.358 --> 00:47:38.400
um now i did give my permission to have

00:47:36.400 --> 00:47:41.760
you know as as part of the

00:47:38.400 --> 00:47:43.838
you know security clearance process um i

00:47:41.760 --> 00:47:45.680
i gave written permission to have the

00:47:43.838 --> 00:47:47.599
phones monitored and things of that sort

00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:49.279
so they weren't doing any covert stuff

00:47:47.599 --> 00:47:51.519
they um

00:47:49.280 --> 00:47:53.839
you know with any queue clearance or

00:47:51.519 --> 00:47:55.920
which is civilian top secret clearance

00:47:53.838 --> 00:47:57.599
or military top secret clearance they go

00:47:55.920 --> 00:47:58.639
talk to friends and

00:47:57.599 --> 00:48:00.000
you know

00:47:58.639 --> 00:48:01.039
place places you've been make sure

00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:03.119
you're not connected to foreign

00:48:01.039 --> 00:48:04.960
countries but you know monitoring your

00:48:03.119 --> 00:48:06.400
phone is nothing unusual

00:48:04.960 --> 00:48:07.440
however

00:48:06.400 --> 00:48:08.880
they

00:48:07.440 --> 00:48:10.720
insisted that

00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:12.240
you know you don't even talk

00:48:10.719 --> 00:48:14.719
to your loved one to your partner to

00:48:12.239 --> 00:48:17.039
your wife whatever about what's going on

00:48:14.719 --> 00:48:18.480
so she was essentially in the dark

00:48:17.039 --> 00:48:19.599
and didn't know the phone was being

00:48:18.480 --> 00:48:21.280
monitored

00:48:19.599 --> 00:48:23.838
well

00:48:21.280 --> 00:48:25.839
part of the security clearance

00:48:23.838 --> 00:48:27.358
is that not only do you not have any

00:48:25.838 --> 00:48:29.358
connections to foreign countries and

00:48:27.358 --> 00:48:31.279
aren't a maniac but you have to have a

00:48:29.358 --> 00:48:33.519
stable home life too

00:48:31.280 --> 00:48:35.040
well she started having an affair with a

00:48:33.519 --> 00:48:37.119
flight instructor

00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:39.440
now they were monitoring this on the

00:48:37.119 --> 00:48:41.280
phone and they knew it and i didn't

00:48:39.440 --> 00:48:44.000
so they stopped me

00:48:41.280 --> 00:48:45.599
coming in and their attitude at the time

00:48:44.000 --> 00:48:47.119
was

00:48:45.599 --> 00:48:49.519
we need to see how this is going to play

00:48:47.119 --> 00:48:51.599
out and if lazar is going to get a

00:48:49.519 --> 00:48:52.880
little weird or anything so

00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:55.599
let's just

00:48:52.880 --> 00:48:56.720
you know hold him off from coming in

00:48:55.599 --> 00:48:58.318
and

00:48:56.719 --> 00:49:00.480
you know see what happens and they

00:48:58.318 --> 00:49:02.880
explain this to you what was happening

00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:04.318
well after the fact yeah because time

00:49:02.880 --> 00:49:05.200
kind of went on

00:49:04.318 --> 00:49:06.880
and

00:49:05.199 --> 00:49:09.039
there were guys that were following me

00:49:06.880 --> 00:49:10.800
around and i started getting a little

00:49:09.039 --> 00:49:12.480
concerned going well

00:49:10.800 --> 00:49:16.160
ted are they

00:49:12.480 --> 00:49:17.679
booting me out of the project and if so

00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:19.920
they're not just going to let me hang

00:49:17.679 --> 00:49:21.118
out at home and go get a new job knowing

00:49:19.920 --> 00:49:22.318
what i know

00:49:21.119 --> 00:49:24.160
so

00:49:22.318 --> 00:49:26.079
as time went on i started getting a

00:49:24.159 --> 00:49:28.239
little concerned and

00:49:26.079 --> 00:49:30.720
i took my closest friends and just kind

00:49:28.239 --> 00:49:33.199
of got together and i said hey

00:49:30.719 --> 00:49:35.118
remember that job i told you about

00:49:33.199 --> 00:49:37.439
this is what's going on

00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:38.640
and uh like you don't need to take my

00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:40.960
word for it

00:49:38.639 --> 00:49:42.639
on wednesday night we need to all go out

00:49:40.960 --> 00:49:45.920
here i want to show you what's going on

00:49:42.639 --> 00:49:48.000
so i took everybody and we went out to

00:49:45.920 --> 00:49:51.599
um remember since i had the test flight

00:49:48.000 --> 00:49:53.679
schedule and went outside the base

00:49:51.599 --> 00:49:55.119
out into the desert and so everybody

00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:56.639
could see you know one of the high

00:49:55.119 --> 00:49:59.280
performance tests

00:49:56.639 --> 00:50:01.039
and you know it left quite an imprint on

00:49:59.280 --> 00:50:03.280
everybody so they knew i wasn't and

00:50:01.039 --> 00:50:05.199
there's videos of these tests right yeah

00:50:03.280 --> 00:50:07.359
but remember this is in the

00:50:05.199 --> 00:50:09.519
it's in in the dark in the 80s with a

00:50:07.358 --> 00:50:11.679
big monster-sized camcorder and you got

00:50:09.519 --> 00:50:14.159
you know a bright light jumping around

00:50:11.679 --> 00:50:15.519
but uh yeah i mean we did video of it

00:50:14.159 --> 00:50:17.598
but there's no

00:50:15.519 --> 00:50:19.679
by today's standards it's but is your

00:50:17.599 --> 00:50:20.800
video specifically available the video

00:50:19.679 --> 00:50:24.318
that you took

00:50:20.800 --> 00:50:26.720
yeah well george knapp has it it's is it

00:50:24.318 --> 00:50:28.558
i have no idea jeremy yeah i show clips

00:50:26.719 --> 00:50:30.879
of it in my film it's it's online and

00:50:28.559 --> 00:50:33.280
someone did a deep analysis of it uh it

00:50:30.880 --> 00:50:34.720
was interesting uh to take a look at how

00:50:33.280 --> 00:50:36.559
well this microphone up to your face

00:50:34.719 --> 00:50:39.118
about a fist from your face all right

00:50:36.559 --> 00:50:41.760
um you know to see how his video looks

00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:43.838
now but as far as video evidence i mean

00:50:41.760 --> 00:50:45.839
we are talking 80s camp was the most

00:50:43.838 --> 00:50:48.078
important thing is the human story here

00:50:45.838 --> 00:50:50.000
everybody that he took up there on three

00:50:48.079 --> 00:50:52.400
separate occasions they don't all like

00:50:50.000 --> 00:50:54.719
each other they don't all talk they all

00:50:52.400 --> 00:50:56.720
agree on one thing they saw something

00:50:54.719 --> 00:50:58.480
that night at the exact point in time

00:50:56.719 --> 00:51:01.838
and space that babazar said and remember

00:50:58.480 --> 00:51:03.920
this is 17 15 17 miles south of air 51.

00:51:01.838 --> 00:51:05.920
no one even knew really about air 51

00:51:03.920 --> 00:51:07.920
we're talking papoose lake and they all

00:51:05.920 --> 00:51:09.760
agree they saw something that night they

00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:11.760
had never seen before and they've never

00:51:09.760 --> 00:51:13.440
seen since right when he said it so

00:51:11.760 --> 00:51:15.760
that's one of like the six things where

00:51:13.440 --> 00:51:18.240
i'm like how did he know you can dismiss

00:51:15.760 --> 00:51:19.760
him i i tried to dismiss it but some

00:51:18.239 --> 00:51:21.759
things we can't get around and and

00:51:19.760 --> 00:51:23.200
there's about five or six of them how

00:51:21.760 --> 00:51:24.480
did he know about this if jamie wants to

00:51:23.199 --> 00:51:25.759
find that video right now what would he

00:51:24.480 --> 00:51:28.400
look under

00:51:25.760 --> 00:51:30.160
bob lazar ufo

00:51:28.400 --> 00:51:32.400
s for

00:51:30.159 --> 00:51:35.519
area 51 just kind of like that uh so

00:51:32.400 --> 00:51:37.680
it's like this s4 ufo video bob lazar

00:51:35.519 --> 00:51:41.519
and a guy does an analysis but you're

00:51:37.679 --> 00:51:43.838
not analyzing these 80s videos right he

00:51:41.519 --> 00:51:45.599
from the very beginning bob never said i

00:51:43.838 --> 00:51:47.358
have proof of my story and i'm going to

00:51:45.599 --> 00:51:50.079
tell the world he said at the very

00:51:47.358 --> 00:51:52.400
beginning i cannot prove my story that's

00:51:50.079 --> 00:51:54.720
not why i'm telling this george knapp

00:51:52.400 --> 00:51:56.000
convinced him to tell people

00:51:54.719 --> 00:51:58.000
and he lived through it and i i didn't

00:51:56.000 --> 00:51:59.039
believe it either until i i talked with

00:51:58.000 --> 00:52:00.639
george

00:51:59.039 --> 00:52:02.960
okay so you

00:52:00.639 --> 00:52:04.960
you filmed these

00:52:02.960 --> 00:52:06.800
this test flight one test flight and

00:52:04.960 --> 00:52:09.199
then you get caught

00:52:06.800 --> 00:52:10.720
actually it was i think the third time

00:52:09.199 --> 00:52:13.519
because it

00:52:10.719 --> 00:52:15.679
we went out there the first time

00:52:13.519 --> 00:52:17.920
everybody saw it everybody was amazed

00:52:15.679 --> 00:52:20.639
because it did some radical maneuvers

00:52:17.920 --> 00:52:22.000
and um you know everybody had a lot of

00:52:20.639 --> 00:52:24.400
maneuvers that i've seen i've seen the

00:52:22.000 --> 00:52:26.639
video it doesn't i don't think there's

00:52:24.400 --> 00:52:29.680
something we have now that does that no

00:52:26.639 --> 00:52:31.358
in terms of like a human piloted craft

00:52:29.679 --> 00:52:32.960
i mean i don't know obviously with the

00:52:31.358 --> 00:52:35.039
government no it's it's impossible

00:52:32.960 --> 00:52:36.880
nothing can move like that and remember

00:52:35.039 --> 00:52:37.920
we didn't start filming from the very

00:52:36.880 --> 00:52:39.039
beginning

00:52:37.920 --> 00:52:40.639
you know

00:52:39.039 --> 00:52:42.318
we were waiting for something you know

00:52:40.639 --> 00:52:44.400
to happen the craft took off and then

00:52:42.318 --> 00:52:46.159
came flying at us stopped you know

00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:48.000
turned it a right angle flew back and

00:52:46.159 --> 00:52:49.358
then you know after it did some you know

00:52:48.000 --> 00:52:51.280
amazing stuff

00:52:49.358 --> 00:52:53.519
to get the camera and then we started

00:52:51.280 --> 00:52:55.200
filming so it doesn't have all of it on

00:52:53.519 --> 00:52:56.480
there it just has some the way i

00:52:55.199 --> 00:52:58.000
describe it to my friends and they said

00:52:56.480 --> 00:53:00.318
what does it look like i said take a

00:52:58.000 --> 00:53:02.239
laser pointer and then have a wall and

00:53:00.318 --> 00:53:03.440
then move it around the wall like you

00:53:02.239 --> 00:53:04.959
know how it moves around the wall it

00:53:03.440 --> 00:53:07.760
doesn't seem like it has anything to do

00:53:04.960 --> 00:53:09.920
with inertia or physics or it's not

00:53:07.760 --> 00:53:11.200
impeded in any way by the atmosphere

00:53:09.920 --> 00:53:14.079
yeah that's what it looks like you're

00:53:11.199 --> 00:53:17.199
essentially separated from reality as

00:53:14.079 --> 00:53:20.400
crazy as that sounds with it being in in

00:53:17.199 --> 00:53:22.639
case it's an own gravitational envelope

00:53:20.400 --> 00:53:25.280
inertia is not going to affect it and

00:53:22.639 --> 00:53:26.719
you know this is

00:53:25.280 --> 00:53:28.880
this is how some of those recent

00:53:26.719 --> 00:53:30.399
sightings of commander david fravor i'm

00:53:28.880 --> 00:53:33.440
sure you've heard of the

00:53:30.400 --> 00:53:35.280
ufo i mean he describes exactly

00:53:33.440 --> 00:53:37.519
that the thing operates exactly the way

00:53:35.280 --> 00:53:40.960
i was describing that's why

00:53:37.519 --> 00:53:42.559
he was interested to talk to me um but

00:53:40.960 --> 00:53:43.679
we saw this

00:53:42.559 --> 00:53:45.440
and

00:53:43.679 --> 00:53:46.879
you know on the way home it's like hey

00:53:45.440 --> 00:53:49.760
we got away with it we should try it

00:53:46.880 --> 00:53:51.519
again the next test flight date so this

00:53:49.760 --> 00:53:52.960
became a thing to do

00:53:51.519 --> 00:53:54.559
and i think it was on

00:53:52.960 --> 00:53:57.440
the third time

00:53:54.559 --> 00:53:59.119
that we got caught i mean we started

00:53:57.440 --> 00:54:01.039
becoming a little careless i think we

00:53:59.119 --> 00:54:02.559
took a motor home out there

00:54:01.039 --> 00:54:04.719
you know i mean it was like the

00:54:02.559 --> 00:54:07.760
stupidest thing you could possibly start

00:54:04.719 --> 00:54:10.399
tailgating yeah it was ridiculous and um

00:54:07.760 --> 00:54:13.119
again you're in your 20s yeah and you

00:54:10.400 --> 00:54:15.200
know what was funny was um

00:54:13.119 --> 00:54:17.519
we went out there and

00:54:15.199 --> 00:54:19.439
my friend gene huff and i were leaning

00:54:17.519 --> 00:54:21.039
on the front of a vehicle

00:54:19.440 --> 00:54:23.039
and

00:54:21.039 --> 00:54:26.960
just for some reason we just started

00:54:23.039 --> 00:54:29.440
talking [ __ ] like uh well i hope they

00:54:26.960 --> 00:54:31.280
realize that uh

00:54:29.440 --> 00:54:33.200
i don't remember what we were saying but

00:54:31.280 --> 00:54:34.880
you know that

00:54:33.199 --> 00:54:37.118
something about attacking the base or

00:54:34.880 --> 00:54:38.480
something along those lines and stealing

00:54:37.119 --> 00:54:40.079
the craft or

00:54:38.480 --> 00:54:41.280
something like that

00:54:40.079 --> 00:54:43.440
and um

00:54:41.280 --> 00:54:45.440
then about 20 feet in front of us we see

00:54:43.440 --> 00:54:47.920
a little green light

00:54:45.440 --> 00:54:50.000
fall on the ground and roll to us

00:54:47.920 --> 00:54:51.358
and unbeknownst to us now it's pitch

00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:52.639
black you can't see your hand in front

00:54:51.358 --> 00:54:54.880
of your face there were a bunch of

00:54:52.639 --> 00:54:56.879
guards standing right out there and they

00:54:54.880 --> 00:54:59.119
had a night vision scope where they were

00:54:56.880 --> 00:55:00.720
like from here to the wall looking at us

00:54:59.119 --> 00:55:02.400
listening to us and the guy dropped it

00:55:00.719 --> 00:55:04.318
and the scope rolled over to us and you

00:55:02.400 --> 00:55:06.400
could see the green screen

00:55:04.318 --> 00:55:08.239
you know we turn the lights on and all

00:55:06.400 --> 00:55:10.960
these guys are there so

00:55:08.239 --> 00:55:12.799
it was uh whoa yeah yeah so we did

00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:14.480
incredibly stupid stuff and got caught

00:55:12.800 --> 00:55:15.920
as we should have because so when they

00:55:14.480 --> 00:55:17.440
catch you and they bring you in then

00:55:15.920 --> 00:55:19.039
what happens well i went in for

00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:21.119
debriefing

00:55:19.039 --> 00:55:23.119
the following day i went to indian

00:55:21.119 --> 00:55:24.880
springs air force base which is kind of

00:55:23.119 --> 00:55:26.720
a defunct

00:55:24.880 --> 00:55:28.318
base that they used to use at the

00:55:26.719 --> 00:55:31.199
nuclear test site

00:55:28.318 --> 00:55:32.400
and this is when they brought out

00:55:31.199 --> 00:55:34.558
um

00:55:32.400 --> 00:55:36.559
the transcript of the phone call

00:55:34.559 --> 00:55:38.880
with my wife

00:55:36.559 --> 00:55:40.640
and you know they sat me down and we

00:55:38.880 --> 00:55:43.039
said you know when we meant to keep the

00:55:40.639 --> 00:55:45.279
secret we meant you can't tell your

00:55:43.039 --> 00:55:48.000
friends right you know and it just being

00:55:45.280 --> 00:55:50.079
sarcastic and trying to mm-hmm um and

00:55:48.000 --> 00:55:52.480
then they got real serious

00:55:50.079 --> 00:55:54.000
uh but this is where they

00:55:52.480 --> 00:55:56.400
you know took the transcript out and

00:55:54.000 --> 00:55:58.000
were reading me what uh

00:55:56.400 --> 00:55:59.119
my wife

00:55:58.000 --> 00:56:01.199
and

00:55:59.119 --> 00:56:03.440
you know our friend were talking about

00:56:01.199 --> 00:56:05.519
and uh

00:56:03.440 --> 00:56:07.760
it was a hard time so what happens from

00:56:05.519 --> 00:56:07.759
there

00:56:08.079 --> 00:56:10.480
what do they do with you why don't they

00:56:09.440 --> 00:56:13.119
arrest you

00:56:10.480 --> 00:56:15.358
i don't i don't know i don't know why

00:56:13.119 --> 00:56:18.160
i'm not sure they exactly they knew what

00:56:15.358 --> 00:56:20.558
to do but they did let me go

00:56:18.159 --> 00:56:22.639
that night and i went home

00:56:20.559 --> 00:56:24.559
and that this is kind of when the most

00:56:22.639 --> 00:56:26.639
stressful part started because you're

00:56:24.559 --> 00:56:28.720
realizing you're being monitored

00:56:26.639 --> 00:56:31.118
yeah now i know not only am i being

00:56:28.719 --> 00:56:33.838
monitored but now i know i'm in trouble

00:56:31.119 --> 00:56:36.400
and uh it wasn't a short time after that

00:56:33.838 --> 00:56:37.119
that i contacted you know at that time

00:56:36.400 --> 00:56:39.200
the

00:56:37.119 --> 00:56:41.599
only investigative reporter i had heard

00:56:39.199 --> 00:56:43.838
of in las vegas was george knapp

00:56:41.599 --> 00:56:45.440
and um you know told him some of the

00:56:43.838 --> 00:56:47.279
story because i had no idea what the

00:56:45.440 --> 00:56:49.200
hell was going to happen at that point

00:56:47.280 --> 00:56:50.880
so george knapp

00:56:49.199 --> 00:56:52.960
tries to

00:56:50.880 --> 00:56:53.920
dissect your story tries to find holes

00:56:52.960 --> 00:56:56.159
in it

00:56:53.920 --> 00:56:57.440
tells it puts it online and makes

00:56:56.159 --> 00:56:59.598
everybody aware of it and that's how i

00:56:57.440 --> 00:57:01.119
found out about it yeah to make a long

00:56:59.599 --> 00:57:02.960
story short

00:57:01.119 --> 00:57:05.119
what happens yeah to really make a long

00:57:02.960 --> 00:57:07.519
story short what happens from there on i

00:57:05.119 --> 00:57:11.880
mean do they contact you and say hey bob

00:57:07.519 --> 00:57:11.880
it's probably a good idea if you shut up

00:57:12.079 --> 00:57:15.440
how

00:57:13.358 --> 00:57:17.679
did they try to label you as crazy was

00:57:15.440 --> 00:57:19.119
there

00:57:17.679 --> 00:57:22.318
there were boy there were a lot of

00:57:19.119 --> 00:57:24.838
things that happened at you know between

00:57:22.318 --> 00:57:28.558
that point um i'm leaving out a lot of

00:57:24.838 --> 00:57:30.880
stuff to fill in the story

00:57:28.559 --> 00:57:33.040
we'd have to go back to los alamos and

00:57:30.880 --> 00:57:34.480
and

00:57:33.039 --> 00:57:37.440
well i really don't want to talk about

00:57:34.480 --> 00:57:39.039
that the um

00:57:37.440 --> 00:57:41.039
top secret weapons

00:57:39.039 --> 00:57:43.358
stuff that you were working on

00:57:41.039 --> 00:57:45.599
no i'm talking about the 115.

00:57:43.358 --> 00:57:45.598
um

00:57:46.239 --> 00:57:49.439
well i don't know i have to think about

00:57:47.599 --> 00:57:52.318
how i'd

00:57:49.440 --> 00:57:52.318
what is the problem

00:57:52.838 --> 00:57:57.440
i don't want to get myself into more

00:57:55.280 --> 00:57:59.839
trouble by admitting something so

00:57:57.440 --> 00:58:01.679
um i just have to dance around a couple

00:57:59.838 --> 00:58:03.599
he was created just during the filming

00:58:01.679 --> 00:58:05.358
of the movie people thought the movie's

00:58:03.599 --> 00:58:07.359
great by the way thanks joe and uh it's

00:58:05.358 --> 00:58:08.798
on netflix right now if anybody wants to

00:58:07.358 --> 00:58:10.159
check it out and if you're one of those

00:58:08.798 --> 00:58:12.639
people like me

00:58:10.159 --> 00:58:15.118
who um you know i've always

00:58:12.639 --> 00:58:17.679
loved the idea of ufos i became

00:58:15.119 --> 00:58:19.920
extremely weary talking to people who

00:58:17.679 --> 00:58:21.118
are ufo believers and ufo fanatics

00:58:19.920 --> 00:58:23.119
because there's so many of them that are

00:58:21.119 --> 00:58:26.720
full of [ __ ] and not just full of [ __ ]

00:58:23.119 --> 00:58:28.720
they're they're childishly delirious

00:58:26.719 --> 00:58:30.399
like the way they talk about things i

00:58:28.719 --> 00:58:33.039
mean there's so many people that are

00:58:30.400 --> 00:58:34.880
that i'm in contact they they reach me

00:58:33.039 --> 00:58:37.279
in the night and they explain to me what

00:58:34.880 --> 00:58:39.119
we're doing to the ocean is wrong and

00:58:37.280 --> 00:58:42.640
like you're like okay this is one of the

00:58:39.119 --> 00:58:42.640
reasons i didn't want to do the show

00:58:44.000 --> 00:58:48.400
well it's i mean it's no joke we've had

00:58:46.559 --> 00:58:50.480
people literally camp out on our front

00:58:48.400 --> 00:58:51.920
lawn and uh

00:58:50.480 --> 00:58:53.679
you know

00:58:51.920 --> 00:58:55.358
in some ways i can relate to some of

00:58:53.679 --> 00:58:57.279
these people you know maybe some of them

00:58:55.358 --> 00:58:59.279
did really have some kind of experience

00:58:57.280 --> 00:59:01.119
or saw something and all their friends

00:58:59.280 --> 00:59:03.280
think they're crazy but hey now there's

00:59:01.119 --> 00:59:06.000
this guy i heard on the radio

00:59:03.280 --> 00:59:08.960
and uh at least he knows i'm not full of

00:59:06.000 --> 00:59:09.760
[ __ ] so i gotta talk to him and so most

00:59:08.960 --> 00:59:11.519
of the

00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:13.440
correspondents i get are people trying

00:59:11.519 --> 00:59:15.199
to get a hold of me going bob you you

00:59:13.440 --> 00:59:16.960
gotta listen to me i'm i'm coming to

00:59:15.199 --> 00:59:20.000
talk to you i'm you know i'm driving

00:59:16.960 --> 00:59:22.240
from oklahoma or whatever and and and

00:59:20.000 --> 00:59:24.480
but some of them are just [ __ ] bad

00:59:22.239 --> 00:59:26.159
[ __ ] crazy yeah they're frightening

00:59:24.480 --> 00:59:29.039
there's a lot of schizophrenics that are

00:59:26.159 --> 00:59:30.318
involved in the conspiracy world so

00:59:29.039 --> 00:59:31.519
there's a lot of people that have real

00:59:30.318 --> 00:59:33.199
issues joe

00:59:31.519 --> 00:59:36.000
it would be a disservice to your

00:59:33.199 --> 00:59:37.759
audience to not say that

00:59:36.000 --> 00:59:39.199
we have to look at what's going on now

00:59:37.760 --> 00:59:40.720
and understand i've heard

00:59:39.199 --> 00:59:43.118
on your show a bunch of stuff about

00:59:40.719 --> 00:59:45.919
what's going on now and to not really

00:59:43.119 --> 00:59:48.318
understand what's going on now you can't

00:59:45.920 --> 00:59:50.318
see bob's story in the correct light

00:59:48.318 --> 00:59:52.639
after 30 years and at some point we

00:59:50.318 --> 00:59:55.119
should just touch upon that

00:59:52.639 --> 00:59:57.920
um the the biggest being that things

00:59:55.119 --> 00:59:59.920
like the tic tac ufo case that came out

00:59:57.920 --> 01:00:01.838
i've heard people even on the show say

00:59:59.920 --> 01:00:04.480
oh there's a glitch in the radar

01:00:01.838 --> 01:00:06.239
that's a data poor perspective you just

01:00:04.480 --> 01:00:08.159
don't know yet what's really going on

01:00:06.239 --> 01:00:09.679
commander fravor i was able to get the

01:00:08.159 --> 01:00:12.558
interview with him to talk with him way

01:00:09.679 --> 01:00:15.919
before it became public i got that from

01:00:12.559 --> 01:00:18.480
him he saw it other pilots saw it this

01:00:15.920 --> 01:00:20.400
is a big thing that's going on right now

01:00:18.480 --> 01:00:23.199
they had more sightings on the east

01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:24.720
coast recently cubes with spherical

01:00:23.199 --> 01:00:26.159
auras these are not aerodynamic and

01:00:24.719 --> 01:00:28.719
these are the people we trust to defend

01:00:26.159 --> 01:00:31.279
us on 911 commander favor protected los

01:00:28.719 --> 01:00:33.279
angeles and 911. so we trust them but

01:00:31.280 --> 01:00:34.400
they're not trained observers

01:00:33.280 --> 01:00:36.160
radar

01:00:34.400 --> 01:00:37.920
individuals see these things and the big

01:00:36.159 --> 01:00:39.199
the big one just to throw down so we can

01:00:37.920 --> 01:00:41.599
consider a story a little differently

01:00:39.199 --> 01:00:43.039
there's more depth to it the big one is

01:00:41.599 --> 01:00:44.559
the united states government has

01:00:43.039 --> 01:00:47.358
admitted that they have been

01:00:44.559 --> 01:00:50.400
continuously studying the ufo phenomenon

01:00:47.358 --> 01:00:52.159
that program was called a tip advanced

01:00:50.400 --> 01:00:54.880
error or sorry

01:00:52.159 --> 01:00:57.118
was called awsap that that's the

01:00:54.880 --> 01:00:58.559
mother program george knapp got that out

01:00:57.119 --> 01:01:00.480
they they announced through the new york

01:00:58.559 --> 01:01:02.960
times about a tip

01:01:00.480 --> 01:01:04.559
but awesome these acronyms asap advanced

01:01:02.960 --> 01:01:06.000
aerospace weapon systems applications

01:01:04.559 --> 01:01:07.760
program who cares

01:01:06.000 --> 01:01:09.519
that was the mother program so they've

01:01:07.760 --> 01:01:11.760
admitted we didn't stop studying ufos in

01:01:09.519 --> 01:01:13.519
1969 with project blue book we don't

01:01:11.760 --> 01:01:15.200
think it's crazy we actually want to

01:01:13.519 --> 01:01:16.960
reverse engineer the technology that's

01:01:15.199 --> 01:01:18.960
why on your other show you said what's

01:01:16.960 --> 01:01:20.639
this aav thing it's like they're making

01:01:18.960 --> 01:01:23.199
up another ufo name well hold on there's

01:01:20.639 --> 01:01:25.039
a reason because in the documents the

01:01:23.199 --> 01:01:26.719
the dia documents that george knapp

01:01:25.039 --> 01:01:28.400
released that everybody said was fake

01:01:26.719 --> 01:01:32.078
till now they know is real

01:01:28.400 --> 01:01:34.400
they call them aavs which is advanced

01:01:32.079 --> 01:01:36.480
aerospace vehicles people are getting

01:01:34.400 --> 01:01:38.880
the acronyms wrong so the reason for the

01:01:36.480 --> 01:01:40.400
terminology change is so that we can

01:01:38.880 --> 01:01:42.640
mimic what we're reading in the dia

01:01:40.400 --> 01:01:44.798
documents people can look for that now

01:01:42.639 --> 01:01:47.039
so they changed the names to get people

01:01:44.798 --> 01:01:49.759
away from ufo or uap even like hillary

01:01:47.039 --> 01:01:51.358
clinton said on air right so what are

01:01:49.760 --> 01:01:52.640
you talking about hillary clinton

01:01:51.358 --> 01:01:55.679
hillary clinton

01:01:52.639 --> 01:01:58.239
informed the public on jimmy kimmel oh

01:01:55.679 --> 01:02:00.879
jimmy we don't call them ufos anymore we

01:01:58.239 --> 01:02:02.000
call them uaps unidentified aerial

01:02:00.880 --> 01:02:03.838
phenomenon

01:02:02.000 --> 01:02:06.159
right so she kind of was giving their

01:02:03.838 --> 01:02:08.480
the clintons are very into the ufo topic

01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:10.639
senator reid you know he he's done a lot

01:02:08.480 --> 01:02:11.440
for the for the subject the study of it

01:02:10.639 --> 01:02:13.279
right

01:02:11.440 --> 01:02:15.200
so she informed the public so they could

01:02:13.280 --> 01:02:17.760
look for the right term so these terms

01:02:15.199 --> 01:02:20.639
are important because the dia in those

01:02:17.760 --> 01:02:22.400
documents they've been calling them aavs

01:02:20.639 --> 01:02:25.358
for quite some time now and they change

01:02:22.400 --> 01:02:26.960
the name to anomalous no that that's

01:02:25.358 --> 01:02:27.920
kind of a misnomer

01:02:26.960 --> 01:02:29.920
so

01:02:27.920 --> 01:02:32.079
they always mess around with things but

01:02:29.920 --> 01:02:33.599
it's actually advanced right but when

01:02:32.079 --> 01:02:35.760
they're describing it in the news they

01:02:33.599 --> 01:02:37.359
were calling an anomalous space vehicle

01:02:35.760 --> 01:02:40.880
totally and that's cool they were also

01:02:37.358 --> 01:02:42.159
saying anomalous aerospace threats aat

01:02:40.880 --> 01:02:45.280
right because they want the sense of a

01:02:42.159 --> 01:02:46.960
threat right so my point is all of if

01:02:45.280 --> 01:02:48.960
people don't know this now and they

01:02:46.960 --> 01:02:50.480
think this stuff is is fantasy this this

01:02:48.960 --> 01:02:51.920
part of it that we're studying it that

01:02:50.480 --> 01:02:54.079
we take it seriously we're spending

01:02:51.920 --> 01:02:56.720
money on it and that we're getting great

01:02:54.079 --> 01:02:58.240
data from from visual pilots to to radar

01:02:56.719 --> 01:03:00.480
that's why we know it's aerospace they

01:02:58.239 --> 01:03:03.279
dropped from 80 000 feet but guess what

01:03:00.480 --> 01:03:05.838
that's the top scope of the spy 1 radar

01:03:03.280 --> 01:03:08.079
is 80 000 feet so the radar system they

01:03:05.838 --> 01:03:10.159
were using it was coming from above that

01:03:08.079 --> 01:03:12.318
so my point is this

01:03:10.159 --> 01:03:14.639
if you don't understand that this is

01:03:12.318 --> 01:03:16.558
happening you're just behind the curve

01:03:14.639 --> 01:03:18.239
because you don't have the information

01:03:16.559 --> 01:03:20.160
because of the stigma that you're

01:03:18.239 --> 01:03:22.479
talking about i saw you get totally

01:03:20.159 --> 01:03:24.000
upset with the ufo topic i met you first

01:03:22.480 --> 01:03:26.480
when you're totally upset with the ufo

01:03:24.000 --> 01:03:28.159
topic it's the people when

01:03:26.480 --> 01:03:29.519
when when you're doing your

01:03:28.159 --> 01:03:31.679
i'm sorry man when you're when you're

01:03:29.519 --> 01:03:33.038
doing your show you know the joe organ

01:03:31.679 --> 01:03:34.239
questions everything

01:03:33.039 --> 01:03:35.280
i could see

01:03:34.239 --> 01:03:37.118
how

01:03:35.280 --> 01:03:39.119
how frustrating is trust me i have been

01:03:37.119 --> 01:03:40.720
frustrated to hell luckily my mentors

01:03:39.119 --> 01:03:43.280
george knapp and he's taught me the pit

01:03:40.719 --> 01:03:45.598
bull pitfalls as i went through it my

01:03:43.280 --> 01:03:47.440
whole point in this rant right here

01:03:45.599 --> 01:03:50.720
is just that we have to now look at

01:03:47.440 --> 01:03:52.400
bob's story but knowing the facts

01:03:50.719 --> 01:03:54.000
not someone saying it's a bird it's a

01:03:52.400 --> 01:03:56.079
plane it's a glitch

01:03:54.000 --> 01:03:57.679
they're not and so if you don't know

01:03:56.079 --> 01:03:59.280
that you just don't have the information

01:03:57.679 --> 01:04:02.078
yet not just that knowing the facts as

01:03:59.280 --> 01:04:05.680
we know him in 2019 not in 1988

01:04:02.079 --> 01:04:07.119
absolutely and so what has he said

01:04:05.679 --> 01:04:08.879
that has come true he's totally

01:04:07.119 --> 01:04:10.880
unimpressed with it right what has he

01:04:08.880 --> 01:04:13.519
said this come true so i was like bob

01:04:10.880 --> 01:04:15.599
they've announced gravity as a wave you

01:04:13.519 --> 01:04:17.119
were right man you're vindicated and he

01:04:15.599 --> 01:04:19.280
looks at me and he's like well if you

01:04:17.119 --> 01:04:22.640
think about it jeremy i had like a 50 50

01:04:19.280 --> 01:04:24.960
chance he was not very impressed right

01:04:22.639 --> 01:04:26.879
when did they announce gravity as a wave

01:04:24.960 --> 01:04:29.280
so they detected in a sense they

01:04:26.880 --> 01:04:30.480
detected gravity waves who were who was

01:04:29.280 --> 01:04:32.000
they

01:04:30.480 --> 01:04:33.440
you might know more there's two black

01:04:32.000 --> 01:04:35.440
holes that were colliding and that's how

01:04:33.440 --> 01:04:37.280
they were able to detect yeah somebody

01:04:35.440 --> 01:04:39.119
bill i don't know which group it was or

01:04:37.280 --> 01:04:42.720
what part of the government that's what

01:04:39.119 --> 01:04:44.559
google's for yeah would it but they um

01:04:42.719 --> 01:04:47.118
you know built a gigantic gravity wave

01:04:44.559 --> 01:04:50.480
detector and pretty much

01:04:47.119 --> 01:04:53.599
detected that there are such things as

01:04:50.480 --> 01:04:56.480
first observation of gravitational waves

01:04:53.599 --> 01:04:57.920
it says it was in 2016.

01:04:56.480 --> 01:05:00.079
okay the first observation of

01:04:57.920 --> 01:05:02.798
gravitational waves was made on 14th of

01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:06.318
september 2015 right as announced by the

01:05:02.798 --> 01:05:08.798
ligo and virgo collaborators on the 11th

01:05:06.318 --> 01:05:10.318
of february 2016 previously

01:05:08.798 --> 01:05:13.038
gravitational waves had only been

01:05:10.318 --> 01:05:16.000
inferred indirectly via their effect on

01:05:13.039 --> 01:05:18.400
the timing of pulsars in binary star

01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:18.400
systems

01:05:18.639 --> 01:05:24.558
the waveform connected by both

01:05:21.358 --> 01:05:27.279
ligo ligo observatories match the

01:05:24.559 --> 01:05:31.440
predictions of general relativity for

01:05:27.280 --> 01:05:31.440
gravity for a gravitational wave

01:05:32.079 --> 01:05:37.280
emanating from the inward sp i'm trying

01:05:34.880 --> 01:05:39.920
to get this from the inward spiral and

01:05:37.280 --> 01:05:42.400
merger of a pair of black holes around

01:05:39.920 --> 01:05:43.519
36 and 29 solar masses and the

01:05:42.400 --> 01:05:44.798
subsequent

01:05:43.519 --> 01:05:47.599
ring down

01:05:44.798 --> 01:05:49.038
of the single resulting black hole

01:05:47.599 --> 01:05:51.200
well that i mean

01:05:49.039 --> 01:05:53.200
yeah it's not he was in the 80s the

01:05:51.199 --> 01:05:55.838
predominant theory was gravity is

01:05:53.199 --> 01:05:58.719
produced by gravitons okay you know part

01:05:55.838 --> 01:06:00.960
of theoretic theoretical particles but

01:05:58.719 --> 01:06:03.199
um they're not they're waves they're not

01:06:00.960 --> 01:06:05.679
particles and that's so the thought is

01:06:03.199 --> 01:06:08.639
that the way we experience gravity it's

01:06:05.679 --> 01:06:09.679
based on mass which is why the moon

01:06:08.639 --> 01:06:11.440
which is

01:06:09.679 --> 01:06:13.118
roughly one quarter the size of the

01:06:11.440 --> 01:06:14.318
earth has one sixth of the earth's

01:06:13.119 --> 01:06:16.079
gravity so there's some sort of a

01:06:14.318 --> 01:06:18.639
computation you can make based on mass

01:06:16.079 --> 01:06:20.160
right and and remember

01:06:18.639 --> 01:06:22.639
we can observe

01:06:20.159 --> 01:06:25.759
the effects of gravity but we have no

01:06:22.639 --> 01:06:27.679
idea what it is all we can do is observe

01:06:25.760 --> 01:06:29.920
it and we can't make it the only way you

01:06:27.679 --> 01:06:31.838
can make gravity is just put more mass

01:06:29.920 --> 01:06:34.079
together and it's just a product of

01:06:31.838 --> 01:06:37.038
gravity but if you can make a if you

01:06:34.079 --> 01:06:39.119
have a machine that makes gravity

01:06:37.039 --> 01:06:42.000
you can pretty much do anything you can

01:06:39.119 --> 01:06:44.079
affect time you can have force fields

01:06:42.000 --> 01:06:47.119
all that stuff that's in science fiction

01:06:44.079 --> 01:06:49.440
becomes reality if you have a machine

01:06:47.119 --> 01:06:51.920
that can make gravity and what we worked

01:06:49.440 --> 01:06:54.400
on in the desert was a machine that

01:06:51.920 --> 01:06:57.200
makes gravity i love your analogy of

01:06:54.400 --> 01:06:59.599
dropping off a small nuclear reactor to

01:06:57.199 --> 01:07:02.480
the victorian era i love that that

01:06:59.599 --> 01:07:04.960
analogy because back then that was

01:07:02.480 --> 01:07:07.119
impossible that was magic

01:07:04.960 --> 01:07:09.280
what you're talking about here the fact

01:07:07.119 --> 01:07:12.640
that they just discovered this four

01:07:09.280 --> 01:07:14.480
years ago that this is a wave when we're

01:07:12.639 --> 01:07:17.038
as much as we know and as impressed as

01:07:14.480 --> 01:07:17.920
we are as we should be with how much

01:07:17.039 --> 01:07:19.599
more

01:07:17.920 --> 01:07:21.200
technologically advanced we are than

01:07:19.599 --> 01:07:22.960
every other creature on this planet

01:07:21.199 --> 01:07:25.279
we're still in many ways in the

01:07:22.960 --> 01:07:26.480
adolescence of technological innovation

01:07:25.280 --> 01:07:30.000
absolutely

01:07:26.480 --> 01:07:32.880
absolutely if even adolescence and when

01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:36.318
you're talking about this binary star

01:07:32.880 --> 01:07:37.838
system zeta reticuli and who knows how

01:07:36.318 --> 01:07:40.079
much longer these things have been

01:07:37.838 --> 01:07:43.199
around than us who knows what their

01:07:40.079 --> 01:07:44.240
evolutionary cycle's been who knows what

01:07:43.199 --> 01:07:45.358
i mean we might be talking about

01:07:44.239 --> 01:07:46.719
something that's a million years more

01:07:45.358 --> 01:07:49.679
advanced than us

01:07:46.719 --> 01:07:50.719
yeah yeah it could easily be now i'm not

01:07:49.679 --> 01:07:52.719
in

01:07:50.719 --> 01:07:55.358
believe it or not i'm not into ufos i

01:07:52.719 --> 01:07:57.919
don't follow stories or you know even

01:07:55.358 --> 01:08:00.558
after your experiences no i'm fascinated

01:07:57.920 --> 01:08:02.639
with the technology and i i it really it

01:08:00.559 --> 01:08:05.920
irks me like every night i go to sleep

01:08:02.639 --> 01:08:08.558
that you know i don't

01:08:05.920 --> 01:08:09.358
that it was my own doing essentially

01:08:08.559 --> 01:08:11.280
that

01:08:09.358 --> 01:08:13.920
that prevented me from continuing on in

01:08:11.280 --> 01:08:15.440
the in the project i mean it's the

01:08:13.920 --> 01:08:18.640
that to be on that cutting edge of

01:08:15.440 --> 01:08:20.399
technology is so alluring to me right

01:08:18.640 --> 01:08:22.480
but

01:08:20.399 --> 01:08:24.479
you know by the same token i don't

01:08:22.479 --> 01:08:26.559
really care that there's aliens or where

01:08:24.479 --> 01:08:27.838
they come from i mean the prize is the

01:08:26.560 --> 01:08:29.839
technology and that's what i'm

01:08:27.838 --> 01:08:31.600
fascinated by but so i don't listen to

01:08:29.838 --> 01:08:33.600
ufo stories and that sort of thing but

01:08:31.600 --> 01:08:36.400
george knapp is um

01:08:33.600 --> 01:08:38.560
i mean he's the guy that has the context

01:08:36.399 --> 01:08:39.519
and tries to thread everything together

01:08:38.560 --> 01:08:42.319
and

01:08:39.520 --> 01:08:44.239
what he recently told me is he found

01:08:42.319 --> 01:08:46.480
i don't know is either documentation or

01:08:44.238 --> 01:08:48.238
people that he spoke to it's at this the

01:08:46.479 --> 01:08:52.479
existence of this project the project

01:08:48.238 --> 01:08:54.399
that i was on it's something that they

01:08:52.479 --> 01:08:57.119
seem to take out every eight or ten

01:08:54.399 --> 01:08:59.039
years so that's a very specific memo and

01:08:57.119 --> 01:09:00.479
this is actually i this is the first

01:08:59.039 --> 01:09:01.759
time i'll be very clear with people

01:09:00.479 --> 01:09:03.759
about it it's a big topic of

01:09:01.759 --> 01:09:05.198
conversation right now it's called the

01:09:03.759 --> 01:09:06.479
wilson memo

01:09:05.198 --> 01:09:09.119
you can look it up

01:09:06.479 --> 01:09:10.718
admiral wilson met with a scientist

01:09:09.119 --> 01:09:11.759
who's actually was featured in one of my

01:09:10.719 --> 01:09:13.600
films

01:09:11.759 --> 01:09:15.600
everybody has been debating whether or

01:09:13.600 --> 01:09:17.520
not this document

01:09:15.600 --> 01:09:19.199
of a conversation

01:09:17.520 --> 01:09:20.799
with a with a sitting admiral at the

01:09:19.198 --> 01:09:22.639
time is a real

01:09:20.798 --> 01:09:24.000
document it's an actual conversation

01:09:22.640 --> 01:09:25.119
that happened and this document is real

01:09:24.000 --> 01:09:27.359
everybody wants to know the world is

01:09:25.119 --> 01:09:29.439
going crazy right now in the ufo world

01:09:27.359 --> 01:09:31.920
i'll tell you straight up right now

01:09:29.439 --> 01:09:33.759
i'm in the position to know and it is a

01:09:31.920 --> 01:09:36.158
real document

01:09:33.759 --> 01:09:37.600
that it is real so the conversation you

01:09:36.158 --> 01:09:39.679
read in that

01:09:37.600 --> 01:09:40.480
that conversation was had i can't attest

01:09:39.679 --> 01:09:42.719
to everything

01:09:40.479 --> 01:09:43.759
you're not being very clear sure please

01:09:42.719 --> 01:09:45.520
no problem

01:09:43.759 --> 01:09:47.600
so there was a document that is

01:09:45.520 --> 01:09:49.040
circulating right now that is really big

01:09:47.600 --> 01:09:51.120
it's going around everywhere people are

01:09:49.039 --> 01:09:52.960
asking what is this talking about it's

01:09:51.119 --> 01:09:54.640
called the wilson memo is what how you

01:09:52.960 --> 01:09:56.800
can find it online

01:09:54.640 --> 01:09:59.280
the or the wilson leak there it is

01:09:56.800 --> 01:10:02.400
jimmy's got it the wilson memorandum use

01:09:59.279 --> 01:10:04.880
of human volunteers no no no no no

01:10:02.399 --> 01:10:07.519
yeah so uh

01:10:04.880 --> 01:10:09.119
admiral wilson meets with this scientist

01:10:07.520 --> 01:10:11.760
and they have this discussion oddly

01:10:09.119 --> 01:10:14.000
enough at special projects at egng and

01:10:11.760 --> 01:10:15.440
if i remember the document is from 2001

01:10:14.000 --> 01:10:17.840
i'm telling everybody right now it's

01:10:15.439 --> 01:10:19.198
real and we'll see my history is pretty

01:10:17.840 --> 01:10:21.119
good with like saying if something's

01:10:19.198 --> 01:10:23.198
real or not right so here we go the

01:10:21.119 --> 01:10:27.119
document comes out they meet at eg

01:10:23.198 --> 01:10:28.639
special projects in 1989 they stumble

01:10:27.119 --> 01:10:31.119
into a problem

01:10:28.640 --> 01:10:33.440
this happens they put the technology

01:10:31.119 --> 01:10:35.760
away and then they bring it back out and

01:10:33.439 --> 01:10:37.839
see if material science has caught up

01:10:35.760 --> 01:10:39.520
and if they can make any progress so

01:10:37.840 --> 01:10:41.679
this document kind of talks about this

01:10:39.520 --> 01:10:43.920
process the big thing i get from it and

01:10:41.679 --> 01:10:45.359
a lot of it's vindicating to bob and one

01:10:43.920 --> 01:10:46.800
of the things that's vindicating besides

01:10:45.359 --> 01:10:49.679
the eg g thing

01:10:46.800 --> 01:10:52.719
is that private industry so this guy's

01:10:49.679 --> 01:10:55.359
an admiral and he says i found out about

01:10:52.719 --> 01:10:57.920
your sap your special access program i

01:10:55.359 --> 01:11:00.479
need to know about it and he's going to

01:10:57.920 --> 01:11:02.719
a private part of industry

01:11:00.479 --> 01:11:04.399
and he is denied access

01:11:02.719 --> 01:11:06.800
and he says i you know i should be

01:11:04.399 --> 01:11:08.960
running this program and they were able

01:11:06.800 --> 01:11:11.360
to deny him access

01:11:08.960 --> 01:11:12.880
so i think the takeaway here is check it

01:11:11.359 --> 01:11:15.279
out i'm telling you that that is an

01:11:12.880 --> 01:11:16.960
actual correct that is a leak now

01:11:15.279 --> 01:11:18.238
everything said in that document i'm i

01:11:16.960 --> 01:11:19.359
don't know what are you talking about

01:11:18.238 --> 01:11:21.119
what what is said in that document

01:11:19.359 --> 01:11:23.119
specifically it's it's a between a

01:11:21.119 --> 01:11:25.359
scientist and an admiral that are

01:11:23.119 --> 01:11:26.960
sitting and they're having a meeting and

01:11:25.359 --> 01:11:29.439
they're talking about

01:11:26.960 --> 01:11:31.920
the the search for the the ufo subject

01:11:29.439 --> 01:11:34.399
the search to get special access program

01:11:31.920 --> 01:11:37.199
access to all of these different things

01:11:34.399 --> 01:11:40.000
like reverse engineering programs

01:11:37.198 --> 01:11:42.000
so in this document they talk about it

01:11:40.000 --> 01:11:43.600
uh i believe that

01:11:42.000 --> 01:11:45.359
this document that the person that went

01:11:43.600 --> 01:11:46.480
was employed by robert bigelow you know

01:11:45.359 --> 01:11:48.238
one of the guys that has a couple of

01:11:46.479 --> 01:11:50.718
orbiting satellites and all that stuff

01:11:48.238 --> 01:11:54.319
who's the guy owned skinwalker ranch no

01:11:50.719 --> 01:11:55.760
he's not he was the guy the walker okay

01:11:54.319 --> 01:11:58.158
yeah he used to own it there's a new

01:11:55.760 --> 01:11:59.039
owner and i i interview him for my other

01:11:58.158 --> 01:12:00.479
film

01:11:59.039 --> 01:12:02.800
but there's a new owner and you'll be

01:12:00.479 --> 01:12:04.718
hearing a lot more about that soon

01:12:02.800 --> 01:12:05.920
but uh like it'll just there's there's

01:12:04.719 --> 01:12:07.119
stuff that you'll be hearing about

01:12:05.920 --> 01:12:10.000
skinwalker ranching because there's a

01:12:07.119 --> 01:12:12.479
new owner anyway the whole point of this

01:12:10.000 --> 01:12:15.760
you know insertion here is just that

01:12:12.479 --> 01:12:18.079
that document kind of validates a lot of

01:12:15.760 --> 01:12:20.000
this idea bob just said that they make a

01:12:18.079 --> 01:12:22.158
little progress then they can't go

01:12:20.000 --> 01:12:24.000
anywhere they tuck it away and then they

01:12:22.158 --> 01:12:26.000
bring it back out you know 10 years

01:12:24.000 --> 01:12:27.679
later and start working on it

01:12:26.000 --> 01:12:29.198
what is the limiting factor i think bob

01:12:27.679 --> 01:12:30.880
should speak on this but it's the

01:12:29.198 --> 01:12:33.198
material science

01:12:30.880 --> 01:12:35.440
yeah it's really where physics is so i i

01:12:33.198 --> 01:12:36.879
can i can see them doing that i mean i

01:12:35.439 --> 01:12:37.678
didn't have any

01:12:36.880 --> 01:12:40.159
uh

01:12:37.679 --> 01:12:41.840
information on that but i think what you

01:12:40.158 --> 01:12:44.079
know george uncovered is probably

01:12:41.840 --> 01:12:46.000
accurate that uh you know we try and do

01:12:44.079 --> 01:12:48.399
what we can and once we reach a

01:12:46.000 --> 01:12:51.600
roadblock on we really can't figure it

01:12:48.399 --> 01:12:54.158
out it's just friggin wait put the thing

01:12:51.600 --> 01:12:55.920
away wait for science to catch up and

01:12:54.158 --> 01:12:57.839
you know a decade later let's take the

01:12:55.920 --> 01:12:59.679
project out again and see all right now

01:12:57.840 --> 01:13:02.239
where can we go but there's got to be

01:12:59.679 --> 01:13:04.480
someone who remains informed right oh

01:13:02.238 --> 01:13:06.479
yeah you've got your scientists like you

01:13:04.479 --> 01:13:07.839
and barry you got your people that you

01:13:06.479 --> 01:13:09.279
compartmentalize you got these people

01:13:07.840 --> 01:13:11.440
working on yeah there has to be some

01:13:09.279 --> 01:13:14.000
people right that know everything you've

01:13:11.439 --> 01:13:16.238
got security and then someone's going to

01:13:14.000 --> 01:13:17.920
be on the outside saying hey we need

01:13:16.238 --> 01:13:19.839
people to guard this building don't let

01:13:17.920 --> 01:13:22.000
anybody in for ten years i think i think

01:13:19.840 --> 01:13:23.440
a lot of that is private industry and i

01:13:22.000 --> 01:13:24.960
think that's how they keep it yeah i

01:13:23.439 --> 01:13:27.759
think that's how they literally because

01:13:24.960 --> 01:13:29.279
the government is just so leaky i think

01:13:27.760 --> 01:13:30.880
that's kind of what they're doing that's

01:13:29.279 --> 01:13:33.279
what the document kind of proves you

01:13:30.880 --> 01:13:35.039
just articulated that that um it is in

01:13:33.279 --> 01:13:36.158
control private industry what private

01:13:35.039 --> 01:13:38.079
industry

01:13:36.158 --> 01:13:39.198
some aerospace company something i don't

01:13:38.079 --> 01:13:40.880
know yeah they wouldn't they would the

01:13:39.198 --> 01:13:43.039
guy with the admiral wouldn't name it in

01:13:40.880 --> 01:13:43.920
the car right in the conversation right

01:13:43.039 --> 01:13:44.880
so

01:13:43.920 --> 01:13:48.800
they

01:13:44.880 --> 01:13:50.560
still have these things supposedly

01:13:48.800 --> 01:13:53.840
i would guess i mean i don't have any

01:13:50.560 --> 01:13:57.360
information have you ever asked anyone

01:13:53.840 --> 01:14:00.000
that has any inkling of any idea of

01:13:57.359 --> 01:14:01.839
where they got them or how they got them

01:14:00.000 --> 01:14:05.198
no but um

01:14:01.840 --> 01:14:06.800
something must have been said to me um

01:14:05.198 --> 01:14:09.119
from barry

01:14:06.800 --> 01:14:10.880
and but i i it was just too long ago and

01:14:09.119 --> 01:14:11.920
i i can't quite remember what was said

01:14:10.880 --> 01:14:14.000
but it

01:14:11.920 --> 01:14:15.600
it just left a seat in my mind i think

01:14:14.000 --> 01:14:18.158
at least one of them was part of an

01:14:15.600 --> 01:14:19.280
archaeological dig

01:14:18.158 --> 01:14:20.719
so

01:14:19.279 --> 01:14:22.559
it's old

01:14:20.719 --> 01:14:23.920
something one at least one of them is

01:14:22.560 --> 01:14:25.760
old i don't know if it was the one i

01:14:23.920 --> 01:14:27.440
worked on but i remember

01:14:25.760 --> 01:14:30.320
something to do with an archaeological

01:14:27.439 --> 01:14:31.678
dig whoa so that's uh

01:14:30.319 --> 01:14:33.198
that means it's not just old it's

01:14:31.679 --> 01:14:35.039
ancient that'd be a great stephen

01:14:33.198 --> 01:14:37.039
spielberg movie yeah right

01:14:35.039 --> 01:14:38.960
[Laughter]

01:14:37.039 --> 01:14:40.479
as all of it would yeah that took me out

01:14:38.960 --> 01:14:42.640
when he said that for the first time

01:14:40.479 --> 01:14:44.559
yeah that's a freak out right there just

01:14:42.640 --> 01:14:46.800
a couple of dudes with some brushes

01:14:44.560 --> 01:14:49.039
looking for a tyrannosaurus rex bone and

01:14:46.800 --> 01:14:51.520
metal and when did they find it you know

01:14:49.039 --> 01:14:53.439
that they have nine of them well and how

01:14:51.520 --> 01:14:55.280
could we have not heard about that what

01:14:53.439 --> 01:14:57.439
about the guys with the brushes how

01:14:55.279 --> 01:14:59.840
could you uncover something like that

01:14:57.439 --> 01:15:01.678
and joe's newspaper at home does i mean

01:14:59.840 --> 01:15:03.199
they said it on that first day oh you

01:15:01.679 --> 01:15:05.520
mean the roswell yeah yeah yeah you told

01:15:03.198 --> 01:15:07.439
me yeah yeah i have a cover what is this

01:15:05.520 --> 01:15:09.280
here james it's the document but i had

01:15:07.439 --> 01:15:10.639
to do some digging to find it yes it's

01:15:09.279 --> 01:15:12.479
just kind of

01:15:10.640 --> 01:15:14.000
yeah so this is where they meet at egng

01:15:12.479 --> 01:15:15.119
and this is admiral wilson and there's a

01:15:14.000 --> 01:15:17.359
lot more coming out now i want to be

01:15:15.119 --> 01:15:18.399
clear george didn't put this out he

01:15:17.359 --> 01:15:20.479
didn't

01:15:18.399 --> 01:15:22.158
leak this out to anybody this is i can

01:15:20.479 --> 01:15:24.399
tell you how i recorded this this

01:15:22.158 --> 01:15:26.479
conversation so this was an employee

01:15:24.399 --> 01:15:28.479
of at the time robert bigelow and this

01:15:26.479 --> 01:15:30.000
is in 2002 right do you remember when he

01:15:28.479 --> 01:15:32.000
had that government contract called

01:15:30.000 --> 01:15:33.760
awesap the world all knows about now and

01:15:32.000 --> 01:15:35.600
he had nids that studied the ranch so

01:15:33.760 --> 01:15:38.480
that 22 million everybody is saying it

01:15:35.600 --> 01:15:40.480
was for atip um advanced aerospace

01:15:38.479 --> 01:15:43.519
threat identification program

01:15:40.479 --> 01:15:45.279
the 22 million dollars was for ossap

01:15:43.520 --> 01:15:48.159
that was pushed through through congress

01:15:45.279 --> 01:15:49.519
three congressmen right an astronaut it

01:15:48.158 --> 01:15:51.599
was pushed through

01:15:49.520 --> 01:15:52.880
and that's what that 22 million dollars

01:15:51.600 --> 01:15:54.400
by the way they spend more money on

01:15:52.880 --> 01:15:56.239
viagra every year than they do studying

01:15:54.399 --> 01:15:57.759
ufos if it was just this program which i

01:15:56.238 --> 01:15:59.039
think is funny but they probably make a

01:15:57.760 --> 01:16:01.119
lot more money from fragrance they

01:15:59.039 --> 01:16:03.439
probably do ufos well you never know how

01:16:01.119 --> 01:16:04.479
it seeds into population but anyway this

01:16:03.439 --> 01:16:06.960
program

01:16:04.479 --> 01:16:09.439
uh this is what was the mother program

01:16:06.960 --> 01:16:11.520
so it it got the 22 million and really

01:16:09.439 --> 01:16:14.479
it was to study skinwalker ranch oddly

01:16:11.520 --> 01:16:15.679
enough that 22 million all was inspired

01:16:14.479 --> 01:16:18.319
by the phenomenon they were seeing at

01:16:15.679 --> 01:16:20.560
skinwalker ranch because the scientists

01:16:18.319 --> 01:16:23.439
they're seeing vehicles come through

01:16:20.560 --> 01:16:25.520
like a space in the sky yeah we went

01:16:23.439 --> 01:16:27.119
there i went through it yeah we

01:16:25.520 --> 01:16:28.320
interviewed

01:16:27.119 --> 01:16:30.000
a bunch of people that seemed full of

01:16:28.319 --> 01:16:32.079
[ __ ] but a couple that didn't but it's

01:16:30.000 --> 01:16:33.920
very very interesting totally any

01:16:32.079 --> 01:16:35.519
there's but if you look i spent a lot of

01:16:33.920 --> 01:16:36.560
time in the area i'm not talking about

01:16:35.520 --> 01:16:39.120
those stories i'm saying there were

01:16:36.560 --> 01:16:40.880
scientists hired by the government right

01:16:39.119 --> 01:16:42.319
through bigelow to study the ranch

01:16:40.880 --> 01:16:44.640
because they thought it was important

01:16:42.319 --> 01:16:46.719
and you know whatever whatever the point

01:16:44.640 --> 01:16:48.480
is that 22 million was to study that

01:16:46.719 --> 01:16:50.719
then we have atip which is like an

01:16:48.479 --> 01:16:52.158
auxiliary kind of program of military

01:16:50.719 --> 01:16:55.198
settings like commander framers and that

01:16:52.158 --> 01:16:57.119
sort of thing this document is just one

01:16:55.198 --> 01:16:59.519
of those things that has now come

01:16:57.119 --> 01:17:01.519
forward that through the bigelow studies

01:16:59.520 --> 01:17:03.120
it was government funded and then it was

01:17:01.520 --> 01:17:04.400
personally funded and then government

01:17:03.119 --> 01:17:06.079
funded

01:17:04.399 --> 01:17:08.079
it's just one of those things that kind

01:17:06.079 --> 01:17:11.198
of shakes you because you got this

01:17:08.079 --> 01:17:12.960
military guy who can't get access

01:17:11.198 --> 01:17:14.319
because of the private industry that's

01:17:12.960 --> 01:17:16.158
holding these

01:17:14.319 --> 01:17:18.960
non-terrestrial materials that they

01:17:16.158 --> 01:17:21.198
can't study it so that's the the claim

01:17:18.960 --> 01:17:22.880
right now give it some time let people

01:17:21.198 --> 01:17:24.719
dig more into this

01:17:22.880 --> 01:17:25.760
it's fascinating man

01:17:24.719 --> 01:17:28.000
so

01:17:25.760 --> 01:17:29.360
you are

01:17:28.000 --> 01:17:30.640
essentially

01:17:29.359 --> 01:17:32.559
you're you're

01:17:30.640 --> 01:17:34.640
you're kicked out right you're you're

01:17:32.560 --> 01:17:37.199
out of the this program you can't work

01:17:34.640 --> 01:17:40.320
with these crafts anymore and

01:17:37.198 --> 01:17:42.639
do they give you any threats do they

01:17:40.319 --> 01:17:43.679
tell you what you have to do from here

01:17:42.640 --> 01:17:47.280
on out

01:17:43.679 --> 01:17:49.440
yeah well i mean the way it ended was

01:17:47.279 --> 01:17:52.079
um i told george knapp

01:17:49.439 --> 01:17:53.919
all this stuff and um you know he said

01:17:52.079 --> 01:17:55.359
well let's just get it on tape should

01:17:53.920 --> 01:17:58.800
something happen at least we have a

01:17:55.359 --> 01:18:01.439
record of it and um i don't remember

01:17:58.800 --> 01:18:03.840
what the emphasis was but um at some

01:18:01.439 --> 01:18:04.719
point george wanted to air it and he

01:18:03.840 --> 01:18:07.039
said

01:18:04.719 --> 01:18:09.439
you know you make the call on it

01:18:07.039 --> 01:18:10.399
and look if at any point you change your

01:18:09.439 --> 01:18:13.279
mind

01:18:10.399 --> 01:18:15.039
we won't air it and it came down to the

01:18:13.279 --> 01:18:16.639
day where george wants to put her on the

01:18:15.039 --> 01:18:18.079
five o'clock news he said hey this is

01:18:16.640 --> 01:18:21.039
important stuff people have to know

01:18:18.079 --> 01:18:22.800
about it and i thought it was too either

01:18:21.039 --> 01:18:24.880
it's kind of a crime i know you've got

01:18:22.800 --> 01:18:27.440
to keep the technology secret but you

01:18:24.880 --> 01:18:30.159
can't not tell everybody that this stuff

01:18:27.439 --> 01:18:32.158
is going on that we have you know actual

01:18:30.158 --> 01:18:34.960
hardware from another civilization it's

01:18:32.158 --> 01:18:36.879
a big [ __ ] deal you know probably the

01:18:34.960 --> 01:18:38.960
biggest one there ever was

01:18:36.880 --> 01:18:40.480
and um

01:18:38.960 --> 01:18:42.158
george

01:18:40.479 --> 01:18:44.000
said you know today's the day we got to

01:18:42.158 --> 01:18:45.839
put it on the news or something to that

01:18:44.000 --> 01:18:47.600
effect and when it came

01:18:45.840 --> 01:18:50.000
right down to the time to air it i

01:18:47.600 --> 01:18:51.600
changed my mind and i said

01:18:50.000 --> 01:18:53.920
we're not doing it

01:18:51.600 --> 01:18:56.079
and that's what turned into the famous

01:18:53.920 --> 01:18:57.920
wrestling match between me and george

01:18:56.079 --> 01:19:00.000
trying to get the tape but he won

01:18:57.920 --> 01:19:01.679
because he was a bigger guy so he

01:19:00.000 --> 01:19:03.359
actually physically wrestled well i

01:19:01.679 --> 01:19:04.560
think it was more of a pulling match we

01:19:03.359 --> 01:19:06.238
were i don't think we ever hit the

01:19:04.560 --> 01:19:08.080
ground but

01:19:06.238 --> 01:19:10.079
he got the tape he put it in the player

01:19:08.079 --> 01:19:11.198
and boom five o'clock news was on and

01:19:10.079 --> 01:19:13.760
then um

01:19:11.198 --> 01:19:15.678
i got a call after that and they said it

01:19:13.760 --> 01:19:17.840
was from dennis he said you have any

01:19:15.679 --> 01:19:19.520
idea what we're gonna do to you now and

01:19:17.840 --> 01:19:22.400
he hung up the phone that was the last

01:19:19.520 --> 01:19:24.960
communication i had with him

01:19:22.399 --> 01:19:27.599
and what has happened to you since then

01:19:24.960 --> 01:19:27.600
after that

01:19:29.359 --> 01:19:34.000
a lot of people i've known

01:19:32.399 --> 01:19:37.119
either were

01:19:34.000 --> 01:19:39.279
audited by the irs people had anybody i

01:19:37.119 --> 01:19:41.519
know that had clearances that worked in

01:19:39.279 --> 01:19:44.399
secure programs had the clearances

01:19:41.520 --> 01:19:45.520
pulled one of them uh

01:19:44.399 --> 01:19:47.519
friendly

01:19:45.520 --> 01:19:49.120
one of mine that jeremy knows he's going

01:19:47.520 --> 01:19:51.280
on camera with me soon he'll tell the

01:19:49.119 --> 01:19:53.439
story now that he's out of work up there

01:19:51.279 --> 01:19:55.119
he was working up at the tonopah test

01:19:53.439 --> 01:19:57.039
range waiting for his clearance to come

01:19:55.119 --> 01:19:59.599
through and you know they they pulled

01:19:57.039 --> 01:20:01.119
that it would it became it's like if

01:19:59.600 --> 01:20:04.320
they can't get the person that's

01:20:01.119 --> 01:20:07.119
involved they just create a problem for

01:20:04.319 --> 01:20:09.119
everybody that surrounds them and so i

01:20:07.119 --> 01:20:11.760
mean the way it turns out it hurt a lot

01:20:09.119 --> 01:20:12.559
of people's lives that i was connected

01:20:11.760 --> 01:20:15.280
to

01:20:12.560 --> 01:20:17.679
and that's an effective way of shutting

01:20:15.279 --> 01:20:19.198
someone up did you feel that by coming

01:20:17.679 --> 01:20:21.039
forward and going public they couldn't

01:20:19.198 --> 01:20:22.799
just snuff you out that was i mean

01:20:21.039 --> 01:20:24.719
that's what i was told and george and

01:20:22.800 --> 01:20:26.400
everybody you know said that you got oh

01:20:24.719 --> 01:20:28.319
it's you know it's public there's you

01:20:26.399 --> 01:20:32.879
know no one will touch you and i i you

01:20:28.319 --> 01:20:36.238
know i i fell for it um

01:20:32.880 --> 01:20:37.920
and i i wish you didn't yeah sometimes

01:20:36.238 --> 01:20:40.079
sometimes when it's just over stress and

01:20:37.920 --> 01:20:42.319
people are camping on your lawn yeah but

01:20:40.079 --> 01:20:44.840
it's this is gonna make things worse

01:20:42.319 --> 01:20:47.198
doing this no this is gonna make things

01:20:44.840 --> 01:20:48.960
better i was trying to tell them how is

01:20:47.198 --> 01:20:50.719
this gonna make things better because

01:20:48.960 --> 01:20:53.039
you're getting a real chance to explain

01:20:50.719 --> 01:20:56.079
yourself in a way that's going to

01:20:53.039 --> 01:20:58.399
make people who are not only work in the

01:20:56.079 --> 01:21:00.719
government people that are

01:20:58.399 --> 01:21:02.719
police officers and firefighters and

01:21:00.719 --> 01:21:04.880
first responders and doctors and

01:21:02.719 --> 01:21:06.239
scientists they're going to empathize

01:21:04.880 --> 01:21:10.719
emphasize

01:21:06.238 --> 01:21:10.718
empathize and and empathize with

01:21:10.800 --> 01:21:15.920
what it must be like to be a person like

01:21:12.960 --> 01:21:18.079
you in your 20s who gets thrust into

01:21:15.920 --> 01:21:20.560
this world unknowingly

01:21:18.079 --> 01:21:22.960
and confronted with

01:21:20.560 --> 01:21:25.679
one of the most if not the most

01:21:22.960 --> 01:21:28.399
important discovery in the history of

01:21:25.679 --> 01:21:30.480
human beings the big question

01:21:28.399 --> 01:21:32.479
are we alone it's the number one

01:21:30.479 --> 01:21:34.158
question there's two questions right

01:21:32.479 --> 01:21:36.319
what happens when we die and are we

01:21:34.158 --> 01:21:37.119
alone those are the two big questions

01:21:36.319 --> 01:21:40.799
right

01:21:37.119 --> 01:21:43.599
and if we're not alone and someone knows

01:21:40.800 --> 01:21:45.840
we're not alone and these some people

01:21:43.600 --> 01:21:47.360
who know we're not alone are these

01:21:45.840 --> 01:21:49.760
bungling

01:21:47.359 --> 01:21:52.158
sort of even if they weren't it's a

01:21:49.760 --> 01:21:54.480
crime that they're not telling the rest

01:21:52.158 --> 01:21:56.000
of us but i mean i don't mean bungling

01:21:54.479 --> 01:21:58.479
in terms they're incompetent i mean they

01:21:56.000 --> 01:22:00.000
can't be competent it seems to me to

01:21:58.479 --> 01:22:02.079
what you're describing that no one can

01:22:00.000 --> 01:22:05.920
be competent with this technology

01:22:02.079 --> 01:22:08.319
like the victoria victorian era scholars

01:22:05.920 --> 01:22:10.239
analyzing some sort of a nuclear reactor

01:22:08.319 --> 01:22:11.439
there's there's no way why do you think

01:22:10.238 --> 01:22:12.879
beyond that why do you think they're not

01:22:11.439 --> 01:22:14.799
telling us let's just make an assumption

01:22:12.880 --> 01:22:17.039
that this is true right now

01:22:14.800 --> 01:22:18.400
why do you think that they're not

01:22:17.039 --> 01:22:20.158
telling us that our government doesn't

01:22:18.399 --> 01:22:21.119
tell us what's your best well let me put

01:22:20.158 --> 01:22:24.479
it into

01:22:21.119 --> 01:22:26.399
what would you do if i'm the president

01:22:24.479 --> 01:22:27.839
okay and i get this information what do

01:22:26.399 --> 01:22:29.519
i do with this what do i do with this

01:22:27.840 --> 01:22:31.119
there's something that we don't know

01:22:29.520 --> 01:22:32.400
there's something we don't understand

01:22:31.119 --> 01:22:34.000
there's something that came from another

01:22:32.399 --> 01:22:35.920
world we got it tucked away in the

01:22:34.000 --> 01:22:37.679
mountains and uh just wanted you guys to

01:22:35.920 --> 01:22:39.279
know about it hey sleep tight hey

01:22:37.679 --> 01:22:40.880
american motto's on tonight who do you

01:22:39.279 --> 01:22:43.359
think's going to win yeah who's going to

01:22:40.880 --> 01:22:43.359
win america

01:22:44.800 --> 01:22:47.920
one is uncertainty and the other one is

01:22:46.319 --> 01:22:50.079
what bob and i have talked about a lot

01:22:47.920 --> 01:22:51.119
absolutely not knowing what to tell

01:22:50.079 --> 01:22:52.479
people because you don't really

01:22:51.119 --> 01:22:54.079
understand it yourself even though

01:22:52.479 --> 01:22:55.599
you've got what do you say if you want

01:22:54.079 --> 01:22:56.880
to run a government you want to get

01:22:55.600 --> 01:22:58.239
people to pay their taxes but there's

01:22:56.880 --> 01:22:59.359
something else yeah

01:22:58.238 --> 01:23:01.519
what do you say so you have these

01:22:59.359 --> 01:23:02.960
objects fine with impunity right and you

01:23:01.520 --> 01:23:05.120
that you have something else well not

01:23:02.960 --> 01:23:06.800
only that what can you say like how much

01:23:05.119 --> 01:23:08.639
do you really know i think it's mainly

01:23:06.800 --> 01:23:10.719
the technology yeah they just want to

01:23:08.639 --> 01:23:11.600
keep the technology secret because if

01:23:10.719 --> 01:23:14.319
there's

01:23:11.600 --> 01:23:16.320
yeah whoever gets this dude yeah

01:23:14.319 --> 01:23:18.559
you you control the where you become you

01:23:16.319 --> 01:23:20.799
literally become invincible once you

01:23:18.560 --> 01:23:23.440
master the technology you can't you

01:23:20.800 --> 01:23:25.440
cannot penetrate a field like that so

01:23:23.439 --> 01:23:27.119
imagine that's i know it's all science

01:23:25.439 --> 01:23:29.359
fiction but science fiction turns into

01:23:27.119 --> 01:23:31.840
science fact if you have

01:23:29.359 --> 01:23:33.119
real force fields around aircraft and

01:23:31.840 --> 01:23:34.800
battleships

01:23:33.119 --> 01:23:36.719
you you win

01:23:34.800 --> 01:23:38.880
you win you can force your will upon

01:23:36.719 --> 01:23:40.319
anybody and uh

01:23:38.880 --> 01:23:42.400
like i said there's so much more to the

01:23:40.319 --> 01:23:43.679
story when i was first there

01:23:42.399 --> 01:23:46.479
um

01:23:43.679 --> 01:23:48.399
there were russian scientists at s4 that

01:23:46.479 --> 01:23:50.238
was this was early on in the project so

01:23:48.399 --> 01:23:51.920
this was before operation paper clip

01:23:50.238 --> 01:23:53.678
became public as well right so i would

01:23:51.920 --> 01:23:55.199
imagine that was i don't know what the

01:23:53.679 --> 01:23:56.158
date yeah when was that when did was

01:23:55.198 --> 01:23:58.879
that

01:23:56.158 --> 01:24:00.559
98 i think 98 yeah yeah i don't know the

01:23:58.880 --> 01:24:02.800
dates on it so it's roughly 10 years

01:24:00.560 --> 01:24:04.159
later operation paperclip becomes

01:24:02.800 --> 01:24:06.079
freedom of information actually it's

01:24:04.158 --> 01:24:08.000
about russia not germany he's not a

01:24:06.079 --> 01:24:09.679
russian scientist yeah but i mean

01:24:08.000 --> 01:24:12.158
russian scientists a lot of them came

01:24:09.679 --> 01:24:14.000
from germany a lot of those those rocket

01:24:12.158 --> 01:24:16.719
scientists that work with nasa they all

01:24:14.000 --> 01:24:18.238
came from nazi scientists got it so some

01:24:16.719 --> 01:24:20.800
russians got some of them i just know

01:24:18.238 --> 01:24:23.919
that and at some point there was intense

01:24:20.800 --> 01:24:26.000
cooperation with even exchanging some

01:24:23.920 --> 01:24:28.158
ideas on nuclear weapons and you know

01:24:26.000 --> 01:24:29.760
emp tests and stuff things we would

01:24:28.158 --> 01:24:32.638
never have discussed with them but at

01:24:29.760 --> 01:24:35.039
the same time it was in the late 80s uh

01:24:32.639 --> 01:24:38.000
they were involved and actually in the

01:24:35.039 --> 01:24:39.359
area at s4 with us so you got to

01:24:38.000 --> 01:24:41.279
communicate with these guys or you saw

01:24:39.359 --> 01:24:42.880
them no i knew they were there barry

01:24:41.279 --> 01:24:45.119
barry would talk about the commies that

01:24:42.880 --> 01:24:47.039
were there the communities the commies

01:24:45.119 --> 01:24:49.359
and um that was back when they were the

01:24:47.039 --> 01:24:49.359
commies

01:24:50.319 --> 01:24:52.639
and

01:24:52.880 --> 01:24:57.840
at some point it wasn't our group but at

01:24:55.119 --> 01:24:58.880
some point there was a big discovery

01:24:57.840 --> 01:25:01.039
made

01:24:58.880 --> 01:25:03.359
and this did not happen when i was there

01:25:01.039 --> 01:25:05.840
it happened in between my trips to there

01:25:03.359 --> 01:25:07.599
and after that apparently they decided

01:25:05.840 --> 01:25:09.279
it was just too cool to share with

01:25:07.600 --> 01:25:11.360
anybody and the russians were never

01:25:09.279 --> 01:25:12.559
allowed back on the base after that but

01:25:11.359 --> 01:25:14.559
you don't know what that discovery was

01:25:12.560 --> 01:25:17.199
no no like i said it wasn't my group so

01:25:14.560 --> 01:25:18.400
one of the other groups really found out

01:25:17.198 --> 01:25:20.158
something

01:25:18.399 --> 01:25:22.158
but the you know

01:25:20.158 --> 01:25:23.839
in typical american fashion is all right

01:25:22.158 --> 01:25:26.638
this is ours you guys get the hell out

01:25:23.840 --> 01:25:29.600
of here was there any inkling that any

01:25:26.639 --> 01:25:31.840
other government had something similar

01:25:29.600 --> 01:25:33.360
no no nothing that i had heard see that

01:25:31.840 --> 01:25:36.880
was the thing that always freaked me out

01:25:33.359 --> 01:25:38.158
was why if if something was so superior

01:25:36.880 --> 01:25:40.560
to human beings it's almost like

01:25:38.158 --> 01:25:41.920
visiting an ant colony like why would

01:25:40.560 --> 01:25:44.000
you go to the queen i don't give a [ __ ]

01:25:41.920 --> 01:25:45.840
who the queen is i'm a human i'm so

01:25:44.000 --> 01:25:47.520
superior to ants i don't care who you

01:25:45.840 --> 01:25:50.239
have running your hive i'm just gonna

01:25:47.520 --> 01:25:51.600
study it i think it's who got it who got

01:25:50.238 --> 01:25:53.599
it look at the

01:25:51.600 --> 01:25:55.840
you know rocket technology in germany

01:25:53.600 --> 01:25:57.920
but they got nine of them

01:25:55.840 --> 01:26:00.239
yeah that doesn't make sense to me

01:25:57.920 --> 01:26:01.279
either so they were either in the same

01:26:00.238 --> 01:26:03.439
area

01:26:01.279 --> 01:26:04.880
or you know one had clues to where

01:26:03.439 --> 01:26:06.638
others were

01:26:04.880 --> 01:26:08.079
i mean i don't know you you have to fill

01:26:06.639 --> 01:26:11.279
that in there but you're right i mean

01:26:08.079 --> 01:26:13.198
nine of them that's a that's a a big dig

01:26:11.279 --> 01:26:14.960
if it was archaeological well one of the

01:26:13.198 --> 01:26:17.279
more recent

01:26:14.960 --> 01:26:18.800
recent sightings and the these

01:26:17.279 --> 01:26:21.039
discussions that have been coming out

01:26:18.800 --> 01:26:22.400
recently from air force pilots and navy

01:26:21.039 --> 01:26:24.079
pilots they've been talking about things

01:26:22.399 --> 01:26:25.759
happening in the ocean

01:26:24.079 --> 01:26:28.158
and that that something

01:26:25.760 --> 01:26:29.440
go literally goes into the water or

01:26:28.158 --> 01:26:31.759
something maybe below the surface

01:26:29.439 --> 01:26:33.519
thinking about water 2004 tic tac nimitz

01:26:31.760 --> 01:26:35.039
case so that's when george knapp and i

01:26:33.520 --> 01:26:36.400
broke on the radio twice before the new

01:26:35.039 --> 01:26:38.960
york times so i know this one really

01:26:36.399 --> 01:26:40.158
well commander fravor and those pilots

01:26:38.960 --> 01:26:42.480
there was

01:26:40.158 --> 01:26:43.519
a disturbance on the surface of the

01:26:42.479 --> 01:26:45.839
water

01:26:43.520 --> 01:26:48.239
commander fravor visually saw what

01:26:45.840 --> 01:26:50.239
looked like similar to across some

01:26:48.238 --> 01:26:51.519
object so it's like as if you have some

01:26:50.238 --> 01:26:54.000
like coral under the water and you've

01:26:51.520 --> 01:26:56.800
got it's breaking over right the tic tac

01:26:54.000 --> 01:26:58.479
is doing this crazy maneuver that defies

01:26:56.800 --> 01:26:59.920
it's a gravity-propelled system they saw

01:26:58.479 --> 01:27:02.000
it in the sky before they saw in the

01:26:59.920 --> 01:27:03.600
water right yeah so there was um there

01:27:02.000 --> 01:27:05.359
were radar that was picking this these

01:27:03.600 --> 01:27:07.280
things coming down from 80 000 feet

01:27:05.359 --> 01:27:09.359
dropping to 50 feet in less than a

01:27:07.279 --> 01:27:10.880
second this is it jamie what is this

01:27:09.359 --> 01:27:12.559
this is actually on the news today there

01:27:10.880 --> 01:27:14.639
was a briefing so a lot of people get

01:27:12.560 --> 01:27:15.600
this confused not this one then either

01:27:14.639 --> 01:27:17.600
no so

01:27:15.600 --> 01:27:19.920
that is called the gimbal so there's

01:27:17.600 --> 01:27:21.440
three videos released by the pentagon

01:27:19.920 --> 01:27:23.279
that are all active play and keep the

01:27:21.439 --> 01:27:24.719
volume off

01:27:23.279 --> 01:27:26.399
i i would i would really just pay

01:27:24.719 --> 01:27:28.480
attention to the source video so you've

01:27:26.399 --> 01:27:30.799
got the tic tac which is this object the

01:27:28.479 --> 01:27:33.678
commander fravor saw another pilot

01:27:30.800 --> 01:27:35.360
filmed it with a flir pod and it goes

01:27:33.679 --> 01:27:38.480
but this one you see is really important

01:27:35.359 --> 01:27:41.359
to bob's story the gimbal craft it's

01:27:38.479 --> 01:27:44.079
been recently analyzed it's fleer not

01:27:41.359 --> 01:27:46.799
only does it it's definitive that it's

01:27:44.079 --> 01:27:48.639
not a conventional anything by the by

01:27:46.800 --> 01:27:49.920
its movements but there's a pocket of

01:27:48.639 --> 01:27:52.159
cold air

01:27:49.920 --> 01:27:55.119
around a propulsion source

01:27:52.158 --> 01:27:58.079
so this object by the way sat stationary

01:27:55.119 --> 01:28:00.238
for days if not weeks it sat stationary

01:27:58.079 --> 01:28:01.760
yeah they found it 11 hours later and

01:28:00.238 --> 01:28:03.839
they were saying there's no way this

01:28:01.760 --> 01:28:05.920
thing using that kind of energy to go

01:28:03.840 --> 01:28:08.000
that fast could just hover the amount of

01:28:05.920 --> 01:28:10.079
time and by the way you're seeing a very

01:28:08.000 --> 01:28:12.319
small part of what happened that day

01:28:10.079 --> 01:28:14.719
this object was not alone

01:28:12.319 --> 01:28:16.960
and so hopefully that information comes

01:28:14.719 --> 01:28:18.480
out and we can i mean i wish we had

01:28:16.960 --> 01:28:19.600
video of it i'm sure we'd all want to

01:28:18.479 --> 01:28:21.198
see it

01:28:19.600 --> 01:28:22.560
but that's called the gimbal that was

01:28:21.198 --> 01:28:24.960
east coast

01:28:22.560 --> 01:28:27.600
right 2015.

01:28:24.960 --> 01:28:29.600
west coast 2004 was the tic tac

01:28:27.600 --> 01:28:31.120
the disturbance on the water commander

01:28:29.600 --> 01:28:33.039
fraber believes there was something

01:28:31.119 --> 01:28:34.479
under that water that was causing that

01:28:33.039 --> 01:28:35.840
disturbance when the tic tac was coming

01:28:34.479 --> 01:28:37.678
around to doing it

01:28:35.840 --> 01:28:39.679
with inside the the people that are

01:28:37.679 --> 01:28:41.520
studying this they're thinking maybe the

01:28:39.679 --> 01:28:42.399
tic tac system was causing the

01:28:41.520 --> 01:28:45.440
disturbance

01:28:42.399 --> 01:28:48.479
but the uso unidentified submerged

01:28:45.439 --> 01:28:49.919
object that he visually saw

01:28:48.479 --> 01:28:52.319
uh the whole interesting thing about

01:28:49.920 --> 01:28:54.560
that is i would love bob to describe it

01:28:52.319 --> 01:28:55.519
is why it doesn't matter if these craft

01:28:54.560 --> 01:28:56.560
are in

01:28:55.520 --> 01:28:58.800
space

01:28:56.560 --> 01:29:00.960
air or water why doesn't it matter i

01:28:58.800 --> 01:29:02.800
love when he talks about this [ __ ]

01:29:00.960 --> 01:29:05.760
well first of all commander fravor was

01:29:02.800 --> 01:29:07.600
the f-18 pilot off the nimitz that was

01:29:05.760 --> 01:29:10.800
sent out to find out what this stuff is

01:29:07.600 --> 01:29:13.440
but and it wasn't just i got a chance to

01:29:10.800 --> 01:29:15.760
talk to him recently and it wasn't just

01:29:13.439 --> 01:29:18.799
a radar image i mean commander fravor

01:29:15.760 --> 01:29:21.360
had eyes on it for over five minutes

01:29:18.800 --> 01:29:23.279
watching this thing as four other pilots

01:29:21.359 --> 01:29:24.880
did so this wasn't a radar blip or

01:29:23.279 --> 01:29:27.679
anything i mean these guys were watching

01:29:24.880 --> 01:29:29.199
this thing but

01:29:27.679 --> 01:29:31.840
you know one of the things i think in

01:29:29.198 --> 01:29:34.799
the gimbal video

01:29:31.840 --> 01:29:36.239
the way the craft that we worked on

01:29:34.800 --> 01:29:39.279
flies

01:29:36.238 --> 01:29:41.519
is it doesn't fly like

01:29:39.279 --> 01:29:43.920
a conventional aircraft does and it

01:29:41.520 --> 01:29:47.760
doesn't fly like a flying saucer with in

01:29:43.920 --> 01:29:50.639
a 1950s movie it flies belly first

01:29:47.760 --> 01:29:53.039
i mean it may set down conventionally

01:29:50.639 --> 01:29:55.039
but it always rotates it does a role

01:29:53.039 --> 01:29:57.279
maneuver puts its belly towards the

01:29:55.039 --> 01:30:00.000
target and then moves away so it's like

01:29:57.279 --> 01:30:00.800
a car flying with the wheels forward

01:30:00.000 --> 01:30:01.679
right

01:30:00.800 --> 01:30:03.600
right

01:30:01.679 --> 01:30:05.600
i mean it may lift land on the wheels

01:30:03.600 --> 01:30:07.679
but at some point when it wants to leave

01:30:05.600 --> 01:30:09.360
flips flips up points the wheels where

01:30:07.679 --> 01:30:12.000
it wants to go and takes off and the

01:30:09.359 --> 01:30:14.479
gimbal video you can see the craft do

01:30:12.000 --> 01:30:15.840
the roll maneuver and uh

01:30:14.479 --> 01:30:18.559
it's really interesting it behaves

01:30:15.840 --> 01:30:19.520
exactly like the crafts that i worked on

01:30:18.560 --> 01:30:21.120
so

01:30:19.520 --> 01:30:24.239
much like we have different shaped

01:30:21.119 --> 01:30:27.198
aircrafts and fighter jets and cars they

01:30:24.238 --> 01:30:29.519
probably have different shapes of these

01:30:27.198 --> 01:30:30.719
objects that operate under similar

01:30:29.520 --> 01:30:33.040
principles

01:30:30.719 --> 01:30:34.158
right but they all have the same power

01:30:33.039 --> 01:30:36.479
source they all have the same power

01:30:34.158 --> 01:30:38.799
source and we're also dealing with

01:30:36.479 --> 01:30:41.759
if you think about

01:30:38.800 --> 01:30:43.520
the laws of technological progression

01:30:41.760 --> 01:30:46.320
you know you think of moore's law and

01:30:43.520 --> 01:30:47.920
you think of how things accelerate

01:30:46.319 --> 01:30:50.559
you've got to think that if this

01:30:47.920 --> 01:30:52.239
civilization is who knows how many years

01:30:50.560 --> 01:30:54.800
more advanced than we are

01:30:52.238 --> 01:30:56.238
if not even years i mean i mean we're

01:30:54.800 --> 01:30:57.760
thinking about in terms of conventional

01:30:56.238 --> 01:31:00.399
terms right the way the way we look at

01:30:57.760 --> 01:31:01.199
the world i mean they meet they might be

01:31:00.399 --> 01:31:03.759
just

01:31:01.198 --> 01:31:05.919
superior in terms of their intellect

01:31:03.760 --> 01:31:07.760
they've got to be maybe maybe we don't

01:31:05.920 --> 01:31:11.359
know right well the only reason i

01:31:07.760 --> 01:31:13.679
i say that is because

01:31:11.359 --> 01:31:15.759
look everyone doesn't necessarily start

01:31:13.679 --> 01:31:18.079
at a steam engine right and go to an

01:31:15.760 --> 01:31:20.000
internal combustion engine and then you

01:31:18.079 --> 01:31:22.960
know electric power nuclear power and go

01:31:20.000 --> 01:31:24.960
up the ladder that we right come on um

01:31:22.960 --> 01:31:26.800
you know the binary if the stuff is true

01:31:24.960 --> 01:31:28.560
about the origin and the binary star

01:31:26.800 --> 01:31:30.800
system and they have heavier elements

01:31:28.560 --> 01:31:32.960
that we don't have and this element

01:31:30.800 --> 01:31:34.560
stable element 115 is a naturally

01:31:32.960 --> 01:31:36.158
occurring material

01:31:34.560 --> 01:31:38.080
maybe that's the first thing they

01:31:36.158 --> 01:31:39.759
started experimenting with and the

01:31:38.079 --> 01:31:42.399
version of their steam engine their

01:31:39.760 --> 01:31:44.079
first product was something that

01:31:42.399 --> 01:31:46.479
operated like this and actually when

01:31:44.079 --> 01:31:48.319
they came to earth to look around or you

01:31:46.479 --> 01:31:50.079
know whatever they were amazed at the

01:31:48.319 --> 01:31:51.840
stuff we were doing these guys burned

01:31:50.079 --> 01:31:54.559
stuff and squirted out the back to go

01:31:51.840 --> 01:31:56.079
forward so right um right you know who

01:31:54.560 --> 01:31:58.880
says they follow any kind of normal

01:31:56.079 --> 01:32:01.840
progression like that my my thought was

01:31:58.880 --> 01:32:04.239
if you went back to the 1400s and then

01:32:01.840 --> 01:32:05.600
you went from 1400 to 1500 you're not

01:32:04.238 --> 01:32:08.559
going to see that much of a difference

01:32:05.600 --> 01:32:11.120
technologically right if you go from

01:32:08.560 --> 01:32:13.679
2000 to 3000 i assume there's going to

01:32:11.119 --> 01:32:16.880
be a radical change right well the yeah

01:32:13.679 --> 01:32:19.840
the delta the rate of change is is

01:32:16.880 --> 01:32:22.960
magnificently higher than it used to be

01:32:19.840 --> 01:32:25.520
right so if you think about what they

01:32:22.960 --> 01:32:28.960
had in 1988 and you think about what

01:32:25.520 --> 01:32:30.239
they probably have in 2019

01:32:28.960 --> 01:32:32.639
just

01:32:30.238 --> 01:32:34.399
logically seems like they would advance

01:32:32.639 --> 01:32:35.359
i would think so

01:32:34.399 --> 01:32:36.638
the only

01:32:35.359 --> 01:32:38.639
question is like

01:32:36.639 --> 01:32:40.719
are they living

01:32:38.639 --> 01:32:42.480
is that a living thing in terms of like

01:32:40.719 --> 01:32:45.520
a biological thing

01:32:42.479 --> 01:32:47.839
or are they some sort of an artificially

01:32:45.520 --> 01:32:49.199
created creation like we are working on

01:32:47.840 --> 01:32:52.159
right now i mean we're in the middle of

01:32:49.198 --> 01:32:54.079
working on artificial reality artificial

01:32:52.158 --> 01:32:56.238
beings sentient beings artificial

01:32:54.079 --> 01:32:57.439
intelligence there's cons silicon based

01:32:56.238 --> 01:33:00.000
life forms that they're essentially

01:32:57.439 --> 01:33:02.238
trying to create boston dynamic or was

01:33:00.000 --> 01:33:04.079
it boston dynamics of the company

01:33:02.238 --> 01:33:06.799
robots yeah you can make machines out of

01:33:04.079 --> 01:33:08.238
flesh right so a cyborg or cybernetic

01:33:06.800 --> 01:33:09.679
organism is just that you know that's

01:33:08.238 --> 01:33:11.439
what a lot of people think those like

01:33:09.679 --> 01:33:13.359
gray things are you know that people

01:33:11.439 --> 01:33:16.238
call the grays yeah it's like they were

01:33:13.359 --> 01:33:18.079
like they're machines printed from flash

01:33:16.238 --> 01:33:20.399
so what you're saying is like well they

01:33:18.079 --> 01:33:22.559
could just be no synthetic

01:33:20.399 --> 01:33:24.719
they don't even need to be you know

01:33:22.560 --> 01:33:25.920
machines well they seem to have no sex

01:33:24.719 --> 01:33:27.439
organs the way they're described by

01:33:25.920 --> 01:33:28.880
people that have had interactions with

01:33:27.439 --> 01:33:31.599
them assuming these people aren't liars

01:33:28.880 --> 01:33:34.480
right or crazy or whatever right that

01:33:31.600 --> 01:33:36.639
they have no sex organs and that they

01:33:34.479 --> 01:33:38.879
don't seem to have any muscle that is

01:33:36.639 --> 01:33:42.880
almost like a frame right and they have

01:33:38.880 --> 01:33:45.520
enormous heads i mean if you look at

01:33:42.880 --> 01:33:47.119
australopithecus or depictions of you

01:33:45.520 --> 01:33:48.960
know ancient hominids and then you go to

01:33:47.119 --> 01:33:50.880
human beings one of the things you see

01:33:48.960 --> 01:33:53.039
is bigger heads and weaker bodies well

01:33:50.880 --> 01:33:55.679
you see a clear progression of evolution

01:33:53.039 --> 01:33:58.319
too where for something like that i

01:33:55.679 --> 01:34:00.079
would lean towards a synthetic organism

01:33:58.319 --> 01:34:02.399
because it looks like it was made for a

01:34:00.079 --> 01:34:04.559
specific task there was no reproductive

01:34:02.399 --> 01:34:06.879
organs so i mean that almost kind of

01:34:04.560 --> 01:34:08.880
leaves out any kind of you know physical

01:34:06.880 --> 01:34:10.639
evolution right well that's also our

01:34:08.880 --> 01:34:13.279
bottleneck right our bottleneck is our

01:34:10.639 --> 01:34:16.800
biological imperative the the need to

01:34:13.279 --> 01:34:19.519
breed emotions fear anxiety all these

01:34:16.800 --> 01:34:22.800
different things that exist in order to

01:34:19.520 --> 01:34:24.320
force us into making sure we reproduce i

01:34:22.800 --> 01:34:26.880
mean that's essentially there's human

01:34:24.319 --> 01:34:28.719
reward systems that aren't necessary

01:34:26.880 --> 01:34:31.679
once they can figure out a way to make

01:34:28.719 --> 01:34:33.119
some sort of sentient artificial life

01:34:31.679 --> 01:34:34.800
some sort of thing that doesn't have

01:34:33.119 --> 01:34:36.960
these biological limitations that we

01:34:34.800 --> 01:34:38.159
have by the way these craft all these

01:34:36.960 --> 01:34:39.119
different kinds have been reported

01:34:38.158 --> 01:34:40.559
because it was confusing i always

01:34:39.119 --> 01:34:43.039
thought of flying saucers what i heard

01:34:40.560 --> 01:34:44.719
bob lazar talk about flying saucer right

01:34:43.039 --> 01:34:46.960
but if you look back in history people

01:34:44.719 --> 01:34:49.119
have always reported the weirdest shapes

01:34:46.960 --> 01:34:51.039
like none of them are alike you know

01:34:49.119 --> 01:34:53.119
there are the saucers but you got cigar

01:34:51.039 --> 01:34:56.000
shaped you got you know the top hat

01:34:53.119 --> 01:34:57.760
shape you have orbs why maybe they're

01:34:56.000 --> 01:34:59.279
serving different purposes they're doing

01:34:57.760 --> 01:35:01.840
different things like we'd use different

01:34:59.279 --> 01:35:03.840
tools and i want to be clear the reason

01:35:01.840 --> 01:35:05.520
i know that memo is real is because i

01:35:03.840 --> 01:35:07.360
spent a lot of time with dr edgar

01:35:05.520 --> 01:35:09.360
mitchell six man to walk on the moon

01:35:07.359 --> 01:35:10.319
last guy to film him before he died

01:35:09.359 --> 01:35:11.839
right

01:35:10.319 --> 01:35:13.119
that's how i know i don't want any

01:35:11.840 --> 01:35:14.880
journalists thinking i got it from

01:35:13.119 --> 01:35:16.479
anywhere else i know because of dr

01:35:14.880 --> 01:35:18.480
mitchell and he said the same thing

01:35:16.479 --> 01:35:21.198
maybe these things are

01:35:18.479 --> 01:35:22.959
performing different tasks you know and

01:35:21.198 --> 01:35:25.359
that's what i seem if you if you think

01:35:22.960 --> 01:35:26.158
about what an alien is in terms of our

01:35:25.359 --> 01:35:28.319
our

01:35:26.158 --> 01:35:30.319
the sort of iconic image of an alien

01:35:28.319 --> 01:35:33.679
like the steven spielberg closing cows

01:35:30.319 --> 01:35:35.840
are the third time the third kind alien

01:35:33.679 --> 01:35:37.840
they seem like

01:35:35.840 --> 01:35:39.760
what we'd assume a human being would

01:35:37.840 --> 01:35:41.520
eventually become right

01:35:39.760 --> 01:35:42.719
and if these things are tiny human

01:35:41.520 --> 01:35:43.920
beings are smaller than they've ever

01:35:42.719 --> 01:35:45.359
been before they're weaker than they've

01:35:43.920 --> 01:35:48.079
ever been before and there seems to be a

01:35:45.359 --> 01:35:50.559
trend in that direction and this trend

01:35:48.079 --> 01:35:52.479
seems to be amplified by our

01:35:50.560 --> 01:35:53.520
technological progression

01:35:52.479 --> 01:35:55.839
there our

01:35:53.520 --> 01:35:57.920
lack of need for muscle strength and our

01:35:55.840 --> 01:36:00.319
lack of need for violence and we're

01:35:57.920 --> 01:36:01.760
moving in a society to try to get away

01:36:00.319 --> 01:36:03.840
from all the things that we think are

01:36:01.760 --> 01:36:06.719
abhorrent about human beings and the

01:36:03.840 --> 01:36:10.239
terrible behaviors that we have if we

01:36:06.719 --> 01:36:13.439
one day do give birth to some sort of an

01:36:10.238 --> 01:36:14.399
artificial being like marshall mcluhan's

01:36:13.439 --> 01:36:16.638
uh

01:36:14.399 --> 01:36:18.079
quote we are the sex organs of the

01:36:16.639 --> 01:36:20.560
machine world

01:36:18.079 --> 01:36:23.039
you know that one day okay i'll buy this

01:36:20.560 --> 01:36:24.239
yeah mcloone was brilliant and that that

01:36:23.039 --> 01:36:26.479
quote has always been one of my

01:36:24.238 --> 01:36:28.399
favorites because okay what are we doing

01:36:26.479 --> 01:36:30.638
when we're constantly technologically

01:36:28.399 --> 01:36:32.719
innovating we're constantly looking for

01:36:30.639 --> 01:36:35.039
faster cars better computers bigger

01:36:32.719 --> 01:36:36.560
screens faster more resolution more

01:36:35.039 --> 01:36:39.279
pixels more this more that higher

01:36:36.560 --> 01:36:41.440
bandwidth 5g 10g right what are we doing

01:36:39.279 --> 01:36:43.679
we're moving into this in this if you

01:36:41.439 --> 01:36:45.359
just follow it objectively stay stand

01:36:43.679 --> 01:36:47.039
back don't attach yourself or your

01:36:45.359 --> 01:36:49.679
civilization your culture to it and look

01:36:47.039 --> 01:36:52.319
at what it is we're moving

01:36:49.679 --> 01:36:54.399
a hundred percent towards technological

01:36:52.319 --> 01:36:56.319
innovation if you looked at this species

01:36:54.399 --> 01:36:57.679
from afar and if you weren't a part of

01:36:56.319 --> 01:37:00.000
it you would say what does this species

01:36:57.679 --> 01:37:02.079
do oh they make things they make things

01:37:00.000 --> 01:37:04.000
better every year beehives are the same

01:37:02.079 --> 01:37:05.920
[ __ ] thing that you see 10 years ago

01:37:04.000 --> 01:37:07.279
you go by you see a beehive it's amazing

01:37:05.920 --> 01:37:08.800
it's cool but they're the same [ __ ]

01:37:07.279 --> 01:37:11.118
thing they figured out how to do it they

01:37:08.800 --> 01:37:12.560
make a beehive right we don't do that we

01:37:11.118 --> 01:37:14.719
make better things what would you

01:37:12.560 --> 01:37:16.719
constantly and at some point i think

01:37:14.719 --> 01:37:17.920
that technology is going to fuse with us

01:37:16.719 --> 01:37:19.679
yes and we're going to become it's

01:37:17.920 --> 01:37:21.118
already happening yeah elon musk talked

01:37:19.679 --> 01:37:22.719
about it on my podcast that we are

01:37:21.118 --> 01:37:24.719
cyborgs you just carry it in your pocket

01:37:22.719 --> 01:37:26.480
it's a phone it answers any question you

01:37:24.719 --> 01:37:28.880
want you can talk to it it'll give you

01:37:26.479 --> 01:37:31.118
the answers the answers instantaneously

01:37:28.880 --> 01:37:32.719
it navigates you it has all your phone

01:37:31.118 --> 01:37:33.839
numbers and it has all your contacts you

01:37:32.719 --> 01:37:35.359
can get a hold of people people

01:37:33.840 --> 01:37:37.760
listening to you through it it's

01:37:35.359 --> 01:37:39.279
connecting us in ways even involuntarily

01:37:37.760 --> 01:37:40.800
haptics that kind of thing yeah it's

01:37:39.279 --> 01:37:43.519
also getting on your wrist how many

01:37:40.800 --> 01:37:45.360
people have eye watches apple watches

01:37:43.520 --> 01:37:47.040
right and that's only because we can't

01:37:45.359 --> 01:37:48.399
integrate them yet but you know that

01:37:47.039 --> 01:37:50.079
point is 100

01:37:48.399 --> 01:37:51.920
yeah i didn't joke about it last night

01:37:50.079 --> 01:37:53.679
but i have a bit about it that i do

01:37:51.920 --> 01:37:55.679
about the the integration between humans

01:37:53.679 --> 01:37:58.158
and technology that's what would you do

01:37:55.679 --> 01:37:59.920
if you were a hyper intelligence right

01:37:58.158 --> 01:38:01.759
would you do the work yourself or would

01:37:59.920 --> 01:38:03.920
you create some cool things called like

01:38:01.760 --> 01:38:05.520
humans to do it for you would you create

01:38:03.920 --> 01:38:07.840
things that are cybernetic organisms to

01:38:05.520 --> 01:38:09.840
come in with machines and do it for you

01:38:07.840 --> 01:38:11.760
if you're a hyper intelligence that has

01:38:09.840 --> 01:38:13.840
kind of changed like you've described

01:38:11.760 --> 01:38:16.159
you'd probably create workers right well

01:38:13.840 --> 01:38:17.600
that's a vast conspiracy theory i'm not

01:38:16.158 --> 01:38:19.599
talking about conspiracy but it is a

01:38:17.600 --> 01:38:21.600
kind of a conspiracy i'm asking you well

01:38:19.600 --> 01:38:23.600
i mean i don't think it's necessarily

01:38:21.600 --> 01:38:25.360
that i mean you could look at it that

01:38:23.600 --> 01:38:26.480
way but that is the way a conspiracy

01:38:25.359 --> 01:38:27.519
theorist would look at it the way i

01:38:26.479 --> 01:38:29.359
would look at it is like there's

01:38:27.520 --> 01:38:31.679
obviously a progression going on a

01:38:29.359 --> 01:38:33.439
biological progression there's some sort

01:38:31.679 --> 01:38:35.359
of an integration with technology

01:38:33.439 --> 01:38:37.599
there's some sort of imperative this

01:38:35.359 --> 01:38:39.839
need for technological innovation it's

01:38:37.600 --> 01:38:41.440
inescapable everyone has it we and i

01:38:39.840 --> 01:38:43.600
think it's attached to materialism in

01:38:41.439 --> 01:38:45.759
some sort of a strange way because so

01:38:43.600 --> 01:38:47.520
many people work so hard to get new

01:38:45.760 --> 01:38:49.039
things and like god that seems so

01:38:47.520 --> 01:38:50.400
illogical and preposterous and it makes

01:38:49.039 --> 01:38:52.000
people unhappy and depression's on the

01:38:50.399 --> 01:38:54.719
rise but nobody seems to be able to stop

01:38:52.000 --> 01:38:57.760
it like why is that well maybe it's

01:38:54.719 --> 01:38:59.679
because we are the

01:38:57.760 --> 01:39:02.079
caterpillars that give birth to the

01:38:59.679 --> 01:39:04.480
butterfly maybe that's what we're doing

01:39:02.079 --> 01:39:06.479
very well what our job is to do is to

01:39:04.479 --> 01:39:08.399
make some sort of a cocoon and we don't

01:39:06.479 --> 01:39:10.158
even know we're doing it while we're

01:39:08.399 --> 01:39:11.839
doing it do you think a caterpillar is

01:39:10.158 --> 01:39:14.158
well hey caterpillar what are you doing

01:39:11.840 --> 01:39:15.600
man just i'm doing my thing it's my job

01:39:14.158 --> 01:39:17.279
i have to make a cocoon then become like

01:39:15.600 --> 01:39:18.960
a body this could be a natural part of

01:39:17.279 --> 01:39:20.960
evolution it could be that we're just

01:39:18.960 --> 01:39:21.920
supposed to do this exactly and make the

01:39:20.960 --> 01:39:24.239
jump to

01:39:21.920 --> 01:39:27.440
some sort of mechanized right

01:39:24.238 --> 01:39:30.238
yeah non-biological an orangutan that is

01:39:27.439 --> 01:39:32.799
uh fishing with a spear

01:39:30.238 --> 01:39:34.319
no they they've figured out how to fish

01:39:32.800 --> 01:39:36.079
with spears there's

01:39:34.319 --> 01:39:37.439
uh there's um

01:39:36.079 --> 01:39:39.039
primatologists

01:39:37.439 --> 01:39:41.118
without somebody showing them how to

01:39:39.039 --> 01:39:43.439
fish no they've imitated human beings

01:39:41.118 --> 01:39:45.679
doing it and now they do it but they do

01:39:43.439 --> 01:39:47.439
it independently they're not trained

01:39:45.679 --> 01:39:48.960
orangutans they're wild around look at

01:39:47.439 --> 01:39:50.399
that

01:39:48.960 --> 01:39:53.359
there's a wild rice okay that's

01:39:50.399 --> 01:39:54.960
impressive very impressive well there's

01:39:53.359 --> 01:39:56.639
these primatologists i guess you would

01:39:54.960 --> 01:39:58.639
call them primatologists that's a term

01:39:56.639 --> 01:40:00.319
that's a great biologist biologists that

01:39:58.639 --> 01:40:02.239
believe that

01:40:00.319 --> 01:40:04.639
monkeys and chimps

01:40:02.238 --> 01:40:06.079
and some of the great apes are moving

01:40:04.639 --> 01:40:08.159
into the stone age that they've

01:40:06.079 --> 01:40:10.880
currently entered the stone age like

01:40:08.158 --> 01:40:12.559
they're not staying what they were a

01:40:10.880 --> 01:40:14.000
hundred thousand years ago or five

01:40:12.560 --> 01:40:16.000
hundred thousand years ago but they're

01:40:14.000 --> 01:40:17.760
actively using tools and they're

01:40:16.000 --> 01:40:19.840
experimenting with different different

01:40:17.760 --> 01:40:21.760
ways to use those tools and then they're

01:40:19.840 --> 01:40:23.279
making tools out of stone they're making

01:40:21.760 --> 01:40:24.560
tools out of sticks and they're they're

01:40:23.279 --> 01:40:27.920
using them

01:40:24.560 --> 01:40:30.480
well this might just be what happens

01:40:27.920 --> 01:40:32.560
this might just be what happens

01:40:30.479 --> 01:40:34.799
i mean why else why would why the [ __ ]

01:40:32.560 --> 01:40:36.880
we work so hard i mean i i was i was

01:40:34.800 --> 01:40:38.960
driving to la this morning um i had a

01:40:36.880 --> 01:40:40.960
doctor's appointment so i was on the 405

01:40:38.960 --> 01:40:43.118
at uh eight in the morning like jesus

01:40:40.960 --> 01:40:44.639
christ like this is so crazy when you're

01:40:43.118 --> 01:40:46.319
in the 405 in l.a at eight o'clock in

01:40:44.639 --> 01:40:47.199
the morning you see literally a million

01:40:46.319 --> 01:40:49.118
cars

01:40:47.198 --> 01:40:52.000
and this is everywhere you go as people

01:40:49.118 --> 01:40:54.238
but and also i'm in a tesla so i have it

01:40:52.000 --> 01:40:56.399
on autopilot so i'm there sitting i'm

01:40:54.238 --> 01:40:58.238
listening to a podcast i barely have my

01:40:56.399 --> 01:41:00.719
hand on the wheel i'm not touching [ __ ]

01:40:58.238 --> 01:41:02.879
this car's driving me along i'm not even

01:41:00.719 --> 01:41:04.560
doing anything i'm just i'm just hanging

01:41:02.880 --> 01:41:06.239
out it's so much less stressful by the

01:41:04.560 --> 01:41:08.639
way to do that that way right so it

01:41:06.238 --> 01:41:11.198
encourages you to innovate it encourages

01:41:08.639 --> 01:41:12.880
you to embrace this new technology i got

01:41:11.198 --> 01:41:15.118
this giant screen it's showing me the

01:41:12.880 --> 01:41:17.118
navigation in front of me i'll be there

01:41:15.118 --> 01:41:19.759
five minutes early excellent and i'm

01:41:17.118 --> 01:41:22.000
listening to a podcast wirelessly it's

01:41:19.760 --> 01:41:24.159
bluetooth screen streaming from my phone

01:41:22.000 --> 01:41:26.479
and i pulled that podcast which came out

01:41:24.158 --> 01:41:28.238
today out of the [ __ ] sky and i'm

01:41:26.479 --> 01:41:30.158
listening to it and i'm all comfortable

01:41:28.238 --> 01:41:31.599
in my nice little car just driving on my

01:41:30.158 --> 01:41:33.439
way to the doctor's office this is

01:41:31.600 --> 01:41:35.360
irresistible stuff yeah yeah different

01:41:33.439 --> 01:41:37.039
than your walkman yeah you know that can

01:41:35.359 --> 01:41:38.799
be irresistible

01:41:37.039 --> 01:41:40.399
it is a resistance it's frighteningly

01:41:38.800 --> 01:41:42.079
irresistible but is it frightening i

01:41:40.399 --> 01:41:44.559
mean if you were a monkey right if you

01:41:42.079 --> 01:41:46.079
were um an australiopithecus would you

01:41:44.560 --> 01:41:48.320
go man i don't want to [ __ ] be a

01:41:46.079 --> 01:41:50.559
person i live in a house that's [ __ ]

01:41:48.319 --> 01:41:52.399
i like just swinging around on trees i

01:41:50.560 --> 01:41:54.480
like uh running from jaguars this is

01:41:52.399 --> 01:41:56.000
life guys life is running from

01:41:54.479 --> 01:41:57.678
crocodiles it's not living in a [ __ ]

01:41:56.000 --> 01:41:59.920
suburban there's probably some that are

01:41:57.679 --> 01:42:00.880
like that yeah i don't think so i think

01:41:59.920 --> 01:42:02.560
i think

01:42:00.880 --> 01:42:03.920
when it comes we're going to embrace it

01:42:02.560 --> 01:42:05.840
we're going to embrace it the same way

01:42:03.920 --> 01:42:07.440
you embrace cell phones the same way

01:42:05.840 --> 01:42:08.960
embrace television there's going to be a

01:42:07.439 --> 01:42:10.879
few holdouts i don't even have an email

01:42:08.960 --> 01:42:12.480
address man those are those there's a

01:42:10.880 --> 01:42:14.239
few and far between the good luck with

01:42:12.479 --> 01:42:16.158
that [ __ ] face go move to the woods ted

01:42:14.238 --> 01:42:17.279
kaczynski yeah i was just going to throw

01:42:16.158 --> 01:42:18.879
ted's against

01:42:17.279 --> 01:42:20.238
ted kaczynski was right this is

01:42:18.880 --> 01:42:22.159
something that i think about sometimes

01:42:20.238 --> 01:42:25.198
when i get really high that ted

01:42:22.158 --> 01:42:26.879
kaczynski was a part of the harvard lsd

01:42:25.198 --> 01:42:29.118
studies this has been proven ted

01:42:26.880 --> 01:42:30.800
kaczynski they cooked his [ __ ] brain

01:42:29.118 --> 01:42:32.000
when he was at harvard and then when he

01:42:30.800 --> 01:42:33.920
went over to berkeley and became a

01:42:32.000 --> 01:42:35.359
professor his goal was to make enough

01:42:33.920 --> 01:42:37.118
money so that he could

01:42:35.359 --> 01:42:39.118
implement this program and live in the

01:42:37.118 --> 01:42:41.198
woods and then write his manifesto and

01:42:39.118 --> 01:42:43.118
start killing people that were involved

01:42:41.198 --> 01:42:46.479
in propagating technology he was

01:42:43.118 --> 01:42:47.759
expunged from the harvard uh logs by the

01:42:46.479 --> 01:42:50.238
way this is something my friend just

01:42:47.760 --> 01:42:52.719
called me about so there's like this uh

01:42:50.238 --> 01:42:54.158
private library and they used to print

01:42:52.719 --> 01:42:55.920
people's names whenever they were part

01:42:54.158 --> 01:42:58.158
of a university and he was one of a

01:42:55.920 --> 01:43:00.079
handful of people that were expunged

01:42:58.158 --> 01:43:01.439
from it i want to jump back to the one

01:43:00.079 --> 01:43:02.960
thing joe

01:43:01.439 --> 01:43:04.638
i want to be very careful with that word

01:43:02.960 --> 01:43:06.639
conspiracy theorist

01:43:04.639 --> 01:43:08.960
what i was what i was saying to you was

01:43:06.639 --> 01:43:10.719
we we terraform our earth right

01:43:08.960 --> 01:43:12.480
we terraform we change the environment

01:43:10.719 --> 01:43:14.639
we do all this innovation

01:43:12.479 --> 01:43:16.399
what is stopping us from thinking that

01:43:14.639 --> 01:43:18.079
that's not being done i'm not saying it

01:43:16.399 --> 01:43:20.000
is i'm saying what's stopping us from

01:43:18.079 --> 01:43:22.559
thinking that that's being done on a

01:43:20.000 --> 01:43:24.238
much bigger level on a cosmic level you

01:43:22.560 --> 01:43:26.320
mean like aliens coming down doing that

01:43:24.238 --> 01:43:28.399
to humans i'm telling you that there is

01:43:26.319 --> 01:43:30.399
something here that's there's a fact you

01:43:28.399 --> 01:43:31.920
know there's something there a craft

01:43:30.399 --> 01:43:34.238
they're here they're not ours they're

01:43:31.920 --> 01:43:35.920
here so the question is

01:43:34.238 --> 01:43:37.279
what is that about and i'm just looking

01:43:35.920 --> 01:43:39.199
at what we do with what you're

01:43:37.279 --> 01:43:41.359
describing with technology

01:43:39.198 --> 01:43:43.759
i think it's much more likely that the

01:43:41.359 --> 01:43:45.679
same way we observe chimps and we

01:43:43.760 --> 01:43:47.679
observed that they are now in the stone

01:43:45.679 --> 01:43:49.039
age that they're observing us and that

01:43:47.679 --> 01:43:51.279
they're recognizing that there is a

01:43:49.039 --> 01:43:53.439
pattern that there is uh there's steps

01:43:51.279 --> 01:43:54.960
that happen i mean carl sagan talked

01:43:53.439 --> 01:43:56.638
about the different levels of

01:43:54.960 --> 01:43:58.560
civilization and that you know if we

01:43:56.639 --> 01:44:00.639
don't get past certain levels we're

01:43:58.560 --> 01:44:01.920
never going to reach this i mean we're

01:44:00.639 --> 01:44:03.520
in type 1 civilization we're going to

01:44:01.920 --> 01:44:04.719
stay at type zero well we're in this

01:44:03.520 --> 01:44:07.679
warring

01:44:04.719 --> 01:44:08.960
polluting yeah pillaging we're awesome

01:44:07.679 --> 01:44:10.480
civilizations

01:44:08.960 --> 01:44:12.000
are awesome it's like well we're awesome

01:44:10.479 --> 01:44:14.000
in a lot of ways you know but in that

01:44:12.000 --> 01:44:16.079
way we're not well yeah we're we're

01:44:14.000 --> 01:44:17.920
children that have immense power that we

01:44:16.079 --> 01:44:20.158
didn't really the other thing is you're

01:44:17.920 --> 01:44:22.079
using the immense power that other

01:44:20.158 --> 01:44:23.198
people have created right i mean even

01:44:22.079 --> 01:44:25.359
when you're driving a car you're

01:44:23.198 --> 01:44:27.279
stomping on the gas like whew you didn't

01:44:25.359 --> 01:44:29.198
invent the [ __ ] engine you didn't

01:44:27.279 --> 01:44:31.359
invent tires there's all these things

01:44:29.198 --> 01:44:33.599
that were in involved in the creation of

01:44:31.359 --> 01:44:34.789
this thing that is

01:44:33.600 --> 01:44:35.920
really outside of your

01:44:34.789 --> 01:44:38.158
[Music]

01:44:35.920 --> 01:44:39.760
grasp of understanding but yet you have

01:44:38.158 --> 01:44:41.759
the ability to use it like a person with

01:44:39.760 --> 01:44:43.679
a gun i'm just gonna bang bang bang

01:44:41.760 --> 01:44:45.600
people you don't you didn't invent a gun

01:44:43.679 --> 01:44:49.760
so like you've you've without the

01:44:45.600 --> 01:44:52.159
intellect to craft and engineer and and

01:44:49.760 --> 01:44:53.520
and manifest these creations you just

01:44:52.158 --> 01:44:55.359
have access to them because you have

01:44:53.520 --> 01:44:56.719
paper or you have bitcoin or you have

01:44:55.359 --> 01:44:58.880
whatever the [ __ ] you're using using a

01:44:56.719 --> 01:45:01.279
credit card now you have

01:44:58.880 --> 01:45:03.359
almost no responsibility you just you

01:45:01.279 --> 01:45:04.559
could just flippantly use these things

01:45:03.359 --> 01:45:05.679
which is why

01:45:04.560 --> 01:45:07.440
we uh

01:45:05.679 --> 01:45:10.319
you know we're very childlike in our

01:45:07.439 --> 01:45:12.000
actions because we haven't had to earn

01:45:10.319 --> 01:45:14.399
the responsibility we haven't had to

01:45:12.000 --> 01:45:16.238
earn these things that we've been able

01:45:14.399 --> 01:45:18.238
to have and you've only been able to

01:45:16.238 --> 01:45:20.000
have them because other people have

01:45:18.238 --> 01:45:22.238
innovated and spent

01:45:20.000 --> 01:45:24.319
ungodly amounts of time and effort and

01:45:22.238 --> 01:45:26.158
focus in the lab to create these things

01:45:24.319 --> 01:45:27.920
and then they've all put them together

01:45:26.158 --> 01:45:29.439
and then what is the what's the reason

01:45:27.920 --> 01:45:31.039
to put them together to profit well

01:45:29.439 --> 01:45:32.079
what's the reason of prop well why are

01:45:31.039 --> 01:45:34.158
you doing this so you can buy more

01:45:32.079 --> 01:45:36.399
things what are we doing what are we

01:45:34.158 --> 01:45:38.158
doing we're making better things that's

01:45:36.399 --> 01:45:39.679
what we do that's all that's all we do

01:45:38.158 --> 01:45:41.359
is make better things yeah why the [ __ ]

01:45:39.679 --> 01:45:43.679
do we need oil why do we need oil why

01:45:41.359 --> 01:45:45.839
can't we just burn wood and stay home

01:45:43.679 --> 01:45:47.600
why can't we grow chickens and food in

01:45:45.840 --> 01:45:49.679
the backyard why can't we do well we

01:45:47.600 --> 01:45:52.239
[ __ ] can we certainly can people do

01:45:49.679 --> 01:45:54.158
do it but we decide to make that almost

01:45:52.238 --> 01:45:56.559
impossible our preferred way of living

01:45:54.158 --> 01:45:57.920
is to stuff everyone into a very small

01:45:56.560 --> 01:45:59.119
area where no one grows anything other

01:45:57.920 --> 01:46:02.079
than weed

01:45:59.118 --> 01:46:04.559
this is what la is la is 20 million

01:46:02.079 --> 01:46:06.399
people with hard surfaces as many hard

01:46:04.560 --> 01:46:08.480
surfaces as you can boy if you've got an

01:46:06.399 --> 01:46:10.638
acre backyard in l.a holy [ __ ] look at

01:46:08.479 --> 01:46:13.279
all that green this is amazing well no

01:46:10.639 --> 01:46:15.920
that's the [ __ ] earth coming through

01:46:13.279 --> 01:46:17.759
this weird sort of creation that we've

01:46:15.920 --> 01:46:19.520
put on top of the earth but the goal is

01:46:17.760 --> 01:46:21.360
that like new york city that's there's

01:46:19.520 --> 01:46:23.199
none of it right you just got you've got

01:46:21.359 --> 01:46:25.599
central park and they just got human

01:46:23.198 --> 01:46:27.839
[ __ ] you stacked up no one's growing

01:46:25.600 --> 01:46:30.800
anything and then constant work

01:46:27.840 --> 01:46:33.199
everyone's up early go go go

01:46:30.800 --> 01:46:35.840
innovate progress make that money so you

01:46:33.198 --> 01:46:38.000
can buy more things and every year hey

01:46:35.840 --> 01:46:40.319
apple where's this [ __ ] new phone as

01:46:38.000 --> 01:46:42.158
if your phone isn't good enough yeah

01:46:40.319 --> 01:46:44.559
like your phone's taking pictures and

01:46:42.158 --> 01:46:46.158
videos and people are calling you and

01:46:44.560 --> 01:46:48.000
you got applications to tell you which

01:46:46.158 --> 01:46:49.920
way the wind's blowing it's not good

01:46:48.000 --> 01:46:51.439
enough a blink of an eye blink of an eye

01:46:49.920 --> 01:46:53.600
it's all gone though that you know like

01:46:51.439 --> 01:46:55.198
10 000 years and the hoover dam goes or

01:46:53.600 --> 01:46:57.199
whatever you know mount rushmore

01:46:55.198 --> 01:46:58.960
disintegrates so it's amazing because we

01:46:57.198 --> 01:47:00.399
have created that and and everything's

01:46:58.960 --> 01:47:02.480
trying to spring up through that we keep

01:47:00.399 --> 01:47:04.399
it maintenance down but we're we're a

01:47:02.479 --> 01:47:05.839
blink man something hits

01:47:04.399 --> 01:47:07.599
but we don't think that way well you

01:47:05.840 --> 01:47:09.199
know you think in terms of your own life

01:47:07.600 --> 01:47:11.360
right you think in terms of what you

01:47:09.198 --> 01:47:14.000
want and what you need right now

01:47:11.359 --> 01:47:16.799
you know what it's we are in many ways

01:47:14.000 --> 01:47:18.639
this combination of this weird primitive

01:47:16.800 --> 01:47:19.679
ape-like thing

01:47:18.639 --> 01:47:22.719
with

01:47:19.679 --> 01:47:24.480
the ability to calculate and manipulate

01:47:22.719 --> 01:47:26.079
our world and our environment that makes

01:47:24.479 --> 01:47:28.959
us wholly unique on top of that with

01:47:26.079 --> 01:47:30.238
existential angst and and fear so what

01:47:28.960 --> 01:47:32.319
do you do with that we [ __ ] water it

01:47:30.238 --> 01:47:33.519
down with the anti-depressants give

01:47:32.319 --> 01:47:34.719
these [ __ ] people some [ __ ] that

01:47:33.520 --> 01:47:36.000
keeps them moving

01:47:34.719 --> 01:47:37.520
they're worried about the future they're

01:47:36.000 --> 01:47:39.439
trying to figure out what reality is if

01:47:37.520 --> 01:47:41.199
this you're on a goddamn convertible

01:47:39.439 --> 01:47:43.759
spaceship spinning a thousand miles an

01:47:41.198 --> 01:47:45.439
hour hurling through infinity there's no

01:47:43.760 --> 01:47:48.719
meaning to this thing just keep making

01:47:45.439 --> 01:47:49.919
[ __ ] keep making stuff and then one day

01:47:48.719 --> 01:47:53.039
they're going to be able to hit that

01:47:49.920 --> 01:47:56.158
switch and this life will be born out of

01:47:53.039 --> 01:47:59.279
innovation and thinking and progress and

01:47:56.158 --> 01:48:01.039
technology and more than likely it's

01:47:59.279 --> 01:48:03.279
probably going to be what we're seeing

01:48:01.039 --> 01:48:04.560
that these things are that you're you're

01:48:03.279 --> 01:48:06.079
observing

01:48:04.560 --> 01:48:07.199
i'm not observing them but yeah

01:48:06.079 --> 01:48:09.118
someone's obviously

01:48:07.198 --> 01:48:11.039
are you implying that they're us

01:48:09.118 --> 01:48:13.519
i don't think they are us but i think

01:48:11.039 --> 01:48:15.039
they are what happens when things keep

01:48:13.520 --> 01:48:16.960
going

01:48:15.039 --> 01:48:19.039
it's not us just like we're not monkeys

01:48:16.960 --> 01:48:20.239
right i'm not a chimp

01:48:19.039 --> 01:48:23.279
oh that'd be cool

01:48:20.238 --> 01:48:25.039
they're from here is your idea no no no

01:48:23.279 --> 01:48:26.960
that this is what happens all over the

01:48:25.039 --> 01:48:28.560
universe right yeah this is what

01:48:26.960 --> 01:48:31.359
happened look here's the thing you know

01:48:28.560 --> 01:48:34.639
i went to see brian cox's um

01:48:31.359 --> 01:48:35.920
he has this amazing live show with robin

01:48:34.639 --> 01:48:39.199
ins where they

01:48:35.920 --> 01:48:42.000
they have these led screens these huge

01:48:39.198 --> 01:48:43.599
screens with high resolution depictions

01:48:42.000 --> 01:48:45.679
of the cosmos and one of the most

01:48:43.600 --> 01:48:48.719
mind-blowing things

01:48:45.679 --> 01:48:51.520
was he has this large-scale image of the

01:48:48.719 --> 01:48:52.880
universe and it shows all the individual

01:48:51.520 --> 01:48:55.040
galaxies of the universe and it just

01:48:52.880 --> 01:48:56.400
keeps moving through all these galaxies

01:48:55.039 --> 01:48:58.560
in three dimensions

01:48:56.399 --> 01:49:01.198
and it's [ __ ] incredible but what's

01:48:58.560 --> 01:49:03.440
stunning is the relative uniformity of

01:49:01.198 --> 01:49:05.519
it even at you know i mean you're

01:49:03.439 --> 01:49:07.919
obviously looking at

01:49:05.520 --> 01:49:10.000
an incredibly small depiction of

01:49:07.920 --> 01:49:11.760
something that's immensely large like a

01:49:10.000 --> 01:49:13.600
galaxy of hundreds of billions of stars

01:49:11.760 --> 01:49:16.159
you're seeing it as this little dot but

01:49:13.600 --> 01:49:18.719
this little dot that's flying through

01:49:16.158 --> 01:49:22.079
space surrounded by other little darts

01:49:18.719 --> 01:49:23.359
with very similarly spaced distances

01:49:22.079 --> 01:49:25.840
yeah

01:49:23.359 --> 01:49:28.319
yeah so mike if we see uniformity in

01:49:25.840 --> 01:49:30.639
that form in terms of like the distance

01:49:28.319 --> 01:49:32.960
between galaxy so many galaxies is so

01:49:30.639 --> 01:49:34.400
it's so similar they might vary slightly

01:49:32.960 --> 01:49:36.399
and that slightly might be hundreds of

01:49:34.399 --> 01:49:38.879
millions of light years right but but

01:49:36.399 --> 01:49:41.039
but there's so much uniformity why would

01:49:38.880 --> 01:49:43.118
we not assume that that uniformity

01:49:41.039 --> 01:49:44.560
exists pretty much everywhere and that

01:49:43.118 --> 01:49:47.198
all these things that you're seeing that

01:49:44.560 --> 01:49:49.199
are so similar you do see binary star

01:49:47.198 --> 01:49:50.879
systems you do see single star systems

01:49:49.198 --> 01:49:52.479
like star but there's also some some

01:49:50.880 --> 01:49:54.480
speculation that earth and that our

01:49:52.479 --> 01:49:56.238
solar system is one time was a binary

01:49:54.479 --> 01:49:58.399
star system right i mean that's one of

01:49:56.238 --> 01:50:00.399
the the speculations about that that

01:49:58.399 --> 01:50:01.920
object that they find outside the kuiper

01:50:00.399 --> 01:50:03.198
belt that they think is 10 times larger

01:50:01.920 --> 01:50:06.000
than earth they think it might have been

01:50:03.198 --> 01:50:07.839
at one point in time a star but this

01:50:06.000 --> 01:50:09.359
this uniformity that you see why

01:50:07.840 --> 01:50:11.760
wouldn't we think that that

01:50:09.359 --> 01:50:13.839
that has its same implications

01:50:11.760 --> 01:50:15.840
biologically that there's some sort of a

01:50:13.840 --> 01:50:16.880
biological uniformity and that this

01:50:15.840 --> 01:50:19.440
happens

01:50:16.880 --> 01:50:20.800
given the right sets of circumstances

01:50:19.439 --> 01:50:22.879
you should tell them some of the stuff

01:50:20.800 --> 01:50:24.960
that you read that you don't know is

01:50:22.880 --> 01:50:26.159
true i mean if the the stuff was true

01:50:24.960 --> 01:50:28.158
about the

01:50:26.158 --> 01:50:29.439
propulsion stuff i mean anyway he well

01:50:28.158 --> 01:50:31.679
what have you read

01:50:29.439 --> 01:50:34.000
what you saw too and you know what are

01:50:31.679 --> 01:50:36.158
you talking about

01:50:34.000 --> 01:50:37.600
spill the beans bob

01:50:36.158 --> 01:50:39.839
i gotta poke the bear here let's get

01:50:37.600 --> 01:50:42.079
some more liquor in you

01:50:39.840 --> 01:50:43.679
the um

01:50:42.079 --> 01:50:46.319
well i mean

01:50:43.679 --> 01:50:49.840
the again the the only thing i could

01:50:46.319 --> 01:50:51.039
verify was what i had my hands on um

01:50:49.840 --> 01:50:52.719
they were

01:50:51.039 --> 01:50:54.319
you know there was talk of weapon

01:50:52.719 --> 01:50:56.800
systems that there were different

01:50:54.319 --> 01:50:58.319
projects project galileo project

01:50:56.800 --> 01:51:00.960
sidekick was supposed to be weapon

01:50:58.319 --> 01:51:03.198
applications of the craft

01:51:00.960 --> 01:51:05.600
project looking glass had to do with

01:51:03.198 --> 01:51:07.599
time any effects of time in the craft

01:51:05.600 --> 01:51:09.679
now i don't think we're not

01:51:07.600 --> 01:51:11.600
talking about making a time machine like

01:51:09.679 --> 01:51:13.440
in science fiction but we're talking

01:51:11.600 --> 01:51:15.840
about you know small distortions

01:51:13.439 --> 01:51:16.960
intentional distortions of time and how

01:51:15.840 --> 01:51:18.000
that can be

01:51:16.960 --> 01:51:21.198
used

01:51:18.000 --> 01:51:22.800
you know as a uh not as a well it was

01:51:21.198 --> 01:51:24.479
part of a weapon program how are you

01:51:22.800 --> 01:51:26.239
informed in this these again where

01:51:24.479 --> 01:51:27.919
there's just those small briefings that

01:51:26.238 --> 01:51:29.599
i read but

01:51:27.920 --> 01:51:30.880
again i don't really like to talk about

01:51:29.600 --> 01:51:32.719
those because i don't have any

01:51:30.880 --> 01:51:34.480
information on them and it was just you

01:51:32.719 --> 01:51:36.639
know small briefings but he told

01:51:34.479 --> 01:51:39.359
commander fravor that what he saw might

01:51:36.639 --> 01:51:41.520
have been a time dilation

01:51:39.359 --> 01:51:43.679
well it could be because gravity affects

01:51:41.520 --> 01:51:46.400
time you know space time i'm sure you've

01:51:43.679 --> 01:51:49.199
heard of that and um

01:51:46.399 --> 01:51:52.238
you know what what commander fraber saw

01:51:49.198 --> 01:51:54.960
as he was in the f-18 approaching it he

01:51:52.238 --> 01:51:56.638
said that he described it as a

01:51:54.960 --> 01:51:59.039
ping-pong ball in a cup and shaking it

01:51:56.639 --> 01:52:00.800
back and forth it was moving that fast

01:51:59.039 --> 01:52:01.599
now obviously if there's anything inside

01:52:00.800 --> 01:52:04.400
there

01:52:01.599 --> 01:52:07.039
it it's going to be battered to hell but

01:52:04.399 --> 01:52:08.559
you know my point was was that well one

01:52:07.039 --> 01:52:10.719
of two things

01:52:08.560 --> 01:52:13.199
either there's a gravitational envelope

01:52:10.719 --> 01:52:14.158
in there which negates any inertia

01:52:13.198 --> 01:52:15.598
effects

01:52:14.158 --> 01:52:17.519
or

01:52:15.599 --> 01:52:19.520
you are seeing through a gravity

01:52:17.520 --> 01:52:21.360
distortion field

01:52:19.520 --> 01:52:22.080
so you know just like you're looking at

01:52:21.359 --> 01:52:24.799
a

01:52:22.079 --> 01:52:26.960
a hot highway and you see

01:52:24.800 --> 01:52:28.239
you know an optical distortion going

01:52:26.960 --> 01:52:30.239
through there well the same thing

01:52:28.238 --> 01:52:32.238
happens in gravity and the craft may not

01:52:30.238 --> 01:52:34.799
actually be moving like that it may just

01:52:32.238 --> 01:52:37.678
look like it because you're seeing you

01:52:34.800 --> 01:52:40.239
can only see it through the field so it

01:52:37.679 --> 01:52:42.719
may be making much more gentle moves i'm

01:52:40.238 --> 01:52:44.399
not saying that's it but it has to be

01:52:42.719 --> 01:52:46.800
one of the two

01:52:44.399 --> 01:52:49.920
and the thing shows up 60 miles away

01:52:46.800 --> 01:52:52.400
they noticed it on radar 60 seconds

01:52:49.920 --> 01:52:54.239
after left commander favor but it was at

01:52:52.399 --> 01:52:56.079
his cap point which is the next point he

01:52:54.238 --> 01:53:00.319
was destined to go to

01:52:56.079 --> 01:53:03.679
60 miles away and in 60 seconds on radar

01:53:00.319 --> 01:53:05.920
the same object ends up there so it's

01:53:03.679 --> 01:53:08.000
going a mile a second no

01:53:05.920 --> 01:53:09.599
they i think the radar just picked it up

01:53:08.000 --> 01:53:11.118
in 60 seconds

01:53:09.599 --> 01:53:13.440
yeah it could have been there instantly

01:53:11.118 --> 01:53:15.359
but yeah we don't know the cycle time

01:53:13.439 --> 01:53:18.238
nobody knows that that's whole thing oh

01:53:15.359 --> 01:53:20.479
so it cycles like radar cycles yeah it

01:53:18.238 --> 01:53:22.799
doesn't it doesn't sweep but i mean it

01:53:20.479 --> 01:53:23.519
scans yeah it's a planar array so it

01:53:22.800 --> 01:53:24.320
just

01:53:23.520 --> 01:53:26.080
you know

01:53:24.319 --> 01:53:28.158
scans around it at random places that's

01:53:26.079 --> 01:53:30.319
a spy one does the really cool yeah it

01:53:28.158 --> 01:53:32.319
doesn't do the whole loop anymore right

01:53:30.319 --> 01:53:35.439
the point uh the point is though that

01:53:32.319 --> 01:53:38.079
the craft moved to his next location

01:53:35.439 --> 01:53:41.118
before he knew where his next location

01:53:38.079 --> 01:53:42.079
was gonna be jesus and

01:53:41.118 --> 01:53:44.719
that's

01:53:42.079 --> 01:53:47.359
i mean that's well documented

01:53:44.719 --> 01:53:49.439
so that's uh that's a pretty shocking

01:53:47.359 --> 01:53:50.880
piece of information what's fascinating

01:53:49.439 --> 01:53:55.039
to me too is that you were discussing

01:53:50.880 --> 01:53:56.560
this um the the way this reactor worked

01:53:55.039 --> 01:53:58.000
and that these things were not really

01:53:56.560 --> 01:54:00.320
connected

01:53:58.000 --> 01:54:04.479
no nothing is connected

01:54:00.319 --> 01:54:04.479
there's no wiring at all

01:54:04.880 --> 01:54:08.880
that freaks me the [ __ ] out charge your

01:54:06.639 --> 01:54:09.760
iphone you know yeah one wireless

01:54:08.880 --> 01:54:12.079
yeah

01:54:09.760 --> 01:54:13.599
yeah i mean that's the that's a simple

01:54:12.079 --> 01:54:15.519
electromagnetic

01:54:13.599 --> 01:54:17.679
yeah i know again but that's just simple

01:54:15.520 --> 01:54:19.599
electromagnet magnetic induction right

01:54:17.679 --> 01:54:22.719
but i mean tesla the scientist had this

01:54:19.599 --> 01:54:22.719
concept of right

01:54:24.079 --> 01:54:27.760
he wanted to send

01:54:25.599 --> 01:54:29.199
wireless electricity through the sky and

01:54:27.760 --> 01:54:30.800
westinghouse was like get the [ __ ] out

01:54:29.198 --> 01:54:32.799
of here with that like when anybody

01:54:30.800 --> 01:54:34.400
could just pull electricity out of this

01:54:32.800 --> 01:54:35.760
meter yeah they couldn't they couldn't

01:54:34.399 --> 01:54:36.960
just talk in the car right over and

01:54:35.760 --> 01:54:38.719
trying to chill him out you know we're

01:54:36.960 --> 01:54:40.239
talking about tesla and how he you know

01:54:38.719 --> 01:54:42.239
he couldn't be metered and how it all

01:54:40.238 --> 01:54:45.359
went down so it's funny bring it up yeah

01:54:42.238 --> 01:54:46.718
yeah that that i mean who knows what

01:54:45.359 --> 01:54:48.479
would have happened in terms of

01:54:46.719 --> 01:54:50.560
innovation had he been allowed to go

01:54:48.479 --> 01:54:52.158
forward with that well we probably

01:54:50.560 --> 01:54:53.440
wouldn't have computers

01:54:52.158 --> 01:54:55.439
you think

01:54:53.439 --> 01:54:57.519
yeah i'm pretty positive i mean forget

01:54:55.439 --> 01:55:00.079
about microelectronics well this is

01:54:57.520 --> 01:55:01.920
dumping huge amounts of electromagnetic

01:55:00.079 --> 01:55:06.000
energy in the air and yeah we'd be able

01:55:01.920 --> 01:55:07.920
to wirelessly turn on our lights but

01:55:06.000 --> 01:55:09.520
there'd be no radio communication the

01:55:07.920 --> 01:55:11.920
interference would be something we could

01:55:09.520 --> 01:55:13.760
would be overwhelming it would induce

01:55:11.920 --> 01:55:16.000
electric currents in anything with a

01:55:13.760 --> 01:55:17.840
small wire on it so integrated circuits

01:55:16.000 --> 01:55:20.319
transistors would be disintegrated

01:55:17.840 --> 01:55:23.039
before they were even you know tested

01:55:20.319 --> 01:55:25.198
for operation so it it would it would

01:55:23.039 --> 01:55:27.279
destroy [ __ ] us up yeah it would have

01:55:25.198 --> 01:55:29.039
stopped us dead we'd have it'd be great

01:55:27.279 --> 01:55:30.719
you could turn lighters on and heaters

01:55:29.039 --> 01:55:33.039
from all over the place with no wires

01:55:30.719 --> 01:55:34.719
but it would stop modern electronics and

01:55:33.039 --> 01:55:37.118
if we became dependent on it it would

01:55:34.719 --> 01:55:38.800
almost be like our dependence on fossil

01:55:37.118 --> 01:55:40.319
fuels although it's destructive it's

01:55:38.800 --> 01:55:41.679
very difficult for us to get off the

01:55:40.319 --> 01:55:42.960
nipple

01:55:41.679 --> 01:55:44.480
it would have changed the course of how

01:55:42.960 --> 01:55:46.399
we developed which is so interesting

01:55:44.479 --> 01:55:48.238
when you talk about if a civilization

01:55:46.399 --> 01:55:50.399
another star system didn't even start

01:55:48.238 --> 01:55:51.839
with fossil fuels they had 115 naturally

01:55:50.399 --> 01:55:53.759
on their planet and they're like cool

01:55:51.840 --> 01:55:55.440
anti-gravity is pretty awesome well the

01:55:53.760 --> 01:55:58.079
fact that i think it's important that

01:55:55.439 --> 01:55:59.598
that actually happened yeah

01:55:58.079 --> 01:56:00.960
it might have been stopped in its tracks

01:55:59.599 --> 01:56:02.480
for a reason

01:56:00.960 --> 01:56:04.480
whoa

01:56:02.479 --> 01:56:06.638
and

01:56:04.479 --> 01:56:08.319
it's just it's i think it's incredibly

01:56:06.639 --> 01:56:10.239
difficult for us to imagine

01:56:08.319 --> 01:56:11.439
technological progression under another

01:56:10.238 --> 01:56:14.479
timeline other than the one that we've

01:56:11.439 --> 01:56:16.879
experienced yeah that's difficult

01:56:14.479 --> 01:56:19.279
if we imagine what this

01:56:16.880 --> 01:56:20.800
alien race must have been like and

01:56:19.279 --> 01:56:23.359
i mean god

01:56:20.800 --> 01:56:25.039
just just to be able to see something

01:56:23.359 --> 01:56:26.639
take like i mean obviously we've seen it

01:56:25.039 --> 01:56:28.560
in different life forms right like we

01:56:26.639 --> 01:56:30.719
see the life of certain beetles in

01:56:28.560 --> 01:56:32.639
comparison to the life of certain fish

01:56:30.719 --> 01:56:35.520
very very different existence very

01:56:32.639 --> 01:56:37.440
different life cycles octopus yeah

01:56:35.520 --> 01:56:38.719
octopus yeah i mean we see all these

01:56:37.439 --> 01:56:41.118
different variables in terms of

01:56:38.719 --> 01:56:42.880
biological entities on earth but we

01:56:41.118 --> 01:56:45.039
don't see it in terms of technological

01:56:42.880 --> 01:56:47.118
innovation as we're the only one that's

01:56:45.039 --> 01:56:48.800
intelligent that can innovate when we

01:56:47.118 --> 01:56:50.399
have intelligent creatures but they're

01:56:48.800 --> 01:56:52.000
in the ocean the only other thing that

01:56:50.399 --> 01:56:54.000
are like us are dolphins and orcas and

01:56:52.000 --> 01:56:55.520
whales and they don't have the ability

01:56:54.000 --> 01:56:57.359
to manipulate their environment and

01:56:55.520 --> 01:56:59.280
subsequently because they don't have the

01:56:57.359 --> 01:57:01.359
ability to manipulate their environment

01:56:59.279 --> 01:57:03.599
we put them in fish tanks and we're like

01:57:01.359 --> 01:57:05.920
get in the tank do some tricks right

01:57:03.599 --> 01:57:08.159
you know the only thing he saw in the

01:57:05.920 --> 01:57:09.840
craft if we were considering bob's story

01:57:08.158 --> 01:57:11.759
the only thing that you he saw in the

01:57:09.840 --> 01:57:13.520
craft that he related to that looked

01:57:11.760 --> 01:57:15.360
like a human could make was this

01:57:13.520 --> 01:57:17.520
honeycomb hatch and i always loved that

01:57:15.359 --> 01:57:19.198
because you're like obsessed with this

01:57:17.520 --> 01:57:21.280
thing that you could recognize you know

01:57:19.198 --> 01:57:23.759
the re yeah i i only focus on that

01:57:21.279 --> 01:57:25.759
because it was the one thing that i

01:57:23.760 --> 01:57:27.679
understood how it worked what was it and

01:57:25.760 --> 01:57:28.639
it was it was the access to the level

01:57:27.679 --> 01:57:29.599
below

01:57:28.639 --> 01:57:31.679
and

01:57:29.599 --> 01:57:33.599
it was um

01:57:31.679 --> 01:57:35.840
well you know if you take uh

01:57:33.599 --> 01:57:37.679
you have a six pack of beer and you take

01:57:35.840 --> 01:57:40.079
out the cardboard dividers

01:57:37.679 --> 01:57:42.399
set it on the table you can put a lot of

01:57:40.079 --> 01:57:44.079
pressure on the top

01:57:42.399 --> 01:57:45.598
but if you push it from the sides it

01:57:44.079 --> 01:57:47.198
collapses flat

01:57:45.599 --> 01:57:49.520
so it was something like that in a

01:57:47.198 --> 01:57:52.719
honeycomb shape that was essentially

01:57:49.520 --> 01:57:54.719
some sort of sheet metal and you could

01:57:52.719 --> 01:57:57.118
walk on that in the upper layer but if

01:57:54.719 --> 01:57:59.840
you took the corner stuck your finger in

01:57:57.118 --> 01:58:01.920
and pushed it collapsed and made a

01:57:59.840 --> 01:58:04.480
an entryway so i thought that was a

01:58:01.920 --> 01:58:06.000
really unique i'd never seen that before

01:58:04.479 --> 01:58:08.079
and it was the only thing in the craft

01:58:06.000 --> 01:58:10.479
that made absolute sense to me i said ah

01:58:08.079 --> 01:58:13.118
we can make that and all that is is a

01:58:10.479 --> 01:58:15.198
hatchway was there any discussion about

01:58:13.118 --> 01:58:16.238
the materials that were used to make the

01:58:15.198 --> 01:58:17.839
craft

01:58:16.238 --> 01:58:19.598
i'm sure there was but that was a

01:58:17.840 --> 01:58:22.079
metallurgy division had nothing to do

01:58:19.599 --> 01:58:23.679
with us so you never got a

01:58:22.079 --> 01:58:25.279
not even the slightest briefing i don't

01:58:23.679 --> 01:58:28.158
even know if it was metal or it was

01:58:25.279 --> 01:58:30.319
ceramic it's i think it there's a fine

01:58:28.158 --> 01:58:32.319
line between the two

01:58:30.319 --> 01:58:34.719
now one of the things that's happened to

01:58:32.319 --> 01:58:36.158
you that has allowed people to discredit

01:58:34.719 --> 01:58:38.480
you was

01:58:36.158 --> 01:58:40.799
there's obviously been some sort of an

01:58:38.479 --> 01:58:43.519
effort to erase your past

01:58:40.800 --> 01:58:46.000
yeah some sort of a ref uh an effort to

01:58:43.520 --> 01:58:48.719
erase your education history your

01:58:46.000 --> 01:58:50.479
employment history at los alamos in fact

01:58:48.719 --> 01:58:52.239
the only way your employment history was

01:58:50.479 --> 01:58:54.638
proven at los alamos is someone got a

01:58:52.238 --> 01:58:55.839
list a directory of the employees from

01:58:54.639 --> 01:58:57.359
the past

01:58:55.840 --> 01:58:58.960
and read into it and you were on that

01:58:57.359 --> 01:59:00.158
list so it proved that you worked there

01:58:58.960 --> 01:59:01.279
even though people were trying to deny

01:59:00.158 --> 01:59:02.799
and they were trying to use that as a

01:59:01.279 --> 01:59:04.559
way to discredit you that you never did

01:59:02.800 --> 01:59:06.000
work at los alamos you weren't really a

01:59:04.560 --> 01:59:08.159
scientist

01:59:06.000 --> 01:59:09.279
what was what was that like to

01:59:08.158 --> 01:59:12.079
experience i mean of course we're

01:59:09.279 --> 01:59:13.679
talking about the 1980s the 1990s when

01:59:12.079 --> 01:59:14.960
you could get away with something like

01:59:13.679 --> 01:59:17.520
that

01:59:14.960 --> 01:59:18.719
yeah obviously there are a lot less

01:59:17.520 --> 01:59:20.719
uh

01:59:18.719 --> 01:59:22.880
a lot less records on computers at that

01:59:20.719 --> 01:59:25.599
time it was still file cabinets and

01:59:22.880 --> 01:59:28.800
folders but uh yeah that was frightening

01:59:25.599 --> 01:59:28.800
that was one of the first things

01:59:28.960 --> 01:59:32.719
i think it's i think george knapp was

01:59:30.719 --> 01:59:35.679
the first one that uncovered that i mean

01:59:32.719 --> 01:59:38.079
he saw my birth certificate disappear he

01:59:35.679 --> 01:59:39.520
um it disappeared yeah there was no

01:59:38.079 --> 01:59:42.238
record of you yeah there was there was

01:59:39.520 --> 01:59:44.320
no record of that there was uh no record

01:59:42.238 --> 01:59:46.799
his mom tells me about that like it was

01:59:44.319 --> 01:59:48.238
frightening for her for he's got a real

01:59:46.800 --> 01:59:49.760
family you know he's a real person it's

01:59:48.238 --> 01:59:51.759
frightening for her

01:59:49.760 --> 01:59:54.159
but if the los alamos thing really

01:59:51.760 --> 01:59:56.159
surprised me and that they were so

01:59:54.158 --> 01:59:58.000
adamant that no this guy never worked

01:59:56.158 --> 02:00:00.000
here don't be ridiculous and george went

01:59:58.000 --> 02:00:02.238
back and forth you know for i got the

02:00:00.000 --> 02:00:03.920
letters on the wall yeah months i mean

02:00:02.238 --> 02:00:06.879
it was ridiculous but fortunately

02:00:03.920 --> 02:00:09.599
somebody came up with a 1982 phone book

02:00:06.880 --> 02:00:12.960
directory i mean and also

02:00:09.599 --> 02:00:14.639
uh originally i told you uh

02:00:12.960 --> 02:00:16.639
you know when i worked there i was on

02:00:14.639 --> 02:00:18.880
the front page of the the paper so they

02:00:16.639 --> 02:00:20.480
were still able to archive you know

02:00:18.880 --> 02:00:22.159
bring that back from the archives and

02:00:20.479 --> 02:00:24.638
you know bob lazar a physicist working

02:00:22.158 --> 02:00:27.598
here at los alamos so there was at least

02:00:24.639 --> 02:00:29.599
something there but uh somehow george

02:00:27.599 --> 02:00:32.480
came up with the phone director and then

02:00:29.599 --> 02:00:35.199
george then bob took george with cameras

02:00:32.479 --> 02:00:37.279
into los alamos oh yeah yeah so we flew

02:00:35.198 --> 02:00:39.279
out there and i said look come on in

02:00:37.279 --> 02:00:41.118
i'll show you where i worked we'll go in

02:00:39.279 --> 02:00:43.039
we'll meet people and george went with

02:00:41.118 --> 02:00:44.960
me and you know

02:00:43.039 --> 02:00:47.760
i navigate the place oh yeah and you

02:00:44.960 --> 02:00:50.719
know met people and you know and almost

02:00:47.760 --> 02:00:53.199
was also the place where they had the

02:00:50.719 --> 02:00:55.520
machine that was able to read the the

02:00:53.198 --> 02:00:57.759
size of your digits no no that wasn't

02:00:55.520 --> 02:00:59.440
awesome that was s4 that was s4 and

02:00:57.760 --> 02:01:00.320
explain that

02:00:59.439 --> 02:01:02.238
so

02:01:00.319 --> 02:01:04.399
now this was back in the 80s and this is

02:01:02.238 --> 02:01:06.799
back in the 80s where when you discuss

02:01:04.399 --> 02:01:09.839
this people like this doesn't even exist

02:01:06.800 --> 02:01:11.119
yeah okay what was it it was a way

02:01:09.840 --> 02:01:12.480
you know this is before fingerprint

02:01:11.118 --> 02:01:15.598
scanners and

02:01:12.479 --> 02:01:17.598
you know and anything of

02:01:15.599 --> 02:01:19.840
anything any high resolution scanner at

02:01:17.599 --> 02:01:22.239
that time so what it was was a device

02:01:19.840 --> 02:01:24.880
that uh had a little picture of a hand

02:01:22.238 --> 02:01:26.879
on a glass plate with pins in it so you

02:01:24.880 --> 02:01:28.880
could jam your hand in there and there

02:01:26.880 --> 02:01:31.440
was a bright light above it and a sensor

02:01:28.880 --> 02:01:33.520
underneath and when you put your hand in

02:01:31.439 --> 02:01:36.000
there the light would turn on and it

02:01:33.520 --> 02:01:37.599
would measure the bones in your finger

02:01:36.000 --> 02:01:38.639
because the light shown through your

02:01:37.599 --> 02:01:41.679
bones

02:01:38.639 --> 02:01:43.440
and apparently

02:01:41.679 --> 02:01:46.079
the length of the bones in your fingers

02:01:43.439 --> 02:01:48.238
are extremely unique and easy to measure

02:01:46.079 --> 02:01:49.760
and they use that when you put your

02:01:48.238 --> 02:01:51.519
hands on there the light would turn on

02:01:49.760 --> 02:01:53.520
and your badge would pop out there's it

02:01:51.520 --> 02:01:55.760
right oh there it is that's that's it

02:01:53.520 --> 02:01:57.599
and i tried to describe this um to

02:01:55.760 --> 02:01:59.679
people and they said that is the most

02:01:57.599 --> 02:02:00.960
ridiculous thing we've ever heard

02:01:59.679 --> 02:02:02.960
and um

02:02:00.960 --> 02:02:05.118
i said hey that my badge came out of

02:02:02.960 --> 02:02:06.639
that thing i put my hand on it badge

02:02:05.118 --> 02:02:08.559
popped out and that's how i could open

02:02:06.639 --> 02:02:10.719
the doors and get into s4

02:02:08.560 --> 02:02:12.000
and um you know and everybody

02:02:10.719 --> 02:02:13.760
discredited that they said it was

02:02:12.000 --> 02:02:15.760
[ __ ] it was science fiction and

02:02:13.760 --> 02:02:17.520
jeremy you found this

02:02:15.760 --> 02:02:19.440
i i found it through a good friend of

02:02:17.520 --> 02:02:21.679
mine named tyler rogoway and he had some

02:02:19.439 --> 02:02:24.079
good sources inside of area 52 where

02:02:21.679 --> 02:02:26.319
they also used these for the stealth

02:02:24.079 --> 02:02:27.599
program right around that time so now

02:02:26.319 --> 02:02:30.399
i've got all these people that worked

02:02:27.599 --> 02:02:32.319
within who you know said only if you're

02:02:30.399 --> 02:02:33.598
in certain programs would we use this

02:02:32.319 --> 02:02:34.799
technology it's kind of [ __ ] actually

02:02:33.599 --> 02:02:36.719
they didn't keep it for very long

02:02:34.800 --> 02:02:38.719
beginning of biometrics so i was able to

02:02:36.719 --> 02:02:41.279
reveal it in my film i kept my mouth

02:02:38.719 --> 02:02:43.039
shut until i showed it to bob you know

02:02:41.279 --> 02:02:44.639
the movie is the first time he saw it

02:02:43.039 --> 02:02:46.079
was how you see it in the documentary

02:02:44.639 --> 02:02:47.840
that's his genuine reaction i'm getting

02:02:46.079 --> 02:02:49.039
goosebumps that was a great idea the way

02:02:47.840 --> 02:02:50.560
you did it thank you man because you

02:02:49.039 --> 02:02:52.319
know what guess what i'm actually trying

02:02:50.560 --> 02:02:53.840
to see if he's telling the truth that's

02:02:52.319 --> 02:02:55.198
how i started you know that's how i

02:02:53.840 --> 02:02:57.760
started so it was really cool to see

02:02:55.198 --> 02:03:00.158
that that you get to see it his actual

02:02:57.760 --> 02:03:01.840
reaction has that been verified by other

02:03:00.158 --> 02:03:04.879
people yeah so

02:03:01.840 --> 02:03:06.400
yeah so to me it has uh personally i get

02:03:04.880 --> 02:03:08.079
emails every day and people are telling

02:03:06.399 --> 02:03:09.759
me where these are used and how they're

02:03:08.079 --> 02:03:11.279
used and send me photos i got a lot of

02:03:09.760 --> 02:03:12.719
photos of identity mats now well how

02:03:11.279 --> 02:03:15.039
they were used right they're not how

02:03:12.719 --> 02:03:16.800
they were used yeah but uh i don't the

02:03:15.039 --> 02:03:18.158
most recent one was

02:03:16.800 --> 02:03:20.159
way more recent than i thought in

02:03:18.158 --> 02:03:23.279
another country but yeah that technology

02:03:20.158 --> 02:03:24.238
was used so what's so funny is

02:03:23.279 --> 02:03:28.079
um

02:03:24.238 --> 02:03:29.678
that this technology even in the area 52

02:03:28.079 --> 02:03:31.679
where they'd use him for tonopah one of

02:03:29.679 --> 02:03:33.920
the guys who will go on camera with me

02:03:31.679 --> 02:03:36.000
he will do an interview with me he was a

02:03:33.920 --> 02:03:37.840
technician for one of these and and he

02:03:36.000 --> 02:03:39.920
hated them because they were really bad

02:03:37.840 --> 02:03:41.679
they always broke down and never and he

02:03:39.920 --> 02:03:44.319
was a technician for him now he won't

02:03:41.679 --> 02:03:46.000
tell me where if he worked at area 52 so

02:03:44.319 --> 02:03:48.000
it's probably tonopah

02:03:46.000 --> 02:03:49.439
it's very separated even on base but

02:03:48.000 --> 02:03:52.479
yeah so

02:03:49.439 --> 02:03:55.279
there was that yeah there is your

02:03:52.479 --> 02:03:57.678
education record that was also like what

02:03:55.279 --> 02:04:00.000
happened with that

02:03:57.679 --> 02:04:02.800
well that disappeared also you know that

02:04:00.000 --> 02:04:05.679
i i've i've never gone

02:04:02.800 --> 02:04:07.760
i've never gone anywhere for education

02:04:05.679 --> 02:04:09.520
i've never gone i never attended any

02:04:07.760 --> 02:04:11.760
classes at caltech i never attended

02:04:09.520 --> 02:04:14.000
anything at mit

02:04:11.760 --> 02:04:15.760
you did attend classes in those places i

02:04:14.000 --> 02:04:17.279
did attend classes in those places do

02:04:15.760 --> 02:04:18.159
you know anybody that you went to school

02:04:17.279 --> 02:04:20.399
with

02:04:18.158 --> 02:04:21.920
yes i do and have they verified that

02:04:20.399 --> 02:04:24.719
they went to school with you well i gave

02:04:21.920 --> 02:04:27.359
jeremy some names but people yeah i the

02:04:24.719 --> 02:04:30.239
reason i don't say these names publicly

02:04:27.359 --> 02:04:32.319
is because every single time i mention a

02:04:30.238 --> 02:04:36.079
name somebody gets injured they don't

02:04:32.319 --> 02:04:38.399
want to be of course yeah yeah of course

02:04:36.079 --> 02:04:41.039
um but what what is that experience like

02:04:38.399 --> 02:04:43.039
seeing your birth certificate erased

02:04:41.039 --> 02:04:45.118
seeing your employment well it's

02:04:43.039 --> 02:04:46.880
frightening it's it's absolutely

02:04:45.118 --> 02:04:49.118
frightening it's also the fuel that the

02:04:46.880 --> 02:04:51.760
debunkers use the so-called air quote

02:04:49.118 --> 02:04:53.039
skeptics i don't like the term skeptics

02:04:51.760 --> 02:04:54.800
i'm going to say this publicly because i

02:04:53.039 --> 02:04:57.760
really only said this privately i think

02:04:54.800 --> 02:05:00.079
it's a sloppy lazy way to look at things

02:04:57.760 --> 02:05:02.320
to just be a skeptic

02:05:00.079 --> 02:05:04.639
i want people to be objective

02:05:02.319 --> 02:05:07.039
and i think there's a lot of things you

02:05:04.639 --> 02:05:09.440
should be skeptical of i think you

02:05:07.039 --> 02:05:11.118
should you should look at things and

02:05:09.439 --> 02:05:13.678
look at things

02:05:11.118 --> 02:05:15.839
from a hard-line science perspective you

02:05:13.679 --> 02:05:17.440
should be subjective but the idea of

02:05:15.840 --> 02:05:19.279
skeptics the problem with that is you're

02:05:17.439 --> 02:05:20.879
always looking for things to be [ __ ]

02:05:19.279 --> 02:05:22.238
yeah and i think that's dangerous

02:05:20.880 --> 02:05:23.840
because i think some things aren't

02:05:22.238 --> 02:05:25.359
[ __ ] it's confirmation bias on the

02:05:23.840 --> 02:05:26.880
other end you're just deciding to take a

02:05:25.359 --> 02:05:29.118
square thing and put it around hold no

02:05:26.880 --> 02:05:30.239
matter what and i find a lot of them to

02:05:29.118 --> 02:05:32.079
be lazy

02:05:30.238 --> 02:05:33.839
a lot of them to be lazy thinkers sure

02:05:32.079 --> 02:05:36.479
because they're always putting it into

02:05:33.840 --> 02:05:38.400
that box instead of going hmm

02:05:36.479 --> 02:05:40.079
instead of just separating their ego

02:05:38.399 --> 02:05:42.158
they're trying they're playing a game

02:05:40.079 --> 02:05:44.238
and the game is calling [ __ ] i want

02:05:42.158 --> 02:05:45.920
to call [ __ ] and i'm gonna line up

02:05:44.238 --> 02:05:47.678
all these reasons why it's [ __ ] and

02:05:45.920 --> 02:05:50.000
i'm gonna ignore anything that might be

02:05:47.679 --> 02:05:51.279
contrary to that definition yeah

02:05:50.000 --> 02:05:52.880
every time i'm thinking i'm going to

02:05:51.279 --> 02:05:55.439
catch him in something you know all

02:05:52.880 --> 02:05:56.639
along this process um i found dr krangle

02:05:55.439 --> 02:05:58.479
he came forward and said i was in

02:05:56.639 --> 02:06:00.400
security briefings with bob lazar the

02:05:58.479 --> 02:06:02.158
physicist at los angeles he went on the

02:06:00.399 --> 02:06:03.679
record with me now the other people i

02:06:02.158 --> 02:06:05.279
talked with why won't they go on the

02:06:03.679 --> 02:06:07.039
record with me because they're still

02:06:05.279 --> 02:06:08.479
working there

02:06:07.039 --> 02:06:10.238
so that that's the difference right what

02:06:08.479 --> 02:06:11.519
is that what can the public have right

02:06:10.238 --> 02:06:12.718
or even if they're not working there

02:06:11.520 --> 02:06:14.560
that you know they want to live their

02:06:12.719 --> 02:06:17.840
lives why i mean obviously people have

02:06:14.560 --> 02:06:20.320
seen what's happened to you mike thigpen

02:06:17.840 --> 02:06:23.039
after 30 years yeah really if you look

02:06:20.319 --> 02:06:25.599
at all the information on

02:06:23.039 --> 02:06:27.519
you know concerning my accounts that's

02:06:25.599 --> 02:06:30.159
that's verifiable

02:06:27.520 --> 02:06:32.800
it can't possibly be a [ __ ] story

02:06:30.158 --> 02:06:35.439
anymore it's really way past that point

02:06:32.800 --> 02:06:38.560
yeah i mean that was my big pin is i

02:06:35.439 --> 02:06:40.799
mean how could i possibly know

02:06:38.560 --> 02:06:42.800
uh so mike fig pin

02:06:40.800 --> 02:06:44.880
was the guy that did the security

02:06:42.800 --> 02:06:46.159
clearances to go to the bait one of the

02:06:44.880 --> 02:06:48.239
guys that was this is the guy that you

02:06:46.158 --> 02:06:50.399
worked with he said he did

02:06:48.238 --> 02:06:52.000
right and and george knapp you know

02:06:50.399 --> 02:06:54.479
george didn't believe him george put him

02:06:52.000 --> 02:06:56.960
through four polygraph tests right he

02:06:54.479 --> 02:06:58.799
tried to see man this is a big risk it

02:06:56.960 --> 02:07:01.439
sounds interesting but let's see if he's

02:06:58.800 --> 02:07:02.560
telling the truth one of the things was

02:07:01.439 --> 02:07:04.158
bob said there's a guy named mike

02:07:02.560 --> 02:07:06.480
thigpen he did security clearances for

02:07:04.158 --> 02:07:07.920
the base and that's a weird name it's

02:07:06.479 --> 02:07:10.238
very specific

02:07:07.920 --> 02:07:12.000
for 30 years george

02:07:10.238 --> 02:07:13.519
found this guy in this weird department

02:07:12.000 --> 02:07:15.359
that he didn't even know it was my big

02:07:13.520 --> 02:07:17.360
pin the guy wouldn't talk to me ghosted

02:07:15.359 --> 02:07:19.359
him totally ghosting for 30 years used

02:07:17.359 --> 02:07:21.359
facebook and google image match through

02:07:19.359 --> 02:07:23.598
his children i was able to find him

02:07:21.359 --> 02:07:25.519
after 30 years and i talked to him three

02:07:23.599 --> 02:07:28.159
times on the phone he lives on the east

02:07:25.520 --> 02:07:29.520
coast he almost went on camera with me

02:07:28.158 --> 02:07:31.598
confirmed that he did security

02:07:29.520 --> 02:07:34.159
clearances for the base in 1989

02:07:31.599 --> 02:07:35.520
confirmed he remembers bob lazar and

02:07:34.158 --> 02:07:37.519
what you don't know is there's a

02:07:35.520 --> 02:07:40.239
handwritten note that a friend of yours

02:07:37.520 --> 02:07:42.000
has from mike what i know i'm gonna give

02:07:40.238 --> 02:07:43.519
it to you later i don't but that is real

02:07:42.000 --> 02:07:45.039
that is actual so a handwritten note

02:07:43.520 --> 02:07:47.599
that says what you know like this is new

02:07:45.039 --> 02:07:49.920
to me so when the i

02:07:47.599 --> 02:07:49.920
when you're

02:07:50.479 --> 02:07:53.919
when they do security client clearances

02:07:52.479 --> 02:07:55.198
they go through all your friends and

02:07:53.920 --> 02:07:57.840
they go to your friend's phone yeah yeah

02:07:55.198 --> 02:07:59.279
so this is too bob and

02:07:57.840 --> 02:08:00.719
i had people come to me for a friend of

02:07:59.279 --> 02:08:02.078
mine that's serving and they're doing

02:08:00.719 --> 02:08:04.239
the security clearance for him and even

02:08:02.078 --> 02:08:06.158
though i'm like the ufo guy

02:08:04.238 --> 02:08:08.000
they did you know the fbi come and visit

02:08:06.158 --> 02:08:09.920
my house and make sure that they talk

02:08:08.000 --> 02:08:11.920
about my friend and they lift a little

02:08:09.920 --> 02:08:12.960
card and when my wife told him to get

02:08:11.920 --> 02:08:14.800
away because he didn't know who they

02:08:12.960 --> 02:08:16.960
were they left a little card it's super

02:08:14.800 --> 02:08:18.800
cute now back then it was a handwritten

02:08:16.960 --> 02:08:21.279
note and his friend has it for him that

02:08:18.800 --> 02:08:22.639
you haven't seen in oh my god two

02:08:21.279 --> 02:08:24.078
decades

02:08:22.639 --> 02:08:25.760
so if you're listening

02:08:24.078 --> 02:08:27.279
you're telling me what it is

02:08:25.760 --> 02:08:28.960
what is this card

02:08:27.279 --> 02:08:31.279
it's just a little handwritten note with

02:08:28.960 --> 02:08:32.960
mike thigpen's signature card like like

02:08:31.279 --> 02:08:34.719
a like a postcard

02:08:32.960 --> 02:08:36.639
like a piece of paper that he left on

02:08:34.719 --> 02:08:38.639
the door saying when bob gets back or

02:08:36.639 --> 02:08:40.400
whatever it says on it so it's just

02:08:38.639 --> 02:08:42.078
another little funny thing i found the

02:08:40.399 --> 02:08:43.759
guy he does the security clearances he

02:08:42.078 --> 02:08:45.279
admitted to me he did it and he admitted

02:08:43.760 --> 02:08:46.719
to me he was dodging george knapp

02:08:45.279 --> 02:08:49.279
because when george said his name on the

02:08:46.719 --> 02:08:51.359
writ on the on the news he dropped his

02:08:49.279 --> 02:08:53.279
fork into his steak or into his potatoes

02:08:51.359 --> 02:08:54.799
or whatever and he's looking at his wife

02:08:53.279 --> 02:08:56.078
he was in trouble his name's never

02:08:54.800 --> 02:08:57.840
supposed to be out there like it's just

02:08:56.078 --> 02:09:00.078
a security clearance guy but you don't

02:08:57.840 --> 02:09:02.480
want national attention associated with

02:09:00.078 --> 02:09:05.279
anything bob has to say but anyway this

02:09:02.479 --> 02:09:06.718
unique name bob said for 30 years and

02:09:05.279 --> 02:09:08.639
the guy ghosted george knapp george

02:09:06.719 --> 02:09:10.239
could prove he existed he actually

02:09:08.639 --> 02:09:12.800
talked to me man he talked to me three

02:09:10.238 --> 02:09:14.399
times he almost went on camera with me

02:09:12.800 --> 02:09:16.159
it's just crazy what what do you what

02:09:14.399 --> 02:09:18.879
happens after 30 years you just get more

02:09:16.158 --> 02:09:22.559
info well that's one of the reasons why

02:09:18.880 --> 02:09:24.560
when you and me and jeremy and george

02:09:22.560 --> 02:09:26.880
knapp had that conversation on the phone

02:09:24.560 --> 02:09:28.480
yeah i said i think

02:09:26.880 --> 02:09:30.239
what we can do

02:09:28.479 --> 02:09:33.198
with this podcast

02:09:30.238 --> 02:09:35.759
is important i really do i think it's

02:09:33.198 --> 02:09:39.439
important for people to hear this

02:09:35.760 --> 02:09:43.119
from you in a very clear

02:09:39.439 --> 02:09:46.238
just very concise way

02:09:43.118 --> 02:09:48.238
and if you examine all the information

02:09:46.238 --> 02:09:49.919
that you've said today if you you look

02:09:48.238 --> 02:09:52.638
at all the things that the detractors

02:09:49.920 --> 02:09:54.639
have said if you look at all of the new

02:09:52.639 --> 02:09:56.400
recent evidence that's coming out and

02:09:54.639 --> 02:09:58.560
all these

02:09:56.399 --> 02:10:00.000
really high-level people in the military

02:09:58.560 --> 02:10:01.280
and the government that are discussing

02:10:00.000 --> 02:10:03.760
this

02:10:01.279 --> 02:10:06.319
it gives you

02:10:03.760 --> 02:10:09.360
far more credibility than you would have

02:10:06.319 --> 02:10:12.078
had in the 19 years when this came out

02:10:09.359 --> 02:10:13.839
[ __ ] yes you can't ignore his story just

02:10:12.078 --> 02:10:15.039
because you don't like it anymore that's

02:10:13.840 --> 02:10:17.679
why i thought it was important that you

02:10:15.039 --> 02:10:19.679
come out and refresh the world's memory

02:10:17.679 --> 02:10:21.520
and let people know and like i said i've

02:10:19.679 --> 02:10:23.279
been i mean i want to say i'm a fan of

02:10:21.520 --> 02:10:25.040
yours but i guess i'm a fan of yours as

02:10:23.279 --> 02:10:27.198
a human being i'm a fan of yours but

02:10:25.039 --> 02:10:28.800
i've been following you for decades i've

02:10:27.198 --> 02:10:31.439
been following the story for decades i

02:10:28.800 --> 02:10:33.760
mean i'm kidding i have vhs tapes bob

02:10:31.439 --> 02:10:36.799
like a lot of the world has yeah it's

02:10:33.760 --> 02:10:40.719
crazy well anybody that has any sort of

02:10:36.800 --> 02:10:43.599
uh a vested interest or a just a even uh

02:10:40.719 --> 02:10:46.480
just a fascination with ufos has

02:10:43.599 --> 02:10:48.719
followed your story because there's no

02:10:46.479 --> 02:10:50.559
one else there's no one else that comes

02:10:48.719 --> 02:10:52.000
for this some guy who said i worked

02:10:50.560 --> 02:10:53.599
underground with the aliens they shot my

02:10:52.000 --> 02:10:54.560
hand off like there's a bunch of wacky

02:10:53.599 --> 02:10:55.840
dudes

02:10:54.560 --> 02:10:56.800
they're underground there's bases

02:10:55.840 --> 02:10:58.239
they're shooting lasers through the

02:10:56.800 --> 02:11:00.639
earth's crust and they move them at

02:10:58.238 --> 02:11:02.559
light speed there's a lot of those guys

02:11:00.639 --> 02:11:04.719
they seem schizophrenic they seem crazy

02:11:02.560 --> 02:11:06.639
they might even be disinformation agents

02:11:04.719 --> 02:11:09.118
they might be people that are designed

02:11:06.639 --> 02:11:10.719
to muddy the waters which for sure has

02:11:09.118 --> 02:11:12.559
happened people are coming forward

02:11:10.719 --> 02:11:13.920
though now it's amazing by doing this

02:11:12.560 --> 02:11:16.000
what you're doing you're providing an

02:11:13.920 --> 02:11:18.000
opportunity for bob to tell a story you

02:11:16.000 --> 02:11:20.560
know believe it or not he can tell a

02:11:18.000 --> 02:11:22.399
story it's amazing because more people

02:11:20.560 --> 02:11:24.639
will come forward now

02:11:22.399 --> 02:11:26.158
that are involved with these projects

02:11:24.639 --> 02:11:27.520
they'll come forward to you to me

02:11:26.158 --> 02:11:28.719
they're coming forward and so what

02:11:27.520 --> 02:11:30.880
you've done here is provide that

02:11:28.719 --> 02:11:32.560
opportunity if they need it and it's

02:11:30.880 --> 02:11:34.560
amazing i just want to say bob just

02:11:32.560 --> 02:11:36.800
don't come forward no don't come forward

02:11:34.560 --> 02:11:39.280
to bob

02:11:36.800 --> 02:11:41.440
why were you freaking nauseous at the

02:11:39.279 --> 02:11:43.198
beginning of this like so

02:11:41.439 --> 02:11:44.559
upset why was your why'd you have a

02:11:43.198 --> 02:11:45.759
migraine because that started off so

02:11:44.560 --> 02:11:47.760
hard my god i was sitting here like did

02:11:45.760 --> 02:11:49.760
this why are you asking him why because

02:11:47.760 --> 02:11:51.679
obviously anxiety the guy's gone through

02:11:49.760 --> 02:11:53.280
30 [ __ ] years of being persecuted i

02:11:51.679 --> 02:11:54.639
just want to erase his birth certificate

02:11:53.279 --> 02:11:56.319
i just want to hear what you hear from i

02:11:54.639 --> 02:11:58.159
want to hear him say i want them why did

02:11:56.319 --> 02:12:02.238
i have to say that you don't just set it

02:11:58.158 --> 02:12:02.238
up get it i step out okay settle down

02:12:02.639 --> 02:12:06.400
yeah well i get it you were it was hard

02:12:04.960 --> 02:12:09.599
for you to get them here you know and i

02:12:06.399 --> 02:12:11.118
was for us yeah you you don't you do

02:12:09.599 --> 02:12:13.360
what really annoys me are the people

02:12:11.118 --> 02:12:14.639
that think you know you guys just came

02:12:13.359 --> 02:12:16.078
up with the story to make a bunch of

02:12:14.639 --> 02:12:17.760
money or get a bunch of you know

02:12:16.078 --> 02:12:19.679
attention and that's a good point so

02:12:17.760 --> 02:12:21.920
please explain that first of all i don't

02:12:19.679 --> 02:12:24.239
get any money out of this at all and i

02:12:21.920 --> 02:12:25.679
may i didn't even let you guys buy plane

02:12:24.238 --> 02:12:27.359
tickets for me to come out here or

02:12:25.679 --> 02:12:30.239
anything i mean

02:12:27.359 --> 02:12:33.519
any time like when jeremy

02:12:30.238 --> 02:12:34.479
uh pre-previewed i guess the movie up in

02:12:33.520 --> 02:12:36.480
michigan

02:12:34.479 --> 02:12:38.158
i mean they it brought in like a couple

02:12:36.479 --> 02:12:40.238
thousand dollars i made sure that two

02:12:38.158 --> 02:12:42.559
thousand dollars went to science

02:12:40.238 --> 02:12:44.319
programs at the local high schools there

02:12:42.560 --> 02:12:46.000
dirty money i don't want to touch it i

02:12:44.319 --> 02:12:48.000
don't take any money from this stuff and

02:12:46.000 --> 02:12:51.920
as far as attention

02:12:48.000 --> 02:12:54.000
i hate [ __ ] attention i don't like

02:12:51.920 --> 02:12:55.840
being on shows i just want to kind of

02:12:54.000 --> 02:12:57.840
hide in the corner and do my own thing

02:12:55.840 --> 02:13:01.199
so that's i got enough hugs when i was a

02:12:57.840 --> 02:13:04.319
kid okay i don't need any attention so

02:13:01.198 --> 02:13:06.000
now that if if you if you think somehow

02:13:04.319 --> 02:13:08.238
we came up with this thing then you got

02:13:06.000 --> 02:13:10.000
to tell me why we did it well you've

02:13:08.238 --> 02:13:11.759
done a great job of

02:13:10.000 --> 02:13:13.359
making sure you have your bases covered

02:13:11.760 --> 02:13:14.560
in that regard that you haven't profited

02:13:13.359 --> 02:13:16.158
off of this and like you said that you

02:13:14.560 --> 02:13:18.719
have donated whatever money that came

02:13:16.158 --> 02:13:21.759
your way to science programs it's i mean

02:13:18.719 --> 02:13:23.198
it it doesn't make any sense

02:13:21.760 --> 02:13:25.440
any other way

02:13:23.198 --> 02:13:27.439
i mean what you're what i've gotten out

02:13:25.439 --> 02:13:28.479
of here is what i thought i was going to

02:13:27.439 --> 02:13:30.799
get out of here when i watched the

02:13:28.479 --> 02:13:32.959
documentary that you what you're saying

02:13:30.800 --> 02:13:35.199
makes sense it doesn't make sense that

02:13:32.960 --> 02:13:37.920
it's [ __ ] that happened exactly like

02:13:35.198 --> 02:13:40.238
i said it did joe i believe you

02:13:37.920 --> 02:13:42.800
um in closing is there anything else

02:13:40.238 --> 02:13:42.799
you'd like to say

02:13:42.960 --> 02:13:47.189
no i can't think of anything other than

02:13:44.719 --> 02:13:48.960
really don't come and try to visit me

02:13:47.189 --> 02:13:52.319
[Laughter]

02:13:48.960 --> 02:13:54.639
well um i know that you have paid a huge

02:13:52.319 --> 02:13:56.479
personal cost to get this information

02:13:54.639 --> 02:13:57.679
out and i mean maybe you didn't

02:13:56.479 --> 02:13:59.439
understand what that cost would have

02:13:57.679 --> 02:14:01.840
been when you first initially came

02:13:59.439 --> 02:14:04.078
forward with the story but over the past

02:14:01.840 --> 02:14:05.920
30 years it's been immense it's been

02:14:04.078 --> 02:14:08.158
great and i just want to thank you for

02:14:05.920 --> 02:14:09.440
that and thank you for all these people

02:14:08.158 --> 02:14:11.198
that would not have gotten this

02:14:09.439 --> 02:14:13.598
information and would not have really

02:14:11.198 --> 02:14:15.439
had this story any other way

02:14:13.599 --> 02:14:17.199
oh thanks joe thank you

02:14:15.439 --> 02:14:18.960
and thank you jeremy and one more time

02:14:17.198 --> 02:14:21.439
the documentary is available on netflix

02:14:18.960 --> 02:14:24.239
right now yeah it's called bob lazar

02:14:21.439 --> 02:14:26.199
area 51 and flying saucers all right

02:14:24.238 --> 02:14:31.929
that's it folks good night

02:14:26.199 --> 02:14:31.929
[Music]

02:14:33.489 --> 02:14:38.188
[Applause]

02:14:40.189 --> 02:14:46.109
[Music]