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two one boom and we're live first of all

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cheers gentlemen let's have a little

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toast relax bob thank you very much for

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doing this i really appreciate it i

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understand

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that you've told this story many many

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times you've been grilled many many

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times and it's very stressful for you so

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i really really appreciate your time

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for people who don't know the story

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there is a documentary

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jeremy corbell has a documentary out

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right now it's called bob lazar area 51

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and ufos and flying saucers and flying

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saucers bombs are air 51 and flying okay

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um

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i first heard your story decades ago

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i've i told you last night we went out

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to dinner i've seen pretty much every

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interview you've ever given i've

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followed the story incredibly closely

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but for people who don't know the story

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let's give them the bullet points you

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used to work

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at area 51 in area 51 you got you you

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went like

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well you know we want to be accurate

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okay area s4 s4 okay it's about 15 miles

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south of area 51. okay

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um

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you

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worked

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in

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what would you how would you describe it

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i i guess

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within the area 51 compound you can call

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that a subset of area 51.

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and you got that job before that you

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were working

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before that i had worked at los alamos

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right national labs in new mexico and

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you were involved in what kind of work

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nuclear weapon development physics i

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mean that's they do everything there so

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how do they approach you

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to say hey bob once you come on out to

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the nevada desert

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well the way this went down was

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um

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at that time it was 1982

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i

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had put

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a jet engine in my my honda

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and los alamos put it on the front page

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of the paper

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said you know uh

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los alamos man physicist at the lab you

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know

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built this 200 mile an hour you know on

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the jet car that i drove to work every

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day

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so uh so i was known in los alamos the

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guy with the weird car and you know you

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could hear it from you know a mile away

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anyway

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the day that came out on the front page

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of the paper

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was the day edward teller the father of

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the hydrogen bomb was giving

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a lecture

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down there at the lab

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and we didn't have much going on that

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day in our group and i asked if i could

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go down there

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and

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i went down there early and ed teller

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was outside

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leaning on a brick wall there and

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reading the front page of the paper now

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there's a guy out of history so i

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introduced myself hey i'm the guy you're

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reading about there and we talked for a

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little while and it was cool

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uh you know fast forward to years later

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i had moved out to las vegas

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and had you know left los alamos and

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you know went on to other things and i

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wanted to get back into the scientific

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community yeah i left start other

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businesses and

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and that sort of thing so i sent resumes

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out and one of them went out to ed

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teller and referenced our meeting

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you know back back in that the day

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and uh anyway he remembered me

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and

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gave me a reference somebody to contact

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at egng

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and that's pretty much how it started

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so

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you get a phone call or a letter like

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what do you get

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well i got a

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what did i get i got a letter initially

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and um went down for an interview

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probably a couple times and it was down

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at eg g special projects which was um

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at mccarran airport at that time out in

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las vegas and did they give you any sort

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of job description of what you were

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applying for um they said it was for ed

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i can't remember exactly what they did

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this was a long time ago but i i think

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it was um

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advanced propulsion or something like

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that something relatively generic and

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they said it's in a remote area

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um

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you know it's gonna be some days on some

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days off and um

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you know it was kind of a

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it was kind of uh not exactly a

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full-time job but you might have to be

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out there for two weeks at a time and

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take two weeks off so it was kind of uh

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the work schedule would be kind of

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broken up

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and did this seem attractive to you or

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did it seem weird

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no it really wasn't weird because people

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that work at the test site anybody

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that's familiar with the area up there

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um you know working at the nuclear test

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site uh or at the tonopod test range

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north of there uh that's typically how

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things go so you had known about it from

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the scientific community because the

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area 51 at that time was no they didn't

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say anything about area 51. okay so they

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just said it was in a you know in a

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remote location and you just know it was

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up at the test site right so but there

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was no mention of area 51 at that time

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so they've done

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hundreds of nuclear tests in nevada and

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nevada that whole area was there's been

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there's giant chunks of nevada the

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people yeah there's a big piece of

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nevada and it's split up into different

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areas there's a nuclear test site

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there's area 51 there's the tonopod test

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range north of that there's little

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sub-areas there's areas where they test

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chemical weapons and things like that so

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it's all broken up as a you know

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gigantic test area so take me back to

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first day on the job

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you accept a job

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they take you out there

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yeah

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it's um

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the first day really i didn't really get

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to see a whole lot the first day was

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essentially just paperwork that's when i

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flew into area 51 proper

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and i left mccarran airport

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and flew what they call the janet

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flights

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just um

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you know a passenger plane from las

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vegas to area 51

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and it was really just going through

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a mountain of paperwork that day

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from security clearances to um

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god there was

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it was like two or three hours of just

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solid paperwork and that was that was

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really an uneventful first day

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when did things get weird

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when did you realize that at what point

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in time did you say hey

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this is not

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normal work like this doesn't even seem

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like it's from this planet

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that i can't tell you what day that

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occurred on because so much time has

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gone by

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the days have kind of fused into one and

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i can't separate the days was it a slow

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burn or was there a moment of

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recognition

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well the

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the first inkling i had was when i i

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came in normal there's this facility

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that is at s4

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it's in the side of a mountain

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and

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normally we had pulled in with the bus

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and gone around the front through a

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normal double door

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this time that i went in there were

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hangar doors open

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i went into the hangar door and in the

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hangar door was the disc the flying

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saucer that i worked on

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i saw it sitting there and we walked by

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it had a little american flag stuck on

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the side and i thought oh my god this

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finally explains all the flying saucer

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stories this is just an advanced fighter

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and it this is [ __ ] hilarious right

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so i went by i slid my hand alongside it

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i got reprimanded immediately for

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touching the thing

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and uh there was a guy an armed guard

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that followed us in and just said keep

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your eyes at forward and your hands at

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your side and just walk in the door so

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that was the first time i had seen

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anything that was weird

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it was some time later that i was

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introduced to my um

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my lab partner barry

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and we had some of the subcomponents of

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the craft

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in the lab

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and barry was very anxious to get a new

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lab partner so he was very talkative and

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couldn't wait to show me different

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things and it was in the demonstration

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of the reactor working where it caught

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my attention to where

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this is technology that doesn't even

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exist

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so i mean that was the first time i knew

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that this is

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really something different what was it

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what was it what was a

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what was it about this reactor that made

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you think that it didn't exist

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technologically well it was the i

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actually have to back up because there

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were some briefings that i read it

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before that

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that

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you know certainly gave me the

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impression that this was going to be a

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weird job but this was the first

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hands-on thing

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this was a small reactor about the size

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of a hemisphere about the size of a

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basketball

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on a metal plate and when it was running

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it produced a gravitational field a

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gravitational field of its own now this

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is something that we can't do we can't

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produce any gravity the only way we get

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gravity is from large quantities of mass

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but there's no machine we can have that

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turns on that makes gravity like

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you know you can turn on an

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electromagnet and it makes a magnetic

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field we can't make a gravitational

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field anyway this device was producing

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that and barry said

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almost like he was bragging go ahead try

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and try and touch the sphere and i i

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couldn't it would it pushed my hands

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away just like two like poles of a

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magnet so that was uh so like when you

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take two magnets and try to press them

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together yeah you have this each other

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yeah kind of cushion feeling but you

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can't you can't get them together the

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closer you put them the more they push

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but then you felt that physically with

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my hand yeah now there's nothing there's

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nothing that does that

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and that immediately caught my attention

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going wow this is something else what

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was your thought like when you felt that

282
00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:55,920
and you knew that there was nothing that

283
00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:57,759
you were aware of that could produce

284
00:09:55,919 --> 00:09:59,120
that connected me to the briefings that

285
00:09:57,759 --> 00:10:02,958
i read

286
00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:04,799
on the the first day at s4 was that uh

287
00:10:02,958 --> 00:10:06,559
you know everything that i had read was

288
00:10:04,799 --> 00:10:08,000
apparently accurate

289
00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:11,199
what were you reading

290
00:10:08,000 --> 00:10:12,639
i read it was kind of an overview

291
00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:15,040
this project

292
00:10:12,639 --> 00:10:17,600
was to back engineer

293
00:10:15,039 --> 00:10:20,000
the alien craft and

294
00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:22,000
specifically it was to try and back

295
00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:26,159
engineer and see if we can duplicate the

296
00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:28,639
technology with available materials

297
00:10:26,159 --> 00:10:29,838
now to do this they split the project

298
00:10:28,639 --> 00:10:31,919
into

299
00:10:29,839 --> 00:10:33,519
you know many different pieces for

300
00:10:31,919 --> 00:10:36,559
several reasons they do this on all

301
00:10:33,519 --> 00:10:38,560
classified projects so uh nobody has the

302
00:10:36,559 --> 00:10:40,719
complete story but uh they

303
00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:43,039
compartmentalize everything now we had

304
00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:44,879
the power and propulsion system so what

305
00:10:43,039 --> 00:10:46,958
the briefings they gave me were like a

306
00:10:44,879 --> 00:10:49,278
one or two page overview of some of the

307
00:10:46,958 --> 00:10:51,359
other projects that were going on you

308
00:10:49,278 --> 00:10:53,439
know on the craft the only reason they

309
00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:55,759
do that is just in case what you're

310
00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:57,360
working on is connected intimately in

311
00:10:55,759 --> 00:10:58,639
some way that we don't know of to one of

312
00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:02,159
the other projects you have to know

313
00:10:58,639 --> 00:11:03,919
there excuse me their existence so

314
00:11:02,159 --> 00:11:05,278
um

315
00:11:03,919 --> 00:11:08,399
you know i but

316
00:11:05,278 --> 00:11:11,120
again everything from metallurgy to

317
00:11:08,399 --> 00:11:13,919
um you know weapon potential the craft

318
00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:16,399
and these were all you know essentially

319
00:11:13,919 --> 00:11:19,120
very short briefings but mine was just

320
00:11:16,399 --> 00:11:21,759
power and propulsion and

321
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:23,200
it made it very clear that what i read

322
00:11:21,759 --> 00:11:25,278
was accurate

323
00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:28,000
so when you're reading that before you

324
00:11:25,278 --> 00:11:29,278
actually saw the reactor

325
00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:32,000
what were your thoughts on what they

326
00:11:29,278 --> 00:11:32,000
were describing

327
00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:35,679
if you knew that something like that

328
00:11:33,919 --> 00:11:36,639
didn't exist

329
00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,078
and they're describing it in the

330
00:11:36,639 --> 00:11:40,000
briefings

331
00:11:38,078 --> 00:11:42,479
what did you think you were going to see

332
00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:44,078
i really i i didn't know at the time i

333
00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:45,920
mean i was reading i thought is this

334
00:11:44,078 --> 00:11:46,719
just some kind of test

335
00:11:45,919 --> 00:11:48,559
um

336
00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:50,000
see if you're crazy well not to see if

337
00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:51,838
i'm crazy to

338
00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:53,919
you know a lot of times they'll take in

339
00:11:51,839 --> 00:11:54,720
real high security

340
00:11:53,919 --> 00:11:57,360
uh

341
00:11:54,720 --> 00:12:00,000
jobs i mean they'll intentionally insert

342
00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:02,320
nonsense into them um whether it's to

343
00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,679
confuse the fact or if for someone was

344
00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:05,519
to leak it out

345
00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:07,439
they would carry that information along

346
00:12:05,519 --> 00:12:08,399
and know where it came from so

347
00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:10,880
i

348
00:12:08,399 --> 00:12:12,879
read through the documents but you know

349
00:12:10,879 --> 00:12:16,320
i didn't know if this was you know part

350
00:12:12,879 --> 00:12:18,320
of some kind of test or um

351
00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:20,000
you know or what or was it potentially

352
00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:22,160
realistic i mean i really didn't

353
00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:25,519
consider it being

354
00:12:22,159 --> 00:12:27,120
all that possible as far as being uh

355
00:12:25,519 --> 00:12:29,278
the actual thing that i was going to

356
00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:30,480
work on at the time how did they turn it

357
00:12:29,278 --> 00:12:32,958
on

358
00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:34,720
the the reactor yeah the reactor can be

359
00:12:32,958 --> 00:12:37,278
turned on or turned off in a lot of

360
00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:40,399
different ways um the way barry showed

361
00:12:37,278 --> 00:12:42,078
me at the hemisphere is removed

362
00:12:40,399 --> 00:12:44,159
there's a small tower in the middle when

363
00:12:42,078 --> 00:12:45,439
you put the hemisphere on the reactor

364
00:12:44,159 --> 00:12:48,399
activates

365
00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:51,680
the reactor shuts down it's it's load

366
00:12:48,399 --> 00:12:53,679
sensing so if there's if there's no load

367
00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:56,319
on the reactor at all it shuts down when

368
00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:58,719
there's a load present on it it starts

369
00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,278
up again load meaning

370
00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:02,959
you can consider it an electrical load

371
00:13:01,278 --> 00:13:06,078
so

372
00:13:02,958 --> 00:13:08,239
although it doesn't necessarily operate

373
00:13:06,078 --> 00:13:10,000
electrically there's no wiring that

374
00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:11,680
connects any of the sub components

375
00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:14,720
together whatsoever they just have to be

376
00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:18,000
in the immediate vicinity it's uh

377
00:13:14,720 --> 00:13:20,720
it is but the stuff is borderline magic

378
00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:23,039
and that's essentially where we left it

379
00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:25,759
you know when i left the project

380
00:13:23,039 --> 00:13:27,360
so there was no progress made

381
00:13:25,759 --> 00:13:29,278
there was some progress i mean we did

382
00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,720
identify at least we think some

383
00:13:29,278 --> 00:13:33,039
processes and

384
00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:35,200
and had a rough idea we think of what

385
00:13:33,039 --> 00:13:37,199
was going on but

386
00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:39,600
i think this is a problem

387
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,959
that they've had for a long time

388
00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,519
and um

389
00:13:40,958 --> 00:13:45,599
you know i was replacing somebody

390
00:13:43,519 --> 00:13:47,679
that barry worked with prior to me and i

391
00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:49,440
think there was some horrific accident

392
00:13:47,679 --> 00:13:51,359
that i didn't have a whole lot of

393
00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:53,040
information on but you know barry

394
00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:54,879
alluded to that

395
00:13:53,039 --> 00:13:57,439
horrific accident like where someone

396
00:13:54,879 --> 00:13:59,120
died or yeah where somebody died because

397
00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:01,440
they were trying to tamper with things

398
00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:03,440
or figure out how something worked yeah

399
00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:05,920
the reactor in particular

400
00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:07,760
but yeti let you touch it

401
00:14:05,919 --> 00:14:10,639
yeah i think what they were trying to do

402
00:14:07,759 --> 00:14:12,399
was cut into one now they had they had

403
00:14:10,639 --> 00:14:14,159
more than one there and they that was

404
00:14:12,399 --> 00:14:15,679
supposedly there was an unannounced

405
00:14:14,159 --> 00:14:16,480
nuclear test

406
00:14:15,679 --> 00:14:18,559
and

407
00:14:16,480 --> 00:14:19,680
that's what it was at the time remember

408
00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:22,799
they would still do an underground

409
00:14:19,679 --> 00:14:24,638
nuclear test at the test site um but

410
00:14:22,799 --> 00:14:26,799
from what i understand according to

411
00:14:24,639 --> 00:14:28,399
barry there was an attempt made now this

412
00:14:26,799 --> 00:14:30,799
must have been a pretty desperate intent

413
00:14:28,399 --> 00:14:32,958
because it's not a very scientific

414
00:14:30,799 --> 00:14:34,639
process to cut you know analyze

415
00:14:32,958 --> 00:14:36,239
something that way but it looked like

416
00:14:34,639 --> 00:14:38,159
they used a plasma cutter or something

417
00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:40,000
like that to cut into an

418
00:14:38,159 --> 00:14:42,480
operating reactor how many of these

419
00:14:40,000 --> 00:14:45,039
things did they have they had nine nine

420
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:47,920
craft altogether i only got hands on

421
00:14:45,039 --> 00:14:50,000
with one of them so i can't really

422
00:14:47,919 --> 00:14:52,399
say what the how the others operated did

423
00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:54,720
you see the other ones yeah at one time

424
00:14:52,399 --> 00:14:57,120
and only one time the bay doors that

425
00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:59,680
between the hangers were all open and i

426
00:14:57,120 --> 00:15:00,639
could see all the way through

427
00:14:59,679 --> 00:15:02,479
and

428
00:15:00,639 --> 00:15:05,278
were they all exactly the same no they

429
00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:07,680
were all different different shapes yeah

430
00:15:05,278 --> 00:15:09,360
but they were all from somewhere else

431
00:15:07,679 --> 00:15:10,239
yeah absolutely

432
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:13,519
now

433
00:15:10,240 --> 00:15:14,799
did anyone make any attempt to explain

434
00:15:13,519 --> 00:15:17,839
or to

435
00:15:14,799 --> 00:15:19,838
to tell you where they came from no no

436
00:15:17,839 --> 00:15:21,519
no one is the least bit interested in

437
00:15:19,839 --> 00:15:23,120
letting everybody know

438
00:15:21,519 --> 00:15:25,198
all the facts they want to give you the

439
00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:27,039
minimum information that's necessary to

440
00:15:25,198 --> 00:15:28,399
complete your task so

441
00:15:27,039 --> 00:15:30,559
you're not getting the story of where

442
00:15:28,399 --> 00:15:32,559
they came from you're not getting the

443
00:15:30,559 --> 00:15:35,359
story of what how much progress other

444
00:15:32,559 --> 00:15:37,278
people are making you just focus on

445
00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,480
the small component but they gave you

446
00:15:37,278 --> 00:15:41,278
some indication that they've been

447
00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:43,199
working on these for a while yeah

448
00:15:41,278 --> 00:15:45,039
when do you think they

449
00:15:43,198 --> 00:15:47,278
acquired these

450
00:15:45,039 --> 00:15:50,559
i really couldn't say

451
00:15:47,278 --> 00:15:51,360
i think they've been around for a while

452
00:15:50,559 --> 00:15:54,399
so

453
00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:57,278
they bring you into this room you

454
00:15:54,399 --> 00:15:59,440
see this reactor working you you realize

455
00:15:57,278 --> 00:16:02,320
this is nothing that as far as like the

456
00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:05,040
scientific community at current time

457
00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:06,399
has the ability to create

458
00:16:05,039 --> 00:16:08,399
we still don't

459
00:16:06,399 --> 00:16:09,839
what is your life like from that moment

460
00:16:08,399 --> 00:16:11,759
on is that where everything changes

461
00:16:09,839 --> 00:16:13,920
because you do you i mean i would

462
00:16:11,759 --> 00:16:15,919
imagine the moment you actually make

463
00:16:13,919 --> 00:16:17,519
contact with something that's

464
00:16:15,919 --> 00:16:19,278
extraterrestrial whether it's an object

465
00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:22,000
or a being something where you can

466
00:16:19,278 --> 00:16:23,198
actually absolutely be certain it's not

467
00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:26,240
from here

468
00:16:23,198 --> 00:16:28,319
your whole paradigm the whole world you

469
00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:31,198
live in is now a different place well

470
00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:33,199
this is the only time it became exciting

471
00:16:31,198 --> 00:16:34,479
you know the rest of the time the it was

472
00:16:33,198 --> 00:16:37,039
really

473
00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:38,399
an ominous feeling being at work but it

474
00:16:37,039 --> 00:16:41,278
at that time

475
00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:43,679
it was exciting i mean this was now i

476
00:16:41,278 --> 00:16:45,838
knew we were on the absolute be actually

477
00:16:43,679 --> 00:16:46,879
beyond the cutting edge of science and i

478
00:16:45,839 --> 00:16:49,759
was

479
00:16:46,879 --> 00:16:52,720
i was so absolutely excited to be there

480
00:16:49,759 --> 00:16:54,800
every single time i was um

481
00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:57,839
you know it would this was a fantastic

482
00:16:54,799 --> 00:16:57,838
opportunity and

483
00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:04,400
however

484
00:17:00,320 --> 00:17:06,720
in short order it began to concern me we

485
00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:07,839
really have no idea what we're talking

486
00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:09,679
about

487
00:17:07,838 --> 00:17:12,558
and

488
00:17:09,679 --> 00:17:14,000
the excitement kind of turned to dread

489
00:17:12,558 --> 00:17:16,318
at some point

490
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:19,838
because the amount of power we're

491
00:17:16,318 --> 00:17:22,480
dealing with is astronomical i mean to

492
00:17:19,838 --> 00:17:25,359
affect gravity to produce the effects

493
00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:29,120
like this equipment does takes huge

494
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:30,798
amounts of power and i've given the

495
00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,879
example before of

496
00:17:30,798 --> 00:17:34,879
you know taking a small portable nuclear

497
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:36,799
reactor and you know putting it back

498
00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:39,520
into victorian times you know with the

499
00:17:36,798 --> 00:17:41,599
scientists of the time and just dropping

500
00:17:39,519 --> 00:17:43,918
it in a room and they come and look at

501
00:17:41,599 --> 00:17:45,678
it and see that it's producing power

502
00:17:43,919 --> 00:17:47,200
and wonder how it works so they start

503
00:17:45,679 --> 00:17:48,240
taking it apart

504
00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:49,440
and

505
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,960
as soon as they get some of the

506
00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:52,558
shielding off the people are going to

507
00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:53,600
drop dead because of the radiation

508
00:17:52,558 --> 00:17:56,399
inside

509
00:17:53,599 --> 00:17:58,719
now the people have no idea that

510
00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:00,400
radiation even exists back then

511
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,360
but anybody that comes in to check on

512
00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:04,640
him will also drop dead and

513
00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:06,558
you know

514
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:08,960
there's no reason that that exact

515
00:18:06,558 --> 00:18:11,759
scenario couldn't happen with what we're

516
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:14,480
dealing with we have no idea how the

517
00:18:11,759 --> 00:18:16,480
physics operate within this thing the

518
00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:18,558
power levels are are like i said

519
00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:20,400
astronomic like it's incredibly

520
00:18:18,558 --> 00:18:21,200
dangerous to tinker with something like

521
00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:23,679
that

522
00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:25,519
and you know in some respects we were

523
00:18:23,679 --> 00:18:28,400
guinea pigs just try to find out how to

524
00:18:25,519 --> 00:18:29,918
make this thing so they had a series

525
00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:31,919
as far as you're

526
00:18:29,919 --> 00:18:33,759
surmised that a series of different

527
00:18:31,919 --> 00:18:35,280
scientists try to back engineer this

528
00:18:33,759 --> 00:18:36,960
thing try to figure out what this thing

529
00:18:35,279 --> 00:18:39,678
was and they would bring in new people

530
00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:41,279
and like let's throw bob at it yeah yeah

531
00:18:39,679 --> 00:18:42,880
and they i know i don't know how many

532
00:18:41,279 --> 00:18:45,678
but i knew there was certainly one

533
00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:47,679
before me and i knew he died

534
00:18:45,679 --> 00:18:51,120
during the analysis of the or the

535
00:18:47,679 --> 00:18:53,440
reactor itself and

536
00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:54,879
you don't know how many have worked on

537
00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,960
it and no one

538
00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:58,559
gave this could have been there for

539
00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:59,919
50 years it could have been there for

540
00:18:58,558 --> 00:19:02,079
five years when they're giving you

541
00:18:59,919 --> 00:19:03,038
instructions what are they saying like

542
00:19:02,079 --> 00:19:04,240
when they're giving you direction

543
00:19:03,038 --> 00:19:05,919
they're showing you all the stuff like

544
00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:08,240
what what are they saying what

545
00:19:05,919 --> 00:19:10,559
specifically what are they asking of you

546
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:12,640
well essentially what they ask is is

547
00:19:10,558 --> 00:19:14,480
what i said all we are just to gather as

548
00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:16,000
much information as possible find out

549
00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:18,079
how it operates and see if we can

550
00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:20,798
duplicate it so but they always realize

551
00:19:18,079 --> 00:19:24,079
you where it was from they never let you

552
00:19:20,798 --> 00:19:25,038
ask questions about where it's from well

553
00:19:24,079 --> 00:19:26,798
if

554
00:19:25,038 --> 00:19:29,119
the information i read in the briefings

555
00:19:26,798 --> 00:19:29,839
was accurate now what i do have to say

556
00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:32,159
is

557
00:19:29,839 --> 00:19:33,759
the information that pertained directly

558
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:36,960
to the reactor

559
00:19:33,759 --> 00:19:38,480
was accurate what i read

560
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:41,679
did

561
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:42,960
i mean did jive with reality um in terms

562
00:19:41,679 --> 00:19:45,280
of how

563
00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:48,480
in terms of how it was made how what we

564
00:19:45,279 --> 00:19:50,240
saw how it operated the materials how it

565
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:52,558
you know turned on and what was

566
00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:54,160
discovered uh

567
00:19:52,558 --> 00:19:56,079
discovered about it

568
00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:58,320
i'm sorry the migraine is really making

569
00:19:56,079 --> 00:20:00,000
it hard for me to thank you sorry no

570
00:19:58,319 --> 00:20:01,439
we talked that before the podcast you

571
00:20:00,000 --> 00:20:02,880
tell her buddy bob is getting a migraine

572
00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:03,919
i know you're very stressed out by this

573
00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:05,360
which is one of the reasons why i

574
00:20:03,919 --> 00:20:07,120
appreciate you doing this

575
00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:08,719
um

576
00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:10,399
where was i already we were talking oh

577
00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:11,919
right yeah explained it

578
00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:15,120
and uh

579
00:20:11,919 --> 00:20:17,280
so there was some paperwork that

580
00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:20,639
indicated that this was from the zeta

581
00:20:17,279 --> 00:20:24,079
reticuli star system now

582
00:20:20,640 --> 00:20:26,400
yeah now how they obtain that i haven't

583
00:20:24,079 --> 00:20:28,158
i haven't the slightest idea but it

584
00:20:26,400 --> 00:20:29,759
wasn't just from the zeta reticuli star

585
00:20:28,159 --> 00:20:32,240
system it was

586
00:20:29,759 --> 00:20:35,679
what they called zr3 so it was a third

587
00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:37,679
planet in that star system so

588
00:20:35,679 --> 00:20:39,759
there was no other information about it

589
00:20:37,679 --> 00:20:41,840
other than that supposedly where the

590
00:20:39,759 --> 00:20:43,279
craft came from now is that true i don't

591
00:20:41,839 --> 00:20:45,119
know i have no way of verifying that but

592
00:20:43,279 --> 00:20:47,839
that was printed in the same materials

593
00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:50,158
that referenced the reactor now i looked

594
00:20:47,839 --> 00:20:51,359
that stuff up when i went home

595
00:20:50,159 --> 00:20:54,720
and

596
00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:56,959
zeta reticular is a binary star

597
00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:58,319
two stars that orbit orbit one another

598
00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,000
and it's only visible in the southern

599
00:20:58,319 --> 00:21:02,639
hemisphere and it's about thirty some

600
00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:04,240
odd light years away so that's literally

601
00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:06,480
all the information i have about that i

602
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,400
don't know how they found out it came

603
00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:10,720
from there and you also probably have

604
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:12,159
some suspicions that they give you some

605
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:15,600
disinformation like you were talking

606
00:21:12,159 --> 00:21:17,360
about before they would yeah yeah to

607
00:21:15,599 --> 00:21:19,038
i mean if you ever decided to talk about

608
00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:21,759
this they added a bunch of nonsense to

609
00:21:19,038 --> 00:21:24,158
make whatever is factual look ridiculous

610
00:21:21,759 --> 00:21:26,000
right or be able to trace it down like

611
00:21:24,159 --> 00:21:28,080
hey this facts came out and you know

612
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:30,480
this lazar guy said it you know came

613
00:21:28,079 --> 00:21:32,960
from zeta reticulate so they knew it was

614
00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:36,319
when we read zeta reticulate we're like

615
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:37,919
what in the [ __ ] is this well reading

616
00:21:36,319 --> 00:21:39,678
all of this stuff it was what in the

617
00:21:37,919 --> 00:21:40,640
[ __ ] is this you're like why did i sign

618
00:21:39,679 --> 00:21:41,519
up for this

619
00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:43,600
no no

620
00:21:41,519 --> 00:21:45,759
to me this was cool this is interesting

621
00:21:43,599 --> 00:21:47,519
i said i was just excited to be out in a

622
00:21:45,759 --> 00:21:49,359
secure area you know in the middle of

623
00:21:47,519 --> 00:21:50,720
the desert i said this is awesome how

624
00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,199
old are you

625
00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,720
i get as in my 20s

626
00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,798
yeah so you're probably

627
00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:59,440
totally geeked out oh yeah

628
00:21:56,798 --> 00:22:01,200
this was this was great i mean i i was

629
00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,798
excited so i didn't care

630
00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:04,240
reading through everything and so you

631
00:22:02,798 --> 00:22:05,599
read through all the zeta reticuli thing

632
00:22:04,240 --> 00:22:07,359
but then when you see the actual

633
00:22:05,599 --> 00:22:10,079
starship with the little american flag

634
00:22:07,359 --> 00:22:12,959
sticker on it well that was

635
00:22:10,079 --> 00:22:14,480
was that later or before

636
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,120
that

637
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:18,798
that was before so before so you see the

638
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,319
thing before and you say oh this is

639
00:22:18,798 --> 00:22:22,960
where what's that before

640
00:22:20,319 --> 00:22:24,399
hard so many years yeah i can't

641
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:26,319
either way it doesn't matter the days

642
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:28,798
have fused together it's so hard to

643
00:22:26,319 --> 00:22:30,158
separate what happened in each visit do

644
00:22:28,798 --> 00:22:32,400
you remember the thought process when

645
00:22:30,159 --> 00:22:34,960
you read that it's from zeta reticuli

646
00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:37,038
yeah it it it it didn't hit me like a

647
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:38,400
ton of bricks or anything it's just like

648
00:22:37,038 --> 00:22:40,319
yeah okay

649
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:42,080
you think it was [ __ ] i don't know

650
00:22:40,319 --> 00:22:44,240
this is where i don't know now i don't i

651
00:22:42,079 --> 00:22:45,839
mean because when i read it i hadn't

652
00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:47,839
verified anything and this was just a

653
00:22:45,839 --> 00:22:49,199
bunch of stuff i was reading and i

654
00:22:47,839 --> 00:22:50,879
thought maybe after this they're just

655
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:53,519
going to give me a test and see what i

656
00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,760
can remember in right crazy information

657
00:22:53,519 --> 00:22:57,839
and it would but

658
00:22:55,759 --> 00:22:59,359
like i said when i finally

659
00:22:57,839 --> 00:23:01,199
went in with barry

660
00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:02,879
um

661
00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,640
and had hands-on

662
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:05,679
experience with what they were talking

663
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:07,280
about

664
00:23:05,679 --> 00:23:09,759
it taught on a completely different

665
00:23:07,279 --> 00:23:10,798
meaning so there's a plate there's this

666
00:23:09,759 --> 00:23:12,960
thing that looks like a half a

667
00:23:10,798 --> 00:23:14,720
basketball and when it's on you can't

668
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:16,558
come anywhere near it you can't touch it

669
00:23:14,720 --> 00:23:17,679
right how is

670
00:23:16,558 --> 00:23:20,000
what is

671
00:23:17,679 --> 00:23:21,519
gravity about that like the the concept

672
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,960
of gravity to most people gravity is

673
00:23:21,519 --> 00:23:25,119
bringing something towards it right well

674
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:28,240
i guess you would say it's anti-gravity

675
00:23:25,119 --> 00:23:29,839
it's gravity shifted 180 degrees it's uh

676
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,200
you know

677
00:23:29,839 --> 00:23:34,319
anti-gravity

678
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:36,720
and did they have any understanding

679
00:23:34,319 --> 00:23:38,000
about what could possibly create this

680
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:39,440
effect

681
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:42,558
did they have any

682
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:45,038
areas where they'd like you to look into

683
00:23:42,558 --> 00:23:45,038
no they

684
00:23:46,079 --> 00:23:50,079
well

685
00:23:47,279 --> 00:23:52,079
they knew there was a fuel source in it

686
00:23:50,079 --> 00:23:53,918
and they were proficient

687
00:23:52,079 --> 00:23:55,759
at making it work

688
00:23:53,919 --> 00:23:58,080
and again my analogy to something like

689
00:23:55,759 --> 00:23:59,839
this is you can drop a motorcycle off in

690
00:23:58,079 --> 00:24:01,918
the wagon train days and just leave it

691
00:23:59,839 --> 00:24:04,000
with the keys parked outside you know

692
00:24:01,919 --> 00:24:05,679
somebody's place everybody will come

693
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,679
around it and they'll poke and prod and

694
00:24:05,679 --> 00:24:09,840
eventually they'll turn the key get it

695
00:24:07,679 --> 00:24:10,880
to start and become proficient at

696
00:24:09,839 --> 00:24:13,599
writing it

697
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:15,440
yeah but they won't be able to

698
00:24:13,599 --> 00:24:17,519
understand what the hell's going on they

699
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:19,360
won't be able to make the plastic fender

700
00:24:17,519 --> 00:24:21,759
much less anything else and i think

701
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:23,359
that's exactly the state we were at we

702
00:24:21,759 --> 00:24:25,278
played around with the parts long enough

703
00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:27,918
before i got there where they could make

704
00:24:25,278 --> 00:24:30,480
the reactor operate

705
00:24:27,919 --> 00:24:32,559
take the fuel out and know that it makes

706
00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:35,360
it work

707
00:24:32,558 --> 00:24:36,960
how exactly what was going on

708
00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:39,918
in the reactor

709
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:42,720
remained a mystery at the time

710
00:24:39,919 --> 00:24:45,440
i think we made some progress on

711
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,519
what was going on inside but i don't

712
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:49,600
think anybody really knew anything they

713
00:24:47,519 --> 00:24:52,319
could just watch what was going on and

714
00:24:49,599 --> 00:24:54,719
make note of it how long were you there

715
00:24:52,319 --> 00:24:56,558
i'd say about six months or so and what

716
00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:57,759
what progress was made while you were

717
00:24:56,558 --> 00:25:01,759
there

718
00:24:57,759 --> 00:25:03,759
well we came up with a bunch of

719
00:25:01,759 --> 00:25:05,359
reasonably good ideas about how the

720
00:25:03,759 --> 00:25:08,079
reactor worked

721
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:10,000
and one of them was the base the square

722
00:25:08,079 --> 00:25:11,839
base of it was essentially like a

723
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:14,640
cyclotron which is a small particle

724
00:25:11,839 --> 00:25:16,158
accelerator a circular one particle

725
00:25:14,640 --> 00:25:18,640
accelerators linear particle

726
00:25:16,159 --> 00:25:20,080
accelerators are just a you know

727
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,759
long tube essentially and they

728
00:25:20,079 --> 00:25:23,918
accelerate particles with high voltage

729
00:25:21,759 --> 00:25:26,240
and you know radio frequencies till they

730
00:25:23,919 --> 00:25:29,600
reach high speeds but a cyclotron does

731
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:31,359
that in a smaller circular area and

732
00:25:29,599 --> 00:25:34,158
there is this

733
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:35,759
very heavy element fuel element 115

734
00:25:34,159 --> 00:25:36,720
something that wasn't on our periodic

735
00:25:35,759 --> 00:25:39,759
charts

736
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:42,159
at the time but it is now it is now yeah

737
00:25:39,759 --> 00:25:44,079
when did it become on the periodic table

738
00:25:42,159 --> 00:25:46,400
now the way the charts now you know i

739
00:25:44,079 --> 00:25:47,918
don't remember do you remember when they

740
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:49,840
2004

741
00:25:47,919 --> 00:25:51,759
durhamstat germany i think is where they

742
00:25:49,839 --> 00:25:54,079
first fabricated four atoms they lasted

743
00:25:51,759 --> 00:25:56,480
220 milliseconds with the atoms it's

744
00:25:54,079 --> 00:25:57,759
nothing right and then it later was

745
00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,759
discovered a couple more times they

746
00:25:57,759 --> 00:26:01,519
could fabricate it then they gave it

747
00:25:59,759 --> 00:26:03,359
they gave it a place then on the

748
00:26:01,519 --> 00:26:06,240
periodic chart after that called it

749
00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:08,839
muscovium so they told you about this

750
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:12,880
stuff in

751
00:26:08,839 --> 00:26:16,000
1982 yeah well we can 82 what what year

752
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:18,000
was this it was 88 and 89 when i was

753
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:21,278
there 82 is one 82 was when you're in

754
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:22,640
los alamos i'm sorry yeah so 88.89 they

755
00:26:21,278 --> 00:26:24,400
told you about this stuff so this was

756
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:26,320
not like no they didn't they didn't tell

757
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:28,240
me about it that's one of the things

758
00:26:26,319 --> 00:26:30,480
that this group came up with

759
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:31,679
the um

760
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,440
um

761
00:26:31,679 --> 00:26:34,480
i keep losing my train of thought with

762
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:37,679
this thing

763
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:41,038
so this one area this

764
00:26:37,679 --> 00:26:44,400
this element 115 was the fuel yeah it

765
00:26:41,038 --> 00:26:44,400
was the fuel um

766
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:54,319
the the world will forgive you for

767
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,599
having a migraine i can i just it's

768
00:26:54,319 --> 00:26:57,119
really hard to think throughout this

769
00:26:55,599 --> 00:26:58,558
case

770
00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:00,879
i just want to say one yeah definitely

771
00:26:58,558 --> 00:27:02,480
as i said one thing you know but for the

772
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,159
last 30 years

773
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,919
people have just been on the attack on

774
00:27:04,159 --> 00:27:08,240
bob you know getting to know him the

775
00:27:05,919 --> 00:27:10,080
personal effects on his life it's really

776
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,599
hard to understand unless you meet his

777
00:27:10,079 --> 00:27:13,599
family and his wife

778
00:27:11,599 --> 00:27:16,000
i mean this is the last thing he wanted

779
00:27:13,599 --> 00:27:17,839
to [ __ ] do was have to talk yeah we

780
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,119
should explain that jeremy you and i had

781
00:27:17,839 --> 00:27:20,639
this conversation i watched your

782
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:23,119
documentary

783
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:25,200
we had this conversation and i said i

784
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,839
have to talk to him yeah the document

785
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:29,278
there's there's been detractors there's

786
00:27:27,839 --> 00:27:30,639
been a bunch of people that called

787
00:27:29,278 --> 00:27:33,119
[ __ ] on many of the things that

788
00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:35,759
you've said but over time

789
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:38,639
many of the things that you talked about

790
00:27:35,759 --> 00:27:40,400
even in the 80s have proven to be true

791
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:42,960
things that people said were not true

792
00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:44,480
were proven to be true element 115 was

793
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:46,558
one of them

794
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:50,000
right right right

795
00:27:46,558 --> 00:27:51,519
element 115 the fuel they had was stable

796
00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:54,398
in other words it didn't decay it wasn't

797
00:27:51,519 --> 00:27:57,519
emitting radioactivity um when they

798
00:27:54,398 --> 00:28:00,319
synthesized the two or three atoms of

799
00:27:57,519 --> 00:28:02,798
the 115 uh it did decay

800
00:28:00,319 --> 00:28:04,000
and it was not a stable element so

801
00:28:02,798 --> 00:28:06,000
they're they're kind of two different

802
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:07,359
things but this is kind of typical

803
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:09,599
elements

804
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:12,479
always have or pretty much always have

805
00:28:09,599 --> 00:28:14,879
uh stable isotopes and unstable isotopes

806
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:17,759
like i think cesium has like

807
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:19,278
30 unstable isotopes to it so all right

808
00:28:17,759 --> 00:28:22,398
well hydrogen for example you're

809
00:28:19,278 --> 00:28:24,558
familiar with hydrogen gas

810
00:28:22,398 --> 00:28:28,000
it's stable it's not radioactive but

811
00:28:24,558 --> 00:28:30,960
there's also two other types of hydrogen

812
00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:33,119
deuterium and tritium and deuterium

813
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:35,440
isn't radioactive it's another

814
00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:38,079
stable isotope hydrogen but tritium is

815
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:39,360
radioactive now they're all hydrogen but

816
00:28:38,079 --> 00:28:42,480
they just have a different amounts of

817
00:28:39,359 --> 00:28:45,199
neutrons so it's the same thing with

818
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:48,558
other elements n element 115. depending

819
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,558
on the amount of neutrons it has

820
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:55,520
designates the isotope but it's 115 they

821
00:28:52,079 --> 00:28:58,639
will continue to take

822
00:28:55,519 --> 00:28:59,839
or experiment and try and make 115 at

823
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,440
different isotopes and i'm sure

824
00:28:59,839 --> 00:29:04,000
eventually they'll come up with a stable

825
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,600
version but it's the stable version that

826
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:08,558
has the properties that we're talking

827
00:29:05,599 --> 00:29:10,480
about so they somehow or another had

828
00:29:08,558 --> 00:29:12,000
acquired a stable version did they say

829
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,759
that the stable version had come with

830
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:17,440
this craft it absolutely came with the

831
00:29:13,759 --> 00:29:19,679
graft yeah so at the time you having a

832
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:21,278
firm knowledge of the periodic chart and

833
00:29:19,679 --> 00:29:23,679
knowing what was real and what wasn't

834
00:29:21,278 --> 00:29:26,480
real what was your reaction to having

835
00:29:23,679 --> 00:29:28,240
this stable element 115 that wasn't even

836
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:30,880
supposed to exist well everything was

837
00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:33,440
impossible right i mean down down to the

838
00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:36,399
metal i i did get a chance

839
00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:40,320
uh to look inside the craft on only one

840
00:29:36,398 --> 00:29:42,239
occasion and this was important because

841
00:29:40,319 --> 00:29:43,839
where the reactor sat

842
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:46,079
might have been critical to how it

843
00:29:43,839 --> 00:29:47,918
operated since everything operates

844
00:29:46,079 --> 00:29:50,000
without any interconnection so the

845
00:29:47,919 --> 00:29:52,480
placement of components might be

846
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:55,119
critical so they allowed me to go inside

847
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:56,159
and and look at it

848
00:29:55,119 --> 00:29:58,079
um

849
00:29:56,159 --> 00:30:00,880
dude again i forgot where the hell i am

850
00:29:58,079 --> 00:30:02,319
so you're going into this craft and what

851
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:05,840
are you thinking when you're inside of

852
00:30:02,319 --> 00:30:09,519
it like what are you seeing it's um

853
00:30:05,839 --> 00:30:11,599
it's a very ominous feeling because it's

854
00:30:09,519 --> 00:30:13,599
there are no at first of all everything

855
00:30:11,599 --> 00:30:14,558
is one color it's like a dark pewter

856
00:30:13,599 --> 00:30:17,918
color

857
00:30:14,558 --> 00:30:20,240
and there are no right angles anywhere

858
00:30:17,919 --> 00:30:23,120
it's as if somebody took uh i've said

859
00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:23,759
this before somebody took a a model out

860
00:30:23,119 --> 00:30:26,000
of

861
00:30:23,759 --> 00:30:27,839
and fashioned it out of wax and then

862
00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:29,519
heated it just for a short time so

863
00:30:27,839 --> 00:30:31,199
everything melted everything looks like

864
00:30:29,519 --> 00:30:34,639
it's fused together everything has a

865
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:37,919
radius of curvature where two uh items

866
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:38,960
meet it's uh it's a really weird looking

867
00:30:37,919 --> 00:30:41,278
thing

868
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,640
but um

869
00:30:41,278 --> 00:30:44,558
uh

870
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:47,840
there was almost nothing

871
00:30:44,558 --> 00:30:48,798
other than a small foldable hatchway

872
00:30:47,839 --> 00:30:51,119
that

873
00:30:48,798 --> 00:30:52,398
that looked recognizable everything was

874
00:30:51,119 --> 00:30:54,319
uh

875
00:30:52,398 --> 00:30:57,678
was really unworldly

876
00:30:54,319 --> 00:30:59,439
depicting it a way to describe it so you

877
00:30:57,679 --> 00:31:01,038
you get inside this thing and it's

878
00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,640
designed for something that's much

879
00:31:01,038 --> 00:31:04,079
smaller than a human being yeah you

880
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:05,600
can't really stand up till you get to

881
00:31:04,079 --> 00:31:06,319
the very center of it and how tall are

882
00:31:05,599 --> 00:31:08,959
you

883
00:31:06,319 --> 00:31:11,359
i'm 5 10. and what do you think this was

884
00:31:08,960 --> 00:31:13,600
designed for i'd say something close to

885
00:31:11,359 --> 00:31:14,879
half my height wow

886
00:31:13,599 --> 00:31:16,959
so these little

887
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:19,360
three foot tallish creatures

888
00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:21,440
yeah and the the seats were small too i

889
00:31:19,359 --> 00:31:25,359
mean obviously it was made you know for

890
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:27,519
something something small but there's no

891
00:31:25,359 --> 00:31:29,839
like there's there's nothing else in

892
00:31:27,519 --> 00:31:31,599
there there's just seats the reactor and

893
00:31:29,839 --> 00:31:33,519
some of the sub components there's no

894
00:31:31,599 --> 00:31:35,199
there's no control panels there's no

895
00:31:33,519 --> 00:31:38,398
bathroom there's no

896
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:40,720
no decorative uh components or artwork

897
00:31:38,398 --> 00:31:43,439
or anything that you would recognize or

898
00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:46,960
trim i mean it's just a very bare bones

899
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:49,519
thing you're not seeing any screens

900
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:51,440
well there are archways around it that

901
00:31:49,519 --> 00:31:52,640
are part of the superstructure

902
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,880
and

903
00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:56,559
that one of the archways can become

904
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:58,159
transparent

905
00:31:56,558 --> 00:32:01,839
when i was in there there was another

906
00:31:58,159 --> 00:32:04,000
group working on one of the archways and

907
00:32:01,839 --> 00:32:04,959
you could call that a screen more or

908
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:07,599
less

909
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:10,640
so through that archway it would be it

910
00:32:07,599 --> 00:32:11,759
would maintain the solidity the the

911
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:14,080
solid

912
00:32:11,759 --> 00:32:16,798
whatever metal it was yeah but you could

913
00:32:14,079 --> 00:32:18,879
yeah it just became transparent yeah i

914
00:32:16,798 --> 00:32:20,398
saw that happen once or twice before i

915
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:22,240
left did you ask any questions about

916
00:32:20,398 --> 00:32:23,918
what the phone no there's no there's no

917
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:25,599
asking questions no

918
00:32:23,919 --> 00:32:27,759
but when you watch something become

919
00:32:25,599 --> 00:32:29,278
transparent and you realize it's still

920
00:32:27,759 --> 00:32:31,679
there but you could now see through it

921
00:32:29,278 --> 00:32:33,359
yeah i mean now that's not that

922
00:32:31,679 --> 00:32:35,519
impressive we do have some liquid

923
00:32:33,359 --> 00:32:37,678
crystal materials that are like that

924
00:32:35,519 --> 00:32:39,519
you know they are seen in smart glass

925
00:32:37,679 --> 00:32:41,679
yeah they call it smart glass so this is

926
00:32:39,519 --> 00:32:42,720
just uh and i don't know if the craft is

927
00:32:41,679 --> 00:32:45,278
made of

928
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:47,200
you know an advanced metal or a ceramic

929
00:32:45,278 --> 00:32:49,359
it was cold to the touch

930
00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:50,960
so um you know i would lean in more

931
00:32:49,359 --> 00:32:52,240
towards the metal you're not allowed to

932
00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:54,798
ask questions

933
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:57,519
no the only there they work on the buddy

934
00:32:54,798 --> 00:32:59,278
system so i can only exchange ideas and

935
00:32:57,519 --> 00:33:02,159
talk to barry

936
00:32:59,278 --> 00:33:03,599
now this really interferes with science

937
00:33:02,159 --> 00:33:05,919
because science is based on free

938
00:33:03,599 --> 00:33:08,079
discussion and ideally you get a bunch

939
00:33:05,919 --> 00:33:09,600
of guys together exchange ideas work on

940
00:33:08,079 --> 00:33:10,398
problems and that's how things move

941
00:33:09,599 --> 00:33:13,278
forward

942
00:33:10,398 --> 00:33:16,158
but they're so over the top concerned

943
00:33:13,278 --> 00:33:17,200
about security they split everything off

944
00:33:16,159 --> 00:33:20,640
and

945
00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:23,360
everybody becomes stagnant it it

946
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:26,399
it just destroys any of the progress you

947
00:33:23,359 --> 00:33:28,319
can make or at least makes it go so slow

948
00:33:26,398 --> 00:33:30,239
um they i think they wind up shooting

949
00:33:28,319 --> 00:33:31,439
themselves in the foot which is probably

950
00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:33,519
why they

951
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:35,919
arrived at this bottleneck that they

952
00:33:33,519 --> 00:33:37,759
needed to get this madman with a jet

953
00:33:35,919 --> 00:33:39,360
powered honda to come in and see what he

954
00:33:37,759 --> 00:33:41,200
could do i think that was an act of

955
00:33:39,359 --> 00:33:43,038
desperation i think they wanted someone

956
00:33:41,200 --> 00:33:45,120
that thinks out of the box and let's

957
00:33:43,038 --> 00:33:47,119
just give this guy a try here because

958
00:33:45,119 --> 00:33:47,918
they weren't and uh they might have done

959
00:33:47,119 --> 00:33:50,558
this

960
00:33:47,919 --> 00:33:52,080
four more times since uh you know up to

961
00:33:50,558 --> 00:33:54,158
the point in time today assuming they're

962
00:33:52,079 --> 00:33:57,439
still working on this thing

963
00:33:54,159 --> 00:33:59,440
and when you see this craft and you're

964
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:01,759
inside was there any

965
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:04,240
indication that there was an area that

966
00:34:01,759 --> 00:34:06,480
they would use to control it to pilot

967
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:08,398
was there a pilot seat

968
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:11,039
was there's there were three seats they

969
00:34:08,398 --> 00:34:12,638
sat around uh the reactor was in the

970
00:34:11,039 --> 00:34:14,800
dead center of it

971
00:34:12,639 --> 00:34:16,320
and then equidistant around there were

972
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:19,519
three seats

973
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:21,599
so and that's all there was a a large

974
00:34:19,519 --> 00:34:24,960
you would they're not consoles there are

975
00:34:21,599 --> 00:34:27,838
large rectangular objects also spaced

976
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:29,280
equidistant around the center um there's

977
00:34:27,838 --> 00:34:31,119
nothing on them there's no buttons

978
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:33,359
there's no lights and they control the

979
00:34:31,119 --> 00:34:34,879
same color everything is the same color

980
00:34:33,358 --> 00:34:36,559
different shape right

981
00:34:34,878 --> 00:34:38,239
and um

982
00:34:36,559 --> 00:34:41,199
directly underneath them there's three

983
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:43,358
levels in the craft uh the main level is

984
00:34:41,199 --> 00:34:44,638
what we're talking about directly under

985
00:34:43,358 --> 00:34:46,559
that

986
00:34:44,639 --> 00:34:48,960
those are the gravity amplifiers the big

987
00:34:46,559 --> 00:34:51,440
rectangular objects underneath them are

988
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:53,119
the gravity emitters that look like for

989
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:55,760
lack of a better word a trash can

990
00:34:53,119 --> 00:34:58,079
hanging on a pipe three of those and

991
00:34:55,760 --> 00:35:00,160
then the top layer

992
00:34:58,079 --> 00:35:02,400
i this is just my personal belief i

993
00:35:00,159 --> 00:35:04,399
think that has to do with a

994
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:08,240
a navigation or their version of a

995
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:10,160
computer uh with some planar panels

996
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:11,919
sensor panels around the craft that we

997
00:35:10,159 --> 00:35:14,159
would call portholes but they're not

998
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:16,800
portholes they're just black areas and i

999
00:35:14,159 --> 00:35:18,719
think that just determines its

1000
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:21,519
you know position in space

1001
00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:24,559
but i was i i physically was in the

1002
00:35:21,519 --> 00:35:26,320
center section and i stuck my torso in

1003
00:35:24,559 --> 00:35:27,599
the bottom section and hung upside down

1004
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:29,519
so i could see

1005
00:35:27,599 --> 00:35:30,400
how the gravity amplifiers were

1006
00:35:29,519 --> 00:35:32,239
positioned

1007
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:34,480
what is the the roughly the size of this

1008
00:35:32,239 --> 00:35:37,519
thing it's a i think it

1009
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:40,159
i don't remember from being there but um

1010
00:35:37,519 --> 00:35:42,000
after all this stuff was over i had uh

1011
00:35:40,159 --> 00:35:44,319
john andrews a guy from the testers

1012
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:47,280
model corporation and you know we sat

1013
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:48,559
down and tried to figure out from what i

1014
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:49,680
saw

1015
00:35:48,559 --> 00:35:51,759
um

1016
00:35:49,679 --> 00:35:54,639
and known sizes of things and we came up

1017
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:56,720
with 52 feet in diameter

1018
00:35:54,639 --> 00:35:59,519
so i think that's really small yeah so i

1019
00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:00,959
think that's a fair a reasonable guess

1020
00:35:59,519 --> 00:36:02,960
now you said there's nine of them and

1021
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:05,440
you got a brief glimpse at the other

1022
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:06,480
ones were they how are they different

1023
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:08,000
oh

1024
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,400
they looked completely different one

1025
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:12,719
looked like i called it jello mold and

1026
00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:14,800
it it looked like a classic jello mold

1027
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:16,559
with the rippled sides to it one was a

1028
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,800
very flat disc

1029
00:36:16,559 --> 00:36:20,239
um

1030
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:22,160
you know like a

1031
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:24,159
oh i don't like a straw hat or something

1032
00:36:22,159 --> 00:36:27,199
like that that was sitting up on its

1033
00:36:24,159 --> 00:36:30,480
edge and the thin part of it had looked

1034
00:36:27,199 --> 00:36:32,319
like a projectile had been fired through

1035
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:34,639
the edge of it so i don't know if they

1036
00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:37,359
were attempting to see if the metal

1037
00:36:34,639 --> 00:36:38,400
could be penetrated or if something or

1038
00:36:37,358 --> 00:36:40,000
if that's

1039
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:42,800
where the thing came from maybe it was

1040
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:44,719
shot down um but that was the only one

1041
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:46,720
where i saw there was you know actual

1042
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:49,039
physical damage to it

1043
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,639
and that one was roughly the same size

1044
00:36:49,039 --> 00:36:52,880
they're all uh they were kind of too far

1045
00:36:50,639 --> 00:36:54,639
away to tell

1046
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:56,400
and did

1047
00:36:54,639 --> 00:36:57,759
there was several teams that were

1048
00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,119
working on the propulsion system so

1049
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:01,839
there was different teams that were

1050
00:36:59,119 --> 00:37:05,280
working on these different aircrafts i i

1051
00:37:01,838 --> 00:37:06,799
don't know i could only assume

1052
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:08,400
now when you're

1053
00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,720
sitting in this thing

1054
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:12,720
and you're looking at this

1055
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:14,559
otherworldly craft

1056
00:37:12,719 --> 00:37:17,039
your your goal is to try to figure out

1057
00:37:14,559 --> 00:37:19,599
how this thing functions your goal is to

1058
00:37:17,039 --> 00:37:21,599
try to figure out how this reactor

1059
00:37:19,599 --> 00:37:23,200
i mean but you would imagine they would

1060
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:25,680
give you more time than just one day to

1061
00:37:23,199 --> 00:37:26,879
check that out oh yeah it wasn't one day

1062
00:37:25,679 --> 00:37:29,440
right

1063
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:31,760
yeah i mean this is barry was there

1064
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:33,358
i think barry was sleeping there i'm

1065
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:35,040
sure they had now

1066
00:37:33,358 --> 00:37:36,639
that that isn't weird i mean up at the

1067
00:37:35,039 --> 00:37:40,159
toenap test range where they work on

1068
00:37:36,639 --> 00:37:42,480
stealth fighters you know you go i think

1069
00:37:40,159 --> 00:37:44,239
three weeks on one week off and you stay

1070
00:37:42,480 --> 00:37:46,880
up there too so it's not weird to stay

1071
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:48,719
up at the test site right so um yeah i

1072
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:50,720
think he pretty much didn't he acted

1073
00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:52,239
like he's been up there for a long time

1074
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:54,879
yeah um

1075
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:57,199
but he's still there yeah who knows do

1076
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:59,920
you do you have contact with this guy no

1077
00:37:57,199 --> 00:38:03,039
oh no i wish i did i kind of thought he

1078
00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:06,400
was going to come out after i did right

1079
00:38:03,039 --> 00:38:09,039
and i think i took so much flack and

1080
00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:11,039
it's so much [ __ ] for what went on

1081
00:38:09,039 --> 00:38:13,279
i think i actually i wound up helping

1082
00:38:11,039 --> 00:38:15,519
security there and everybody became

1083
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:17,119
afraid of you know doing or saying

1084
00:38:15,519 --> 00:38:20,079
anything after that

1085
00:38:17,119 --> 00:38:21,760
so what kind of reports did you have to

1086
00:38:20,079 --> 00:38:22,960
give like so you're not making much

1087
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,320
progress right you're just trying to

1088
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:26,639
figure out what this thing is and it

1089
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:28,800
seems impossible so well we didn't

1090
00:38:26,639 --> 00:38:31,039
personally make them i mean we were

1091
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:32,400
always there was never a lot of

1092
00:38:31,039 --> 00:38:34,639
information

1093
00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:35,760
that we gained um

1094
00:38:34,639 --> 00:38:37,358
the guy

1095
00:38:35,760 --> 00:38:39,280
you would call him our supervisor his

1096
00:38:37,358 --> 00:38:42,319
name was dennis mariani

1097
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:44,880
and kind of a military looking guy and

1098
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:47,680
he would routinely pop in you know

1099
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:50,240
during the day and you know hey what's

1100
00:38:47,679 --> 00:38:52,480
going on guys and he would essentially

1101
00:38:50,239 --> 00:38:54,000
relay any information anything new we

1102
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,480
came up with i mean he was our

1103
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:58,320
go-between you know where we presented

1104
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,679
him the information then he took it to

1105
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,559
wherever they were

1106
00:38:59,679 --> 00:39:02,399
you know

1107
00:39:00,559 --> 00:39:04,480
assembling all the data from everybody

1108
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:06,400
no i assume you're working normal days

1109
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,119
like an eight-hour day no

1110
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:09,760
no

1111
00:39:07,119 --> 00:39:11,519
no it was really weird that i would be

1112
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:13,680
only called in on certain times and

1113
00:39:11,519 --> 00:39:15,199
certain days and they would be weird

1114
00:39:13,679 --> 00:39:16,719
hours too

1115
00:39:15,199 --> 00:39:18,639
most of the time was later in the

1116
00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:20,480
evening i mean i can get a call at 11

1117
00:39:18,639 --> 00:39:22,400
o'clock at night and they'll say you

1118
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,760
know it's now 11 o'clock

1119
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:26,559
um

1120
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:29,119
by 11 45 you need to be at mccarran

1121
00:39:26,559 --> 00:39:31,440
terminal and um

1122
00:39:29,119 --> 00:39:33,200
you know we'll let you know when

1123
00:39:31,440 --> 00:39:35,760
we have more information but what did

1124
00:39:33,199 --> 00:39:37,118
you do while you were there if you're

1125
00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:38,560
looking at this

1126
00:39:37,119 --> 00:39:41,119
object this

1127
00:39:38,559 --> 00:39:43,039
reactor and you can't figure out what it

1128
00:39:41,119 --> 00:39:44,720
is or how it works other than the fact

1129
00:39:43,039 --> 00:39:46,400
that it works on this element that we

1130
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:48,000
don't even know about sure i mean the

1131
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:50,800
thing was to

1132
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:52,239
what you do in you know

1133
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:54,079
with anything if you're trying to

1134
00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:55,439
analyze it all you can do is perform

1135
00:39:54,079 --> 00:39:57,920
tests

1136
00:39:55,440 --> 00:40:00,000
and all we did is try and come up with

1137
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:03,440
every kind of test we possibly could i

1138
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:05,039
mean we tested you know it

1139
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,880
it violated

1140
00:40:05,039 --> 00:40:09,679
a lot of what we thought was impossible

1141
00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:12,400
to violate i mean one of the first laws

1142
00:40:09,679 --> 00:40:14,480
of thermodynamics i mean essentially any

1143
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:16,320
machine any device that operates always

1144
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:18,880
makes extra heat

1145
00:40:16,320 --> 00:40:20,800
nothing works at 100 efficient

1146
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:23,119
even the headphones you're wearing

1147
00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:24,880
anything that takes power some of that

1148
00:40:23,119 --> 00:40:27,440
power is going to be con converted to

1149
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:29,358
heat and it's just wasted

1150
00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:31,280
this didn't i mean we looked at back

1151
00:40:29,358 --> 00:40:32,960
then we had infrared cameras they're

1152
00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:34,640
different today but back then you had to

1153
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:37,440
pour liquid nitrogen

1154
00:40:34,639 --> 00:40:38,639
into the camera to cool the sensor down

1155
00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:40,320
and um

1156
00:40:38,639 --> 00:40:41,279
and get these infrared images you've

1157
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:43,680
seen

1158
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:46,880
but it never got no matter what the load

1159
00:40:43,679 --> 00:40:48,639
was on the reactor it never got above

1160
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:52,079
the ambient temperature which is

1161
00:40:48,639 --> 00:40:54,799
impossible i mean you're you know

1162
00:40:52,079 --> 00:40:57,680
pulling out huge amounts of power and

1163
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:59,599
nothing ever gets warm

1164
00:40:57,679 --> 00:41:01,598
we tried measuring magnetic fields and

1165
00:40:59,599 --> 00:41:04,000
there was was nothing there so we

1166
00:41:01,599 --> 00:41:05,920
started playing around with the

1167
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:07,280
emission from the emitters the gravity

1168
00:41:05,920 --> 00:41:10,159
wave itself

1169
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:12,800
and saw what we could do with it and how

1170
00:41:10,159 --> 00:41:14,399
it was focused so we really spent all

1171
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:16,160
our time

1172
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,559
just trying to see

1173
00:41:16,159 --> 00:41:20,799
what the stuff can do and what we can

1174
00:41:18,559 --> 00:41:22,400
control so you were seeing what it could

1175
00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:24,318
do but you couldn't ever figure out how

1176
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:27,200
it was doing it

1177
00:41:24,318 --> 00:41:29,358
no not really i mean we really we really

1178
00:41:27,199 --> 00:41:31,519
could only use a or come up with a best

1179
00:41:29,358 --> 00:41:34,559
guess and

1180
00:41:31,519 --> 00:41:36,480
now i can't say we really

1181
00:41:34,559 --> 00:41:39,119
that i could absolutely state for

1182
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:40,719
certainly or certainty how anything

1183
00:41:39,119 --> 00:41:41,920
actually worked

1184
00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:44,799
now

1185
00:41:41,920 --> 00:41:47,838
how do did you know at all how they were

1186
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:50,079
piloting it because some they were doing

1187
00:41:47,838 --> 00:41:50,960
some tests where they're having these

1188
00:41:50,079 --> 00:41:53,039
things

1189
00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:54,318
fly around in the sky

1190
00:41:53,039 --> 00:41:56,960
and this is

1191
00:41:54,318 --> 00:41:59,838
what gets us deeper into your story

1192
00:41:56,960 --> 00:41:59,838
right um

1193
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:04,720
i was out there for uh

1194
00:42:03,119 --> 00:42:05,519
one test

1195
00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:08,318
um

1196
00:42:05,519 --> 00:42:11,599
right in fact i was in with barry in the

1197
00:42:08,318 --> 00:42:13,199
lab and dennis came in and said uh we're

1198
00:42:11,599 --> 00:42:15,599
about to run the test why don't you guys

1199
00:42:13,199 --> 00:42:18,000
come out or i think he said barry why

1200
00:42:15,599 --> 00:42:21,119
don't you come out here and bring bob

1201
00:42:18,000 --> 00:42:24,079
with you uh we went out there and

1202
00:42:21,119 --> 00:42:27,440
the craft was already outside the hangar

1203
00:42:24,079 --> 00:42:29,440
and was just preparing to lift off now

1204
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:31,760
they were in communication with somebody

1205
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:33,599
in the craft so there's a person in the

1206
00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:35,920
crowd yeah there was

1207
00:42:33,599 --> 00:42:37,599
certainly a person in there now it's not

1208
00:42:35,920 --> 00:42:39,760
a comfortable place to be in because

1209
00:42:37,599 --> 00:42:42,160
it's small so the guy has to be sitting

1210
00:42:39,760 --> 00:42:44,079
on the floor in the middle uh my best

1211
00:42:42,159 --> 00:42:45,440
guess and this is the same specific

1212
00:42:44,079 --> 00:42:46,640
craft that you heard that was because

1213
00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:48,639
you were that was the only craft that

1214
00:42:46,639 --> 00:42:50,960
you were the only one that i i touched

1215
00:42:48,639 --> 00:42:53,519
and worked on um

1216
00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:56,318
and it it quietly lifted off the ground

1217
00:42:53,519 --> 00:42:58,639
which was incredibly impressive to see

1218
00:42:56,318 --> 00:42:59,440
quietly or silently

1219
00:42:58,639 --> 00:43:01,920
what's

1220
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,200
well quietly because it

1221
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:05,680
didn't make sense

1222
00:43:03,199 --> 00:43:07,439
it produced um

1223
00:43:05,679 --> 00:43:09,358
a little corona discharge from the

1224
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:11,920
bottom a corona discharge is kind of a

1225
00:43:09,358 --> 00:43:13,759
high voltage brush little bluish glow

1226
00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:16,000
discharge as it was lifting off the

1227
00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:17,520
ground you can hear a slight hiss sound

1228
00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:19,280
now as soon as it cleared the ground by

1229
00:43:17,519 --> 00:43:21,280
about five or ten feet

1230
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:24,640
maybe even less than that the hissing

1231
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:26,640
stopped and the blue gold disappeared so

1232
00:43:24,639 --> 00:43:28,480
it lifted off quietly and then it

1233
00:43:26,639 --> 00:43:29,598
hovered silently if you want to be

1234
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:32,480
specific

1235
00:43:29,599 --> 00:43:33,519
wow so then what kind of maneuvers was

1236
00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:35,760
it doing

1237
00:43:33,519 --> 00:43:38,079
it took uh for that particular time it

1238
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:39,760
took off moved a little around around to

1239
00:43:38,079 --> 00:43:40,560
the left and right and then sat back

1240
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:42,480
down

1241
00:43:40,559 --> 00:43:44,719
the um

1242
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:46,480
the craft itself

1243
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:48,799
um

1244
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:52,318
they communicated with it with a reg

1245
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:54,880
because i saw the guy talking

1246
00:43:52,318 --> 00:43:57,519
in a regular vhf radio

1247
00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:59,838
to the person in the craft and i even

1248
00:43:57,519 --> 00:44:02,079
saw the frequency that was on the

1249
00:43:59,838 --> 00:44:04,239
the frequency counter of the uh

1250
00:44:02,079 --> 00:44:05,280
communication the transceiver there

1251
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:07,118
um

1252
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:09,519
but what's weird is

1253
00:44:07,119 --> 00:44:13,280
he shouldn't be able to communicate

1254
00:44:09,519 --> 00:44:14,880
with the craft with a radio the radio

1255
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:17,519
the radio wave should bend around the

1256
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:20,559
craft i mean it shouldn't be possible

1257
00:44:17,519 --> 00:44:22,719
every single thing about these the craft

1258
00:44:20,559 --> 00:44:25,039
and the way they operated

1259
00:44:22,719 --> 00:44:26,799
didn't make any sense to us i mean

1260
00:44:25,039 --> 00:44:28,639
that's something we talked about for a

1261
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,160
while after why should the frequency

1262
00:44:28,639 --> 00:44:31,440
bend around the craft

1263
00:44:30,159 --> 00:44:32,960
well

1264
00:44:31,440 --> 00:44:35,039
you really have to look at the way the

1265
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:37,440
gravity wave comes out of the craft

1266
00:44:35,039 --> 00:44:39,519
there's a the reactors in the center and

1267
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:41,280
there's a waveguide that goes up to the

1268
00:44:39,519 --> 00:44:43,199
top there's actually a small appendage

1269
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,800
that sticks out at the top of the craft

1270
00:44:43,199 --> 00:44:46,480
and it produces a heart-shaped

1271
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:49,200
gravitational distortion around the

1272
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:52,000
craft now if the craft is sitting in the

1273
00:44:49,199 --> 00:44:53,039
air and you walk underneath it and look

1274
00:44:52,000 --> 00:44:56,159
up

1275
00:44:53,039 --> 00:44:58,559
you actually cannot see the craft the

1276
00:44:56,159 --> 00:45:01,920
light bends around it your bending

1277
00:44:58,559 --> 00:45:03,519
gravity bends light it bends radio waves

1278
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:06,079
it's um

1279
00:45:03,519 --> 00:45:07,920
it it shouldn't be possible to

1280
00:45:06,079 --> 00:45:10,400
communicate with a craft that has an

1281
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,838
envelope around it that's distorting all

1282
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,119
forms of energy

1283
00:45:11,838 --> 00:45:15,039
but

1284
00:45:13,119 --> 00:45:17,358
they were apparently in contact with it

1285
00:45:15,039 --> 00:45:19,358
somehow or another through some

1286
00:45:17,358 --> 00:45:21,119
unexplained way that they don't bother

1287
00:45:19,358 --> 00:45:22,639
explaining to you

1288
00:45:21,119 --> 00:45:24,480
so this thing gets up it just does some

1289
00:45:22,639 --> 00:45:26,159
very simple maneuvers left right left

1290
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:27,519
right goes down

1291
00:45:26,159 --> 00:45:29,279
um and

1292
00:45:27,519 --> 00:45:30,639
did they discuss this with you i mean

1293
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:32,800
they said they wanted you to see it no

1294
00:45:30,639 --> 00:45:35,039
they they just wanted no they they

1295
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:37,119
didn't discuss anything with me it said

1296
00:45:35,039 --> 00:45:38,719
it sat down we looked around for a bit

1297
00:45:37,119 --> 00:45:40,640
and barry said let's go back we went

1298
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:41,279
back in the lab all we got to do is see

1299
00:45:40,639 --> 00:45:42,719
it

1300
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:45,519
um

1301
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:47,598
fast forward

1302
00:45:45,519 --> 00:45:49,838
to some months later

1303
00:45:47,599 --> 00:45:51,838
i did have the test flight schedule of

1304
00:45:49,838 --> 00:45:54,799
the craft now they had times they had

1305
00:45:51,838 --> 00:45:56,480
designated high performance tests this

1306
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:59,280
obviously wasn't one

1307
00:45:56,480 --> 00:46:02,000
that was a high performance test the

1308
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:04,319
high performance test went goes above

1309
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:05,760
the mountain range and they do much more

1310
00:46:04,318 --> 00:46:09,358
radical moves with the thing look this

1311
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:10,480
is a prized item and they're not doing

1312
00:46:09,358 --> 00:46:12,078
anything like taking it out of the

1313
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:13,838
atmosphere or flying around to other

1314
00:46:12,079 --> 00:46:15,280
countries or anything like that

1315
00:46:13,838 --> 00:46:17,119
they just play with this thing right

1316
00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:19,040
over the test site

1317
00:46:17,119 --> 00:46:19,920
but they were doing some radical moves

1318
00:46:19,039 --> 00:46:22,159
with it

1319
00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:24,880
and since i had the test flight schedule

1320
00:46:22,159 --> 00:46:24,879
statistically

1321
00:46:25,119 --> 00:46:28,000
the

1322
00:46:26,159 --> 00:46:30,639
amount of traffic and the surrounding

1323
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:32,639
areas on the highway was lowest on

1324
00:46:30,639 --> 00:46:34,480
wednesdays and that's why

1325
00:46:32,639 --> 00:46:36,719
dennis told us that

1326
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:39,199
all the test flights occurred only on

1327
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:40,639
wednesdays because it'd be the least

1328
00:46:39,199 --> 00:46:41,759
chance that anyone would see what's

1329
00:46:40,639 --> 00:46:44,159
going on

1330
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:47,119
and this was before the the government

1331
00:46:44,159 --> 00:46:50,078
had expanded the forbidden territory

1332
00:46:47,119 --> 00:46:51,680
around area 51 and papoose lake and all

1333
00:46:50,079 --> 00:46:53,839
that stuff right

1334
00:46:51,679 --> 00:46:56,159
yeah i think that occurred

1335
00:46:53,838 --> 00:46:58,318
after my story came out then people

1336
00:46:56,159 --> 00:47:00,559
started going up on the mountaintops and

1337
00:46:58,318 --> 00:47:02,079
trying to look down into there and they

1338
00:47:00,559 --> 00:47:04,880
kind of freaked out and then did the

1339
00:47:02,079 --> 00:47:07,200
land grab and pushed everybody back but

1340
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:08,559
yeah that i think all that occurred long

1341
00:47:07,199 --> 00:47:10,799
after

1342
00:47:08,559 --> 00:47:11,759
i'm sorry that i came out

1343
00:47:10,800 --> 00:47:13,839
so

1344
00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:15,280
you're working there and while you're

1345
00:47:13,838 --> 00:47:16,639
working there you're under this crazy

1346
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:19,359
schedule

1347
00:47:16,639 --> 00:47:20,159
forgive me for explaining your story but

1348
00:47:19,358 --> 00:47:22,239
you

1349
00:47:20,159 --> 00:47:26,318
uh would get these phone calls you would

1350
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:27,279
have to go to the to the airport at 11

1351
00:47:26,318 --> 00:47:29,119
p.m

1352
00:47:27,280 --> 00:47:31,599
and your wife started thinking that you

1353
00:47:29,119 --> 00:47:33,358
were having an affair

1354
00:47:31,599 --> 00:47:36,400
yeah apparently so

1355
00:47:33,358 --> 00:47:38,400
um now i did give my permission to have

1356
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:41,760
you know as as part of the

1357
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:43,838
you know security clearance process um i

1358
00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:45,680
i gave written permission to have the

1359
00:47:43,838 --> 00:47:47,599
phones monitored and things of that sort

1360
00:47:45,679 --> 00:47:49,279
so they weren't doing any covert stuff

1361
00:47:47,599 --> 00:47:51,519
they um

1362
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:53,839
you know with any queue clearance or

1363
00:47:51,519 --> 00:47:55,920
which is civilian top secret clearance

1364
00:47:53,838 --> 00:47:57,599
or military top secret clearance they go

1365
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:58,639
talk to friends and

1366
00:47:57,599 --> 00:48:00,000
you know

1367
00:47:58,639 --> 00:48:01,039
place places you've been make sure

1368
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,119
you're not connected to foreign

1369
00:48:01,039 --> 00:48:04,960
countries but you know monitoring your

1370
00:48:03,119 --> 00:48:06,400
phone is nothing unusual

1371
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:07,440
however

1372
00:48:06,400 --> 00:48:08,880
they

1373
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:10,720
insisted that

1374
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:12,240
you know you don't even talk

1375
00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:14,719
to your loved one to your partner to

1376
00:48:12,239 --> 00:48:17,039
your wife whatever about what's going on

1377
00:48:14,719 --> 00:48:18,480
so she was essentially in the dark

1378
00:48:17,039 --> 00:48:19,599
and didn't know the phone was being

1379
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:21,280
monitored

1380
00:48:19,599 --> 00:48:23,838
well

1381
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:25,839
part of the security clearance

1382
00:48:23,838 --> 00:48:27,358
is that not only do you not have any

1383
00:48:25,838 --> 00:48:29,358
connections to foreign countries and

1384
00:48:27,358 --> 00:48:31,279
aren't a maniac but you have to have a

1385
00:48:29,358 --> 00:48:33,519
stable home life too

1386
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:35,040
well she started having an affair with a

1387
00:48:33,519 --> 00:48:37,119
flight instructor

1388
00:48:35,039 --> 00:48:39,440
now they were monitoring this on the

1389
00:48:37,119 --> 00:48:41,280
phone and they knew it and i didn't

1390
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:44,000
so they stopped me

1391
00:48:41,280 --> 00:48:45,599
coming in and their attitude at the time

1392
00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:47,119
was

1393
00:48:45,599 --> 00:48:49,519
we need to see how this is going to play

1394
00:48:47,119 --> 00:48:51,599
out and if lazar is going to get a

1395
00:48:49,519 --> 00:48:52,880
little weird or anything so

1396
00:48:51,599 --> 00:48:55,599
let's just

1397
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:56,720
you know hold him off from coming in

1398
00:48:55,599 --> 00:48:58,318
and

1399
00:48:56,719 --> 00:49:00,480
you know see what happens and they

1400
00:48:58,318 --> 00:49:02,880
explain this to you what was happening

1401
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,318
well after the fact yeah because time

1402
00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:05,200
kind of went on

1403
00:49:04,318 --> 00:49:06,880
and

1404
00:49:05,199 --> 00:49:09,039
there were guys that were following me

1405
00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:10,800
around and i started getting a little

1406
00:49:09,039 --> 00:49:12,480
concerned going well

1407
00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:16,160
ted are they

1408
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:17,679
booting me out of the project and if so

1409
00:49:16,159 --> 00:49:19,920
they're not just going to let me hang

1410
00:49:17,679 --> 00:49:21,118
out at home and go get a new job knowing

1411
00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:22,318
what i know

1412
00:49:21,119 --> 00:49:24,160
so

1413
00:49:22,318 --> 00:49:26,079
as time went on i started getting a

1414
00:49:24,159 --> 00:49:28,239
little concerned and

1415
00:49:26,079 --> 00:49:30,720
i took my closest friends and just kind

1416
00:49:28,239 --> 00:49:33,199
of got together and i said hey

1417
00:49:30,719 --> 00:49:35,118
remember that job i told you about

1418
00:49:33,199 --> 00:49:37,439
this is what's going on

1419
00:49:35,119 --> 00:49:38,640
and uh like you don't need to take my

1420
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,960
word for it

1421
00:49:38,639 --> 00:49:42,639
on wednesday night we need to all go out

1422
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:45,920
here i want to show you what's going on

1423
00:49:42,639 --> 00:49:48,000
so i took everybody and we went out to

1424
00:49:45,920 --> 00:49:51,599
um remember since i had the test flight

1425
00:49:48,000 --> 00:49:53,679
schedule and went outside the base

1426
00:49:51,599 --> 00:49:55,119
out into the desert and so everybody

1427
00:49:53,679 --> 00:49:56,639
could see you know one of the high

1428
00:49:55,119 --> 00:49:59,280
performance tests

1429
00:49:56,639 --> 00:50:01,039
and you know it left quite an imprint on

1430
00:49:59,280 --> 00:50:03,280
everybody so they knew i wasn't and

1431
00:50:01,039 --> 00:50:05,199
there's videos of these tests right yeah

1432
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:07,359
but remember this is in the

1433
00:50:05,199 --> 00:50:09,519
it's in in the dark in the 80s with a

1434
00:50:07,358 --> 00:50:11,679
big monster-sized camcorder and you got

1435
00:50:09,519 --> 00:50:14,159
you know a bright light jumping around

1436
00:50:11,679 --> 00:50:15,519
but uh yeah i mean we did video of it

1437
00:50:14,159 --> 00:50:17,598
but there's no

1438
00:50:15,519 --> 00:50:19,679
by today's standards it's but is your

1439
00:50:17,599 --> 00:50:20,800
video specifically available the video

1440
00:50:19,679 --> 00:50:24,318
that you took

1441
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:26,720
yeah well george knapp has it it's is it

1442
00:50:24,318 --> 00:50:28,558
i have no idea jeremy yeah i show clips

1443
00:50:26,719 --> 00:50:30,879
of it in my film it's it's online and

1444
00:50:28,559 --> 00:50:33,280
someone did a deep analysis of it uh it

1445
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:34,720
was interesting uh to take a look at how

1446
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,559
well this microphone up to your face

1447
00:50:34,719 --> 00:50:39,118
about a fist from your face all right

1448
00:50:36,559 --> 00:50:41,760
um you know to see how his video looks

1449
00:50:39,119 --> 00:50:43,838
now but as far as video evidence i mean

1450
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:45,839
we are talking 80s camp was the most

1451
00:50:43,838 --> 00:50:48,078
important thing is the human story here

1452
00:50:45,838 --> 00:50:50,000
everybody that he took up there on three

1453
00:50:48,079 --> 00:50:52,400
separate occasions they don't all like

1454
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:54,719
each other they don't all talk they all

1455
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:56,720
agree on one thing they saw something

1456
00:50:54,719 --> 00:50:58,480
that night at the exact point in time

1457
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:01,838
and space that babazar said and remember

1458
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:03,920
this is 17 15 17 miles south of air 51.

1459
00:51:01,838 --> 00:51:05,920
no one even knew really about air 51

1460
00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:07,920
we're talking papoose lake and they all

1461
00:51:05,920 --> 00:51:09,760
agree they saw something that night they

1462
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:11,760
had never seen before and they've never

1463
00:51:09,760 --> 00:51:13,440
seen since right when he said it so

1464
00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:15,760
that's one of like the six things where

1465
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:18,240
i'm like how did he know you can dismiss

1466
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:19,760
him i i tried to dismiss it but some

1467
00:51:18,239 --> 00:51:21,759
things we can't get around and and

1468
00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:23,200
there's about five or six of them how

1469
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:24,480
did he know about this if jamie wants to

1470
00:51:23,199 --> 00:51:25,759
find that video right now what would he

1471
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:28,400
look under

1472
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:30,160
bob lazar ufo

1473
00:51:28,400 --> 00:51:32,400
s for

1474
00:51:30,159 --> 00:51:35,519
area 51 just kind of like that uh so

1475
00:51:32,400 --> 00:51:37,680
it's like this s4 ufo video bob lazar

1476
00:51:35,519 --> 00:51:41,519
and a guy does an analysis but you're

1477
00:51:37,679 --> 00:51:43,838
not analyzing these 80s videos right he

1478
00:51:41,519 --> 00:51:45,599
from the very beginning bob never said i

1479
00:51:43,838 --> 00:51:47,358
have proof of my story and i'm going to

1480
00:51:45,599 --> 00:51:50,079
tell the world he said at the very

1481
00:51:47,358 --> 00:51:52,400
beginning i cannot prove my story that's

1482
00:51:50,079 --> 00:51:54,720
not why i'm telling this george knapp

1483
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:56,000
convinced him to tell people

1484
00:51:54,719 --> 00:51:58,000
and he lived through it and i i didn't

1485
00:51:56,000 --> 00:51:59,039
believe it either until i i talked with

1486
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:00,639
george

1487
00:51:59,039 --> 00:52:02,960
okay so you

1488
00:52:00,639 --> 00:52:04,960
you filmed these

1489
00:52:02,960 --> 00:52:06,800
this test flight one test flight and

1490
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:09,199
then you get caught

1491
00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:10,720
actually it was i think the third time

1492
00:52:09,199 --> 00:52:13,519
because it

1493
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:15,679
we went out there the first time

1494
00:52:13,519 --> 00:52:17,920
everybody saw it everybody was amazed

1495
00:52:15,679 --> 00:52:20,639
because it did some radical maneuvers

1496
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:22,000
and um you know everybody had a lot of

1497
00:52:20,639 --> 00:52:24,400
maneuvers that i've seen i've seen the

1498
00:52:22,000 --> 00:52:26,639
video it doesn't i don't think there's

1499
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:29,680
something we have now that does that no

1500
00:52:26,639 --> 00:52:31,358
in terms of like a human piloted craft

1501
00:52:29,679 --> 00:52:32,960
i mean i don't know obviously with the

1502
00:52:31,358 --> 00:52:35,039
government no it's it's impossible

1503
00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:36,880
nothing can move like that and remember

1504
00:52:35,039 --> 00:52:37,920
we didn't start filming from the very

1505
00:52:36,880 --> 00:52:39,039
beginning

1506
00:52:37,920 --> 00:52:40,639
you know

1507
00:52:39,039 --> 00:52:42,318
we were waiting for something you know

1508
00:52:40,639 --> 00:52:44,400
to happen the craft took off and then

1509
00:52:42,318 --> 00:52:46,159
came flying at us stopped you know

1510
00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:48,000
turned it a right angle flew back and

1511
00:52:46,159 --> 00:52:49,358
then you know after it did some you know

1512
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:51,280
amazing stuff

1513
00:52:49,358 --> 00:52:53,519
to get the camera and then we started

1514
00:52:51,280 --> 00:52:55,200
filming so it doesn't have all of it on

1515
00:52:53,519 --> 00:52:56,480
there it just has some the way i

1516
00:52:55,199 --> 00:52:58,000
describe it to my friends and they said

1517
00:52:56,480 --> 00:53:00,318
what does it look like i said take a

1518
00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:02,239
laser pointer and then have a wall and

1519
00:53:00,318 --> 00:53:03,440
then move it around the wall like you

1520
00:53:02,239 --> 00:53:04,959
know how it moves around the wall it

1521
00:53:03,440 --> 00:53:07,760
doesn't seem like it has anything to do

1522
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:09,920
with inertia or physics or it's not

1523
00:53:07,760 --> 00:53:11,200
impeded in any way by the atmosphere

1524
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:14,079
yeah that's what it looks like you're

1525
00:53:11,199 --> 00:53:17,199
essentially separated from reality as

1526
00:53:14,079 --> 00:53:20,400
crazy as that sounds with it being in in

1527
00:53:17,199 --> 00:53:22,639
case it's an own gravitational envelope

1528
00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:25,280
inertia is not going to affect it and

1529
00:53:22,639 --> 00:53:26,719
you know this is

1530
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:28,880
this is how some of those recent

1531
00:53:26,719 --> 00:53:30,399
sightings of commander david fravor i'm

1532
00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:33,440
sure you've heard of the

1533
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:35,280
ufo i mean he describes exactly

1534
00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:37,519
that the thing operates exactly the way

1535
00:53:35,280 --> 00:53:40,960
i was describing that's why

1536
00:53:37,519 --> 00:53:42,559
he was interested to talk to me um but

1537
00:53:40,960 --> 00:53:43,679
we saw this

1538
00:53:42,559 --> 00:53:45,440
and

1539
00:53:43,679 --> 00:53:46,879
you know on the way home it's like hey

1540
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:49,760
we got away with it we should try it

1541
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:51,519
again the next test flight date so this

1542
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,960
became a thing to do

1543
00:53:51,519 --> 00:53:54,559
and i think it was on

1544
00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:57,440
the third time

1545
00:53:54,559 --> 00:53:59,119
that we got caught i mean we started

1546
00:53:57,440 --> 00:54:01,039
becoming a little careless i think we

1547
00:53:59,119 --> 00:54:02,559
took a motor home out there

1548
00:54:01,039 --> 00:54:04,719
you know i mean it was like the

1549
00:54:02,559 --> 00:54:07,760
stupidest thing you could possibly start

1550
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:10,399
tailgating yeah it was ridiculous and um

1551
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:13,119
again you're in your 20s yeah and you

1552
00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:15,200
know what was funny was um

1553
00:54:13,119 --> 00:54:17,519
we went out there and

1554
00:54:15,199 --> 00:54:19,439
my friend gene huff and i were leaning

1555
00:54:17,519 --> 00:54:21,039
on the front of a vehicle

1556
00:54:19,440 --> 00:54:23,039
and

1557
00:54:21,039 --> 00:54:26,960
just for some reason we just started

1558
00:54:23,039 --> 00:54:29,440
talking [ __ ] like uh well i hope they

1559
00:54:26,960 --> 00:54:31,280
realize that uh

1560
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:33,200
i don't remember what we were saying but

1561
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:34,880
you know that

1562
00:54:33,199 --> 00:54:37,118
something about attacking the base or

1563
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:38,480
something along those lines and stealing

1564
00:54:37,119 --> 00:54:40,079
the craft or

1565
00:54:38,480 --> 00:54:41,280
something like that

1566
00:54:40,079 --> 00:54:43,440
and um

1567
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:45,440
then about 20 feet in front of us we see

1568
00:54:43,440 --> 00:54:47,920
a little green light

1569
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:50,000
fall on the ground and roll to us

1570
00:54:47,920 --> 00:54:51,358
and unbeknownst to us now it's pitch

1571
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:52,639
black you can't see your hand in front

1572
00:54:51,358 --> 00:54:54,880
of your face there were a bunch of

1573
00:54:52,639 --> 00:54:56,879
guards standing right out there and they

1574
00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:59,119
had a night vision scope where they were

1575
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:00,720
like from here to the wall looking at us

1576
00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:02,400
listening to us and the guy dropped it

1577
00:55:00,719 --> 00:55:04,318
and the scope rolled over to us and you

1578
00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:06,400
could see the green screen

1579
00:55:04,318 --> 00:55:08,239
you know we turn the lights on and all

1580
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:10,960
these guys are there so

1581
00:55:08,239 --> 00:55:12,799
it was uh whoa yeah yeah so we did

1582
00:55:10,960 --> 00:55:14,480
incredibly stupid stuff and got caught

1583
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:15,920
as we should have because so when they

1584
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:17,440
catch you and they bring you in then

1585
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:19,039
what happens well i went in for

1586
00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:21,119
debriefing

1587
00:55:19,039 --> 00:55:23,119
the following day i went to indian

1588
00:55:21,119 --> 00:55:24,880
springs air force base which is kind of

1589
00:55:23,119 --> 00:55:26,720
a defunct

1590
00:55:24,880 --> 00:55:28,318
base that they used to use at the

1591
00:55:26,719 --> 00:55:31,199
nuclear test site

1592
00:55:28,318 --> 00:55:32,400
and this is when they brought out

1593
00:55:31,199 --> 00:55:34,558
um

1594
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:36,559
the transcript of the phone call

1595
00:55:34,559 --> 00:55:38,880
with my wife

1596
00:55:36,559 --> 00:55:40,640
and you know they sat me down and we

1597
00:55:38,880 --> 00:55:43,039
said you know when we meant to keep the

1598
00:55:40,639 --> 00:55:45,279
secret we meant you can't tell your

1599
00:55:43,039 --> 00:55:48,000
friends right you know and it just being

1600
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:50,079
sarcastic and trying to mm-hmm um and

1601
00:55:48,000 --> 00:55:52,480
then they got real serious

1602
00:55:50,079 --> 00:55:54,000
uh but this is where they

1603
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:56,400
you know took the transcript out and

1604
00:55:54,000 --> 00:55:58,000
were reading me what uh

1605
00:55:56,400 --> 00:55:59,119
my wife

1606
00:55:58,000 --> 00:56:01,199
and

1607
00:55:59,119 --> 00:56:03,440
you know our friend were talking about

1608
00:56:01,199 --> 00:56:05,519
and uh

1609
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:07,760
it was a hard time so what happens from

1610
00:56:05,519 --> 00:56:07,759
there

1611
00:56:08,079 --> 00:56:10,480
what do they do with you why don't they

1612
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:13,119
arrest you

1613
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:15,358
i don't i don't know i don't know why

1614
00:56:13,119 --> 00:56:18,160
i'm not sure they exactly they knew what

1615
00:56:15,358 --> 00:56:20,558
to do but they did let me go

1616
00:56:18,159 --> 00:56:22,639
that night and i went home

1617
00:56:20,559 --> 00:56:24,559
and that this is kind of when the most

1618
00:56:22,639 --> 00:56:26,639
stressful part started because you're

1619
00:56:24,559 --> 00:56:28,720
realizing you're being monitored

1620
00:56:26,639 --> 00:56:31,118
yeah now i know not only am i being

1621
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:33,838
monitored but now i know i'm in trouble

1622
00:56:31,119 --> 00:56:36,400
and uh it wasn't a short time after that

1623
00:56:33,838 --> 00:56:37,119
that i contacted you know at that time

1624
00:56:36,400 --> 00:56:39,200
the

1625
00:56:37,119 --> 00:56:41,599
only investigative reporter i had heard

1626
00:56:39,199 --> 00:56:43,838
of in las vegas was george knapp

1627
00:56:41,599 --> 00:56:45,440
and um you know told him some of the

1628
00:56:43,838 --> 00:56:47,279
story because i had no idea what the

1629
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:49,200
hell was going to happen at that point

1630
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:50,880
so george knapp

1631
00:56:49,199 --> 00:56:52,960
tries to

1632
00:56:50,880 --> 00:56:53,920
dissect your story tries to find holes

1633
00:56:52,960 --> 00:56:56,159
in it

1634
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:57,440
tells it puts it online and makes

1635
00:56:56,159 --> 00:56:59,598
everybody aware of it and that's how i

1636
00:56:57,440 --> 00:57:01,119
found out about it yeah to make a long

1637
00:56:59,599 --> 00:57:02,960
story short

1638
00:57:01,119 --> 00:57:05,119
what happens yeah to really make a long

1639
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:07,519
story short what happens from there on i

1640
00:57:05,119 --> 00:57:11,880
mean do they contact you and say hey bob

1641
00:57:07,519 --> 00:57:11,880
it's probably a good idea if you shut up

1642
00:57:12,079 --> 00:57:15,440
how

1643
00:57:13,358 --> 00:57:17,679
did they try to label you as crazy was

1644
00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:19,119
there

1645
00:57:17,679 --> 00:57:22,318
there were boy there were a lot of

1646
00:57:19,119 --> 00:57:24,838
things that happened at you know between

1647
00:57:22,318 --> 00:57:28,558
that point um i'm leaving out a lot of

1648
00:57:24,838 --> 00:57:30,880
stuff to fill in the story

1649
00:57:28,559 --> 00:57:33,040
we'd have to go back to los alamos and

1650
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:34,480
and

1651
00:57:33,039 --> 00:57:37,440
well i really don't want to talk about

1652
00:57:34,480 --> 00:57:39,039
that the um

1653
00:57:37,440 --> 00:57:41,039
top secret weapons

1654
00:57:39,039 --> 00:57:43,358
stuff that you were working on

1655
00:57:41,039 --> 00:57:45,599
no i'm talking about the 115.

1656
00:57:43,358 --> 00:57:45,598
um

1657
00:57:46,239 --> 00:57:49,439
well i don't know i have to think about

1658
00:57:47,599 --> 00:57:52,318
how i'd

1659
00:57:49,440 --> 00:57:52,318
what is the problem

1660
00:57:52,838 --> 00:57:57,440
i don't want to get myself into more

1661
00:57:55,280 --> 00:57:59,839
trouble by admitting something so

1662
00:57:57,440 --> 00:58:01,679
um i just have to dance around a couple

1663
00:57:59,838 --> 00:58:03,599
he was created just during the filming

1664
00:58:01,679 --> 00:58:05,358
of the movie people thought the movie's

1665
00:58:03,599 --> 00:58:07,359
great by the way thanks joe and uh it's

1666
00:58:05,358 --> 00:58:08,798
on netflix right now if anybody wants to

1667
00:58:07,358 --> 00:58:10,159
check it out and if you're one of those

1668
00:58:08,798 --> 00:58:12,639
people like me

1669
00:58:10,159 --> 00:58:15,118
who um you know i've always

1670
00:58:12,639 --> 00:58:17,679
loved the idea of ufos i became

1671
00:58:15,119 --> 00:58:19,920
extremely weary talking to people who

1672
00:58:17,679 --> 00:58:21,118
are ufo believers and ufo fanatics

1673
00:58:19,920 --> 00:58:23,119
because there's so many of them that are

1674
00:58:21,119 --> 00:58:26,720
full of [ __ ] and not just full of [ __ ]

1675
00:58:23,119 --> 00:58:28,720
they're they're childishly delirious

1676
00:58:26,719 --> 00:58:30,399
like the way they talk about things i

1677
00:58:28,719 --> 00:58:33,039
mean there's so many people that are

1678
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:34,880
that i'm in contact they they reach me

1679
00:58:33,039 --> 00:58:37,279
in the night and they explain to me what

1680
00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:39,119
we're doing to the ocean is wrong and

1681
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:42,640
like you're like okay this is one of the

1682
00:58:39,119 --> 00:58:42,640
reasons i didn't want to do the show

1683
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:48,400
well it's i mean it's no joke we've had

1684
00:58:46,559 --> 00:58:50,480
people literally camp out on our front

1685
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:51,920
lawn and uh

1686
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:53,679
you know

1687
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:55,358
in some ways i can relate to some of

1688
00:58:53,679 --> 00:58:57,279
these people you know maybe some of them

1689
00:58:55,358 --> 00:58:59,279
did really have some kind of experience

1690
00:58:57,280 --> 00:59:01,119
or saw something and all their friends

1691
00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:03,280
think they're crazy but hey now there's

1692
00:59:01,119 --> 00:59:06,000
this guy i heard on the radio

1693
00:59:03,280 --> 00:59:08,960
and uh at least he knows i'm not full of

1694
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:09,760
[ __ ] so i gotta talk to him and so most

1695
00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:11,519
of the

1696
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:13,440
correspondents i get are people trying

1697
00:59:11,519 --> 00:59:15,199
to get a hold of me going bob you you

1698
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:16,960
gotta listen to me i'm i'm coming to

1699
00:59:15,199 --> 00:59:20,000
talk to you i'm you know i'm driving

1700
00:59:16,960 --> 00:59:22,240
from oklahoma or whatever and and and

1701
00:59:20,000 --> 00:59:24,480
but some of them are just [ __ ] bad

1702
00:59:22,239 --> 00:59:26,159
[ __ ] crazy yeah they're frightening

1703
00:59:24,480 --> 00:59:29,039
there's a lot of schizophrenics that are

1704
00:59:26,159 --> 00:59:30,318
involved in the conspiracy world so

1705
00:59:29,039 --> 00:59:31,519
there's a lot of people that have real

1706
00:59:30,318 --> 00:59:33,199
issues joe

1707
00:59:31,519 --> 00:59:36,000
it would be a disservice to your

1708
00:59:33,199 --> 00:59:37,759
audience to not say that

1709
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:39,199
we have to look at what's going on now

1710
00:59:37,760 --> 00:59:40,720
and understand i've heard

1711
00:59:39,199 --> 00:59:43,118
on your show a bunch of stuff about

1712
00:59:40,719 --> 00:59:45,919
what's going on now and to not really

1713
00:59:43,119 --> 00:59:48,318
understand what's going on now you can't

1714
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:50,318
see bob's story in the correct light

1715
00:59:48,318 --> 00:59:52,639
after 30 years and at some point we

1716
00:59:50,318 --> 00:59:55,119
should just touch upon that

1717
00:59:52,639 --> 00:59:57,920
um the the biggest being that things

1718
00:59:55,119 --> 00:59:59,920
like the tic tac ufo case that came out

1719
00:59:57,920 --> 01:00:01,838
i've heard people even on the show say

1720
00:59:59,920 --> 01:00:04,480
oh there's a glitch in the radar

1721
01:00:01,838 --> 01:00:06,239
that's a data poor perspective you just

1722
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:08,159
don't know yet what's really going on

1723
01:00:06,239 --> 01:00:09,679
commander fravor i was able to get the

1724
01:00:08,159 --> 01:00:12,558
interview with him to talk with him way

1725
01:00:09,679 --> 01:00:15,919
before it became public i got that from

1726
01:00:12,559 --> 01:00:18,480
him he saw it other pilots saw it this

1727
01:00:15,920 --> 01:00:20,400
is a big thing that's going on right now

1728
01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:23,199
they had more sightings on the east

1729
01:00:20,400 --> 01:00:24,720
coast recently cubes with spherical

1730
01:00:23,199 --> 01:00:26,159
auras these are not aerodynamic and

1731
01:00:24,719 --> 01:00:28,719
these are the people we trust to defend

1732
01:00:26,159 --> 01:00:31,279
us on 911 commander favor protected los

1733
01:00:28,719 --> 01:00:33,279
angeles and 911. so we trust them but

1734
01:00:31,280 --> 01:00:34,400
they're not trained observers

1735
01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:36,160
radar

1736
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:37,920
individuals see these things and the big

1737
01:00:36,159 --> 01:00:39,199
the big one just to throw down so we can

1738
01:00:37,920 --> 01:00:41,599
consider a story a little differently

1739
01:00:39,199 --> 01:00:43,039
there's more depth to it the big one is

1740
01:00:41,599 --> 01:00:44,559
the united states government has

1741
01:00:43,039 --> 01:00:47,358
admitted that they have been

1742
01:00:44,559 --> 01:00:50,400
continuously studying the ufo phenomenon

1743
01:00:47,358 --> 01:00:52,159
that program was called a tip advanced

1744
01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:54,880
error or sorry

1745
01:00:52,159 --> 01:00:57,118
was called awsap that that's the

1746
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:58,559
mother program george knapp got that out

1747
01:00:57,119 --> 01:01:00,480
they they announced through the new york

1748
01:00:58,559 --> 01:01:02,960
times about a tip

1749
01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:04,559
but awesome these acronyms asap advanced

1750
01:01:02,960 --> 01:01:06,000
aerospace weapon systems applications

1751
01:01:04,559 --> 01:01:07,760
program who cares

1752
01:01:06,000 --> 01:01:09,519
that was the mother program so they've

1753
01:01:07,760 --> 01:01:11,760
admitted we didn't stop studying ufos in

1754
01:01:09,519 --> 01:01:13,519
1969 with project blue book we don't

1755
01:01:11,760 --> 01:01:15,200
think it's crazy we actually want to

1756
01:01:13,519 --> 01:01:16,960
reverse engineer the technology that's

1757
01:01:15,199 --> 01:01:18,960
why on your other show you said what's

1758
01:01:16,960 --> 01:01:20,639
this aav thing it's like they're making

1759
01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:23,199
up another ufo name well hold on there's

1760
01:01:20,639 --> 01:01:25,039
a reason because in the documents the

1761
01:01:23,199 --> 01:01:26,719
the dia documents that george knapp

1762
01:01:25,039 --> 01:01:28,400
released that everybody said was fake

1763
01:01:26,719 --> 01:01:32,078
till now they know is real

1764
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:34,400
they call them aavs which is advanced

1765
01:01:32,079 --> 01:01:36,480
aerospace vehicles people are getting

1766
01:01:34,400 --> 01:01:38,880
the acronyms wrong so the reason for the

1767
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:40,400
terminology change is so that we can

1768
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:42,640
mimic what we're reading in the dia

1769
01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:44,798
documents people can look for that now

1770
01:01:42,639 --> 01:01:47,039
so they changed the names to get people

1771
01:01:44,798 --> 01:01:49,759
away from ufo or uap even like hillary

1772
01:01:47,039 --> 01:01:51,358
clinton said on air right so what are

1773
01:01:49,760 --> 01:01:52,640
you talking about hillary clinton

1774
01:01:51,358 --> 01:01:55,679
hillary clinton

1775
01:01:52,639 --> 01:01:58,239
informed the public on jimmy kimmel oh

1776
01:01:55,679 --> 01:02:00,879
jimmy we don't call them ufos anymore we

1777
01:01:58,239 --> 01:02:02,000
call them uaps unidentified aerial

1778
01:02:00,880 --> 01:02:03,838
phenomenon

1779
01:02:02,000 --> 01:02:06,159
right so she kind of was giving their

1780
01:02:03,838 --> 01:02:08,480
the clintons are very into the ufo topic

1781
01:02:06,159 --> 01:02:10,639
senator reid you know he he's done a lot

1782
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:11,440
for the for the subject the study of it

1783
01:02:10,639 --> 01:02:13,279
right

1784
01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:15,200
so she informed the public so they could

1785
01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:17,760
look for the right term so these terms

1786
01:02:15,199 --> 01:02:20,639
are important because the dia in those

1787
01:02:17,760 --> 01:02:22,400
documents they've been calling them aavs

1788
01:02:20,639 --> 01:02:25,358
for quite some time now and they change

1789
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:26,960
the name to anomalous no that that's

1790
01:02:25,358 --> 01:02:27,920
kind of a misnomer

1791
01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:29,920
so

1792
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:32,079
they always mess around with things but

1793
01:02:29,920 --> 01:02:33,599
it's actually advanced right but when

1794
01:02:32,079 --> 01:02:35,760
they're describing it in the news they

1795
01:02:33,599 --> 01:02:37,359
were calling an anomalous space vehicle

1796
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:40,880
totally and that's cool they were also

1797
01:02:37,358 --> 01:02:42,159
saying anomalous aerospace threats aat

1798
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:45,280
right because they want the sense of a

1799
01:02:42,159 --> 01:02:46,960
threat right so my point is all of if

1800
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:48,960
people don't know this now and they

1801
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:50,480
think this stuff is is fantasy this this

1802
01:02:48,960 --> 01:02:51,920
part of it that we're studying it that

1803
01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:54,079
we take it seriously we're spending

1804
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:56,720
money on it and that we're getting great

1805
01:02:54,079 --> 01:02:58,240
data from from visual pilots to to radar

1806
01:02:56,719 --> 01:03:00,480
that's why we know it's aerospace they

1807
01:02:58,239 --> 01:03:03,279
dropped from 80 000 feet but guess what

1808
01:03:00,480 --> 01:03:05,838
that's the top scope of the spy 1 radar

1809
01:03:03,280 --> 01:03:08,079
is 80 000 feet so the radar system they

1810
01:03:05,838 --> 01:03:10,159
were using it was coming from above that

1811
01:03:08,079 --> 01:03:12,318
so my point is this

1812
01:03:10,159 --> 01:03:14,639
if you don't understand that this is

1813
01:03:12,318 --> 01:03:16,558
happening you're just behind the curve

1814
01:03:14,639 --> 01:03:18,239
because you don't have the information

1815
01:03:16,559 --> 01:03:20,160
because of the stigma that you're

1816
01:03:18,239 --> 01:03:22,479
talking about i saw you get totally

1817
01:03:20,159 --> 01:03:24,000
upset with the ufo topic i met you first

1818
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:26,480
when you're totally upset with the ufo

1819
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:28,159
topic it's the people when

1820
01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:29,519
when when you're doing your

1821
01:03:28,159 --> 01:03:31,679
i'm sorry man when you're when you're

1822
01:03:29,519 --> 01:03:33,038
doing your show you know the joe organ

1823
01:03:31,679 --> 01:03:34,239
questions everything

1824
01:03:33,039 --> 01:03:35,280
i could see

1825
01:03:34,239 --> 01:03:37,118
how

1826
01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:39,119
how frustrating is trust me i have been

1827
01:03:37,119 --> 01:03:40,720
frustrated to hell luckily my mentors

1828
01:03:39,119 --> 01:03:43,280
george knapp and he's taught me the pit

1829
01:03:40,719 --> 01:03:45,598
bull pitfalls as i went through it my

1830
01:03:43,280 --> 01:03:47,440
whole point in this rant right here

1831
01:03:45,599 --> 01:03:50,720
is just that we have to now look at

1832
01:03:47,440 --> 01:03:52,400
bob's story but knowing the facts

1833
01:03:50,719 --> 01:03:54,000
not someone saying it's a bird it's a

1834
01:03:52,400 --> 01:03:56,079
plane it's a glitch

1835
01:03:54,000 --> 01:03:57,679
they're not and so if you don't know

1836
01:03:56,079 --> 01:03:59,280
that you just don't have the information

1837
01:03:57,679 --> 01:04:02,078
yet not just that knowing the facts as

1838
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:05,680
we know him in 2019 not in 1988

1839
01:04:02,079 --> 01:04:07,119
absolutely and so what has he said

1840
01:04:05,679 --> 01:04:08,879
that has come true he's totally

1841
01:04:07,119 --> 01:04:10,880
unimpressed with it right what has he

1842
01:04:08,880 --> 01:04:13,519
said this come true so i was like bob

1843
01:04:10,880 --> 01:04:15,599
they've announced gravity as a wave you

1844
01:04:13,519 --> 01:04:17,119
were right man you're vindicated and he

1845
01:04:15,599 --> 01:04:19,280
looks at me and he's like well if you

1846
01:04:17,119 --> 01:04:22,640
think about it jeremy i had like a 50 50

1847
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:24,960
chance he was not very impressed right

1848
01:04:22,639 --> 01:04:26,879
when did they announce gravity as a wave

1849
01:04:24,960 --> 01:04:29,280
so they detected in a sense they

1850
01:04:26,880 --> 01:04:30,480
detected gravity waves who were who was

1851
01:04:29,280 --> 01:04:32,000
they

1852
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:33,440
you might know more there's two black

1853
01:04:32,000 --> 01:04:35,440
holes that were colliding and that's how

1854
01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:37,280
they were able to detect yeah somebody

1855
01:04:35,440 --> 01:04:39,119
bill i don't know which group it was or

1856
01:04:37,280 --> 01:04:42,720
what part of the government that's what

1857
01:04:39,119 --> 01:04:44,559
google's for yeah would it but they um

1858
01:04:42,719 --> 01:04:47,118
you know built a gigantic gravity wave

1859
01:04:44,559 --> 01:04:50,480
detector and pretty much

1860
01:04:47,119 --> 01:04:53,599
detected that there are such things as

1861
01:04:50,480 --> 01:04:56,480
first observation of gravitational waves

1862
01:04:53,599 --> 01:04:57,920
it says it was in 2016.

1863
01:04:56,480 --> 01:05:00,079
okay the first observation of

1864
01:04:57,920 --> 01:05:02,798
gravitational waves was made on 14th of

1865
01:05:00,079 --> 01:05:06,318
september 2015 right as announced by the

1866
01:05:02,798 --> 01:05:08,798
ligo and virgo collaborators on the 11th

1867
01:05:06,318 --> 01:05:10,318
of february 2016 previously

1868
01:05:08,798 --> 01:05:13,038
gravitational waves had only been

1869
01:05:10,318 --> 01:05:16,000
inferred indirectly via their effect on

1870
01:05:13,039 --> 01:05:18,400
the timing of pulsars in binary star

1871
01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:18,400
systems

1872
01:05:18,639 --> 01:05:24,558
the waveform connected by both

1873
01:05:21,358 --> 01:05:27,279
ligo ligo observatories match the

1874
01:05:24,559 --> 01:05:31,440
predictions of general relativity for

1875
01:05:27,280 --> 01:05:31,440
gravity for a gravitational wave

1876
01:05:32,079 --> 01:05:37,280
emanating from the inward sp i'm trying

1877
01:05:34,880 --> 01:05:39,920
to get this from the inward spiral and

1878
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:42,400
merger of a pair of black holes around

1879
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:43,519
36 and 29 solar masses and the

1880
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:44,798
subsequent

1881
01:05:43,519 --> 01:05:47,599
ring down

1882
01:05:44,798 --> 01:05:49,038
of the single resulting black hole

1883
01:05:47,599 --> 01:05:51,200
well that i mean

1884
01:05:49,039 --> 01:05:53,200
yeah it's not he was in the 80s the

1885
01:05:51,199 --> 01:05:55,838
predominant theory was gravity is

1886
01:05:53,199 --> 01:05:58,719
produced by gravitons okay you know part

1887
01:05:55,838 --> 01:06:00,960
of theoretic theoretical particles but

1888
01:05:58,719 --> 01:06:03,199
um they're not they're waves they're not

1889
01:06:00,960 --> 01:06:05,679
particles and that's so the thought is

1890
01:06:03,199 --> 01:06:08,639
that the way we experience gravity it's

1891
01:06:05,679 --> 01:06:09,679
based on mass which is why the moon

1892
01:06:08,639 --> 01:06:11,440
which is

1893
01:06:09,679 --> 01:06:13,118
roughly one quarter the size of the

1894
01:06:11,440 --> 01:06:14,318
earth has one sixth of the earth's

1895
01:06:13,119 --> 01:06:16,079
gravity so there's some sort of a

1896
01:06:14,318 --> 01:06:18,639
computation you can make based on mass

1897
01:06:16,079 --> 01:06:20,160
right and and remember

1898
01:06:18,639 --> 01:06:22,639
we can observe

1899
01:06:20,159 --> 01:06:25,759
the effects of gravity but we have no

1900
01:06:22,639 --> 01:06:27,679
idea what it is all we can do is observe

1901
01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:29,920
it and we can't make it the only way you

1902
01:06:27,679 --> 01:06:31,838
can make gravity is just put more mass

1903
01:06:29,920 --> 01:06:34,079
together and it's just a product of

1904
01:06:31,838 --> 01:06:37,038
gravity but if you can make a if you

1905
01:06:34,079 --> 01:06:39,119
have a machine that makes gravity

1906
01:06:37,039 --> 01:06:42,000
you can pretty much do anything you can

1907
01:06:39,119 --> 01:06:44,079
affect time you can have force fields

1908
01:06:42,000 --> 01:06:47,119
all that stuff that's in science fiction

1909
01:06:44,079 --> 01:06:49,440
becomes reality if you have a machine

1910
01:06:47,119 --> 01:06:51,920
that can make gravity and what we worked

1911
01:06:49,440 --> 01:06:54,400
on in the desert was a machine that

1912
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:57,200
makes gravity i love your analogy of

1913
01:06:54,400 --> 01:06:59,599
dropping off a small nuclear reactor to

1914
01:06:57,199 --> 01:07:02,480
the victorian era i love that that

1915
01:06:59,599 --> 01:07:04,960
analogy because back then that was

1916
01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:07,119
impossible that was magic

1917
01:07:04,960 --> 01:07:09,280
what you're talking about here the fact

1918
01:07:07,119 --> 01:07:12,640
that they just discovered this four

1919
01:07:09,280 --> 01:07:14,480
years ago that this is a wave when we're

1920
01:07:12,639 --> 01:07:17,038
as much as we know and as impressed as

1921
01:07:14,480 --> 01:07:17,920
we are as we should be with how much

1922
01:07:17,039 --> 01:07:19,599
more

1923
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:21,200
technologically advanced we are than

1924
01:07:19,599 --> 01:07:22,960
every other creature on this planet

1925
01:07:21,199 --> 01:07:25,279
we're still in many ways in the

1926
01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:26,480
adolescence of technological innovation

1927
01:07:25,280 --> 01:07:30,000
absolutely

1928
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:32,880
absolutely if even adolescence and when

1929
01:07:30,000 --> 01:07:36,318
you're talking about this binary star

1930
01:07:32,880 --> 01:07:37,838
system zeta reticuli and who knows how

1931
01:07:36,318 --> 01:07:40,079
much longer these things have been

1932
01:07:37,838 --> 01:07:43,199
around than us who knows what their

1933
01:07:40,079 --> 01:07:44,240
evolutionary cycle's been who knows what

1934
01:07:43,199 --> 01:07:45,358
i mean we might be talking about

1935
01:07:44,239 --> 01:07:46,719
something that's a million years more

1936
01:07:45,358 --> 01:07:49,679
advanced than us

1937
01:07:46,719 --> 01:07:50,719
yeah yeah it could easily be now i'm not

1938
01:07:49,679 --> 01:07:52,719
in

1939
01:07:50,719 --> 01:07:55,358
believe it or not i'm not into ufos i

1940
01:07:52,719 --> 01:07:57,919
don't follow stories or you know even

1941
01:07:55,358 --> 01:08:00,558
after your experiences no i'm fascinated

1942
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:02,639
with the technology and i i it really it

1943
01:08:00,559 --> 01:08:05,920
irks me like every night i go to sleep

1944
01:08:02,639 --> 01:08:08,558
that you know i don't

1945
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:09,358
that it was my own doing essentially

1946
01:08:08,559 --> 01:08:11,280
that

1947
01:08:09,358 --> 01:08:13,920
that prevented me from continuing on in

1948
01:08:11,280 --> 01:08:15,440
the in the project i mean it's the

1949
01:08:13,920 --> 01:08:18,640
that to be on that cutting edge of

1950
01:08:15,440 --> 01:08:20,399
technology is so alluring to me right

1951
01:08:18,640 --> 01:08:22,480
but

1952
01:08:20,399 --> 01:08:24,479
you know by the same token i don't

1953
01:08:22,479 --> 01:08:26,559
really care that there's aliens or where

1954
01:08:24,479 --> 01:08:27,838
they come from i mean the prize is the

1955
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:29,839
technology and that's what i'm

1956
01:08:27,838 --> 01:08:31,600
fascinated by but so i don't listen to

1957
01:08:29,838 --> 01:08:33,600
ufo stories and that sort of thing but

1958
01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:36,400
george knapp is um

1959
01:08:33,600 --> 01:08:38,560
i mean he's the guy that has the context

1960
01:08:36,399 --> 01:08:39,519
and tries to thread everything together

1961
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:42,319
and

1962
01:08:39,520 --> 01:08:44,239
what he recently told me is he found

1963
01:08:42,319 --> 01:08:46,480
i don't know is either documentation or

1964
01:08:44,238 --> 01:08:48,238
people that he spoke to it's at this the

1965
01:08:46,479 --> 01:08:52,479
existence of this project the project

1966
01:08:48,238 --> 01:08:54,399
that i was on it's something that they

1967
01:08:52,479 --> 01:08:57,119
seem to take out every eight or ten

1968
01:08:54,399 --> 01:08:59,039
years so that's a very specific memo and

1969
01:08:57,119 --> 01:09:00,479
this is actually i this is the first

1970
01:08:59,039 --> 01:09:01,759
time i'll be very clear with people

1971
01:09:00,479 --> 01:09:03,759
about it it's a big topic of

1972
01:09:01,759 --> 01:09:05,198
conversation right now it's called the

1973
01:09:03,759 --> 01:09:06,479
wilson memo

1974
01:09:05,198 --> 01:09:09,119
you can look it up

1975
01:09:06,479 --> 01:09:10,718
admiral wilson met with a scientist

1976
01:09:09,119 --> 01:09:11,759
who's actually was featured in one of my

1977
01:09:10,719 --> 01:09:13,600
films

1978
01:09:11,759 --> 01:09:15,600
everybody has been debating whether or

1979
01:09:13,600 --> 01:09:17,520
not this document

1980
01:09:15,600 --> 01:09:19,199
of a conversation

1981
01:09:17,520 --> 01:09:20,799
with a with a sitting admiral at the

1982
01:09:19,198 --> 01:09:22,639
time is a real

1983
01:09:20,798 --> 01:09:24,000
document it's an actual conversation

1984
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:25,119
that happened and this document is real

1985
01:09:24,000 --> 01:09:27,359
everybody wants to know the world is

1986
01:09:25,119 --> 01:09:29,439
going crazy right now in the ufo world

1987
01:09:27,359 --> 01:09:31,920
i'll tell you straight up right now

1988
01:09:29,439 --> 01:09:33,759
i'm in the position to know and it is a

1989
01:09:31,920 --> 01:09:36,158
real document

1990
01:09:33,759 --> 01:09:37,600
that it is real so the conversation you

1991
01:09:36,158 --> 01:09:39,679
read in that

1992
01:09:37,600 --> 01:09:40,480
that conversation was had i can't attest

1993
01:09:39,679 --> 01:09:42,719
to everything

1994
01:09:40,479 --> 01:09:43,759
you're not being very clear sure please

1995
01:09:42,719 --> 01:09:45,520
no problem

1996
01:09:43,759 --> 01:09:47,600
so there was a document that is

1997
01:09:45,520 --> 01:09:49,040
circulating right now that is really big

1998
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:51,120
it's going around everywhere people are

1999
01:09:49,039 --> 01:09:52,960
asking what is this talking about it's

2000
01:09:51,119 --> 01:09:54,640
called the wilson memo is what how you

2001
01:09:52,960 --> 01:09:56,800
can find it online

2002
01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:59,280
the or the wilson leak there it is

2003
01:09:56,800 --> 01:10:02,400
jimmy's got it the wilson memorandum use

2004
01:09:59,279 --> 01:10:04,880
of human volunteers no no no no no

2005
01:10:02,399 --> 01:10:07,519
yeah so uh

2006
01:10:04,880 --> 01:10:09,119
admiral wilson meets with this scientist

2007
01:10:07,520 --> 01:10:11,760
and they have this discussion oddly

2008
01:10:09,119 --> 01:10:14,000
enough at special projects at egng and

2009
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:15,440
if i remember the document is from 2001

2010
01:10:14,000 --> 01:10:17,840
i'm telling everybody right now it's

2011
01:10:15,439 --> 01:10:19,198
real and we'll see my history is pretty

2012
01:10:17,840 --> 01:10:21,119
good with like saying if something's

2013
01:10:19,198 --> 01:10:23,198
real or not right so here we go the

2014
01:10:21,119 --> 01:10:27,119
document comes out they meet at eg

2015
01:10:23,198 --> 01:10:28,639
special projects in 1989 they stumble

2016
01:10:27,119 --> 01:10:31,119
into a problem

2017
01:10:28,640 --> 01:10:33,440
this happens they put the technology

2018
01:10:31,119 --> 01:10:35,760
away and then they bring it back out and

2019
01:10:33,439 --> 01:10:37,839
see if material science has caught up

2020
01:10:35,760 --> 01:10:39,520
and if they can make any progress so

2021
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:41,679
this document kind of talks about this

2022
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:43,920
process the big thing i get from it and

2023
01:10:41,679 --> 01:10:45,359
a lot of it's vindicating to bob and one

2024
01:10:43,920 --> 01:10:46,800
of the things that's vindicating besides

2025
01:10:45,359 --> 01:10:49,679
the eg g thing

2026
01:10:46,800 --> 01:10:52,719
is that private industry so this guy's

2027
01:10:49,679 --> 01:10:55,359
an admiral and he says i found out about

2028
01:10:52,719 --> 01:10:57,920
your sap your special access program i

2029
01:10:55,359 --> 01:11:00,479
need to know about it and he's going to

2030
01:10:57,920 --> 01:11:02,719
a private part of industry

2031
01:11:00,479 --> 01:11:04,399
and he is denied access

2032
01:11:02,719 --> 01:11:06,800
and he says i you know i should be

2033
01:11:04,399 --> 01:11:08,960
running this program and they were able

2034
01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:11,360
to deny him access

2035
01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:12,880
so i think the takeaway here is check it

2036
01:11:11,359 --> 01:11:15,279
out i'm telling you that that is an

2037
01:11:12,880 --> 01:11:16,960
actual correct that is a leak now

2038
01:11:15,279 --> 01:11:18,238
everything said in that document i'm i

2039
01:11:16,960 --> 01:11:19,359
don't know what are you talking about

2040
01:11:18,238 --> 01:11:21,119
what what is said in that document

2041
01:11:19,359 --> 01:11:23,119
specifically it's it's a between a

2042
01:11:21,119 --> 01:11:25,359
scientist and an admiral that are

2043
01:11:23,119 --> 01:11:26,960
sitting and they're having a meeting and

2044
01:11:25,359 --> 01:11:29,439
they're talking about

2045
01:11:26,960 --> 01:11:31,920
the the search for the the ufo subject

2046
01:11:29,439 --> 01:11:34,399
the search to get special access program

2047
01:11:31,920 --> 01:11:37,199
access to all of these different things

2048
01:11:34,399 --> 01:11:40,000
like reverse engineering programs

2049
01:11:37,198 --> 01:11:42,000
so in this document they talk about it

2050
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:43,600
uh i believe that

2051
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:45,359
this document that the person that went

2052
01:11:43,600 --> 01:11:46,480
was employed by robert bigelow you know

2053
01:11:45,359 --> 01:11:48,238
one of the guys that has a couple of

2054
01:11:46,479 --> 01:11:50,718
orbiting satellites and all that stuff

2055
01:11:48,238 --> 01:11:54,319
who's the guy owned skinwalker ranch no

2056
01:11:50,719 --> 01:11:55,760
he's not he was the guy the walker okay

2057
01:11:54,319 --> 01:11:58,158
yeah he used to own it there's a new

2058
01:11:55,760 --> 01:11:59,039
owner and i i interview him for my other

2059
01:11:58,158 --> 01:12:00,479
film

2060
01:11:59,039 --> 01:12:02,800
but there's a new owner and you'll be

2061
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:04,718
hearing a lot more about that soon

2062
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:05,920
but uh like it'll just there's there's

2063
01:12:04,719 --> 01:12:07,119
stuff that you'll be hearing about

2064
01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:10,000
skinwalker ranching because there's a

2065
01:12:07,119 --> 01:12:12,479
new owner anyway the whole point of this

2066
01:12:10,000 --> 01:12:15,760
you know insertion here is just that

2067
01:12:12,479 --> 01:12:18,079
that document kind of validates a lot of

2068
01:12:15,760 --> 01:12:20,000
this idea bob just said that they make a

2069
01:12:18,079 --> 01:12:22,158
little progress then they can't go

2070
01:12:20,000 --> 01:12:24,000
anywhere they tuck it away and then they

2071
01:12:22,158 --> 01:12:26,000
bring it back out you know 10 years

2072
01:12:24,000 --> 01:12:27,679
later and start working on it

2073
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:29,198
what is the limiting factor i think bob

2074
01:12:27,679 --> 01:12:30,880
should speak on this but it's the

2075
01:12:29,198 --> 01:12:33,198
material science

2076
01:12:30,880 --> 01:12:35,440
yeah it's really where physics is so i i

2077
01:12:33,198 --> 01:12:36,879
can i can see them doing that i mean i

2078
01:12:35,439 --> 01:12:37,678
didn't have any

2079
01:12:36,880 --> 01:12:40,159
uh

2080
01:12:37,679 --> 01:12:41,840
information on that but i think what you

2081
01:12:40,158 --> 01:12:44,079
know george uncovered is probably

2082
01:12:41,840 --> 01:12:46,000
accurate that uh you know we try and do

2083
01:12:44,079 --> 01:12:48,399
what we can and once we reach a

2084
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:51,600
roadblock on we really can't figure it

2085
01:12:48,399 --> 01:12:54,158
out it's just friggin wait put the thing

2086
01:12:51,600 --> 01:12:55,920
away wait for science to catch up and

2087
01:12:54,158 --> 01:12:57,839
you know a decade later let's take the

2088
01:12:55,920 --> 01:12:59,679
project out again and see all right now

2089
01:12:57,840 --> 01:13:02,239
where can we go but there's got to be

2090
01:12:59,679 --> 01:13:04,480
someone who remains informed right oh

2091
01:13:02,238 --> 01:13:06,479
yeah you've got your scientists like you

2092
01:13:04,479 --> 01:13:07,839
and barry you got your people that you

2093
01:13:06,479 --> 01:13:09,279
compartmentalize you got these people

2094
01:13:07,840 --> 01:13:11,440
working on yeah there has to be some

2095
01:13:09,279 --> 01:13:14,000
people right that know everything you've

2096
01:13:11,439 --> 01:13:16,238
got security and then someone's going to

2097
01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:17,920
be on the outside saying hey we need

2098
01:13:16,238 --> 01:13:19,839
people to guard this building don't let

2099
01:13:17,920 --> 01:13:22,000
anybody in for ten years i think i think

2100
01:13:19,840 --> 01:13:23,440
a lot of that is private industry and i

2101
01:13:22,000 --> 01:13:24,960
think that's how they keep it yeah i

2102
01:13:23,439 --> 01:13:27,759
think that's how they literally because

2103
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:29,279
the government is just so leaky i think

2104
01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:30,880
that's kind of what they're doing that's

2105
01:13:29,279 --> 01:13:33,279
what the document kind of proves you

2106
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:35,039
just articulated that that um it is in

2107
01:13:33,279 --> 01:13:36,158
control private industry what private

2108
01:13:35,039 --> 01:13:38,079
industry

2109
01:13:36,158 --> 01:13:39,198
some aerospace company something i don't

2110
01:13:38,079 --> 01:13:40,880
know yeah they wouldn't they would the

2111
01:13:39,198 --> 01:13:43,039
guy with the admiral wouldn't name it in

2112
01:13:40,880 --> 01:13:43,920
the car right in the conversation right

2113
01:13:43,039 --> 01:13:44,880
so

2114
01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:48,800
they

2115
01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:50,560
still have these things supposedly

2116
01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:53,840
i would guess i mean i don't have any

2117
01:13:50,560 --> 01:13:57,360
information have you ever asked anyone

2118
01:13:53,840 --> 01:14:00,000
that has any inkling of any idea of

2119
01:13:57,359 --> 01:14:01,839
where they got them or how they got them

2120
01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:05,198
no but um

2121
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:06,800
something must have been said to me um

2122
01:14:05,198 --> 01:14:09,119
from barry

2123
01:14:06,800 --> 01:14:10,880
and but i i it was just too long ago and

2124
01:14:09,119 --> 01:14:11,920
i i can't quite remember what was said

2125
01:14:10,880 --> 01:14:14,000
but it

2126
01:14:11,920 --> 01:14:15,600
it just left a seat in my mind i think

2127
01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:18,158
at least one of them was part of an

2128
01:14:15,600 --> 01:14:19,280
archaeological dig

2129
01:14:18,158 --> 01:14:20,719
so

2130
01:14:19,279 --> 01:14:22,559
it's old

2131
01:14:20,719 --> 01:14:23,920
something one at least one of them is

2132
01:14:22,560 --> 01:14:25,760
old i don't know if it was the one i

2133
01:14:23,920 --> 01:14:27,440
worked on but i remember

2134
01:14:25,760 --> 01:14:30,320
something to do with an archaeological

2135
01:14:27,439 --> 01:14:31,678
dig whoa so that's uh

2136
01:14:30,319 --> 01:14:33,198
that means it's not just old it's

2137
01:14:31,679 --> 01:14:35,039
ancient that'd be a great stephen

2138
01:14:33,198 --> 01:14:37,039
spielberg movie yeah right

2139
01:14:35,039 --> 01:14:38,960
[Laughter]

2140
01:14:37,039 --> 01:14:40,479
as all of it would yeah that took me out

2141
01:14:38,960 --> 01:14:42,640
when he said that for the first time

2142
01:14:40,479 --> 01:14:44,559
yeah that's a freak out right there just

2143
01:14:42,640 --> 01:14:46,800
a couple of dudes with some brushes

2144
01:14:44,560 --> 01:14:49,039
looking for a tyrannosaurus rex bone and

2145
01:14:46,800 --> 01:14:51,520
metal and when did they find it you know

2146
01:14:49,039 --> 01:14:53,439
that they have nine of them well and how

2147
01:14:51,520 --> 01:14:55,280
could we have not heard about that what

2148
01:14:53,439 --> 01:14:57,439
about the guys with the brushes how

2149
01:14:55,279 --> 01:14:59,840
could you uncover something like that

2150
01:14:57,439 --> 01:15:01,678
and joe's newspaper at home does i mean

2151
01:14:59,840 --> 01:15:03,199
they said it on that first day oh you

2152
01:15:01,679 --> 01:15:05,520
mean the roswell yeah yeah yeah you told

2153
01:15:03,198 --> 01:15:07,439
me yeah yeah i have a cover what is this

2154
01:15:05,520 --> 01:15:09,280
here james it's the document but i had

2155
01:15:07,439 --> 01:15:10,639
to do some digging to find it yes it's

2156
01:15:09,279 --> 01:15:12,479
just kind of

2157
01:15:10,640 --> 01:15:14,000
yeah so this is where they meet at egng

2158
01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:15,119
and this is admiral wilson and there's a

2159
01:15:14,000 --> 01:15:17,359
lot more coming out now i want to be

2160
01:15:15,119 --> 01:15:18,399
clear george didn't put this out he

2161
01:15:17,359 --> 01:15:20,479
didn't

2162
01:15:18,399 --> 01:15:22,158
leak this out to anybody this is i can

2163
01:15:20,479 --> 01:15:24,399
tell you how i recorded this this

2164
01:15:22,158 --> 01:15:26,479
conversation so this was an employee

2165
01:15:24,399 --> 01:15:28,479
of at the time robert bigelow and this

2166
01:15:26,479 --> 01:15:30,000
is in 2002 right do you remember when he

2167
01:15:28,479 --> 01:15:32,000
had that government contract called

2168
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:33,760
awesap the world all knows about now and

2169
01:15:32,000 --> 01:15:35,600
he had nids that studied the ranch so

2170
01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:38,480
that 22 million everybody is saying it

2171
01:15:35,600 --> 01:15:40,480
was for atip um advanced aerospace

2172
01:15:38,479 --> 01:15:43,519
threat identification program

2173
01:15:40,479 --> 01:15:45,279
the 22 million dollars was for ossap

2174
01:15:43,520 --> 01:15:48,159
that was pushed through through congress

2175
01:15:45,279 --> 01:15:49,519
three congressmen right an astronaut it

2176
01:15:48,158 --> 01:15:51,599
was pushed through

2177
01:15:49,520 --> 01:15:52,880
and that's what that 22 million dollars

2178
01:15:51,600 --> 01:15:54,400
by the way they spend more money on

2179
01:15:52,880 --> 01:15:56,239
viagra every year than they do studying

2180
01:15:54,399 --> 01:15:57,759
ufos if it was just this program which i

2181
01:15:56,238 --> 01:15:59,039
think is funny but they probably make a

2182
01:15:57,760 --> 01:16:01,119
lot more money from fragrance they

2183
01:15:59,039 --> 01:16:03,439
probably do ufos well you never know how

2184
01:16:01,119 --> 01:16:04,479
it seeds into population but anyway this

2185
01:16:03,439 --> 01:16:06,960
program

2186
01:16:04,479 --> 01:16:09,439
uh this is what was the mother program

2187
01:16:06,960 --> 01:16:11,520
so it it got the 22 million and really

2188
01:16:09,439 --> 01:16:14,479
it was to study skinwalker ranch oddly

2189
01:16:11,520 --> 01:16:15,679
enough that 22 million all was inspired

2190
01:16:14,479 --> 01:16:18,319
by the phenomenon they were seeing at

2191
01:16:15,679 --> 01:16:20,560
skinwalker ranch because the scientists

2192
01:16:18,319 --> 01:16:23,439
they're seeing vehicles come through

2193
01:16:20,560 --> 01:16:25,520
like a space in the sky yeah we went

2194
01:16:23,439 --> 01:16:27,119
there i went through it yeah we

2195
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:28,320
interviewed

2196
01:16:27,119 --> 01:16:30,000
a bunch of people that seemed full of

2197
01:16:28,319 --> 01:16:32,079
[ __ ] but a couple that didn't but it's

2198
01:16:30,000 --> 01:16:33,920
very very interesting totally any

2199
01:16:32,079 --> 01:16:35,519
there's but if you look i spent a lot of

2200
01:16:33,920 --> 01:16:36,560
time in the area i'm not talking about

2201
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:39,120
those stories i'm saying there were

2202
01:16:36,560 --> 01:16:40,880
scientists hired by the government right

2203
01:16:39,119 --> 01:16:42,319
through bigelow to study the ranch

2204
01:16:40,880 --> 01:16:44,640
because they thought it was important

2205
01:16:42,319 --> 01:16:46,719
and you know whatever whatever the point

2206
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:48,480
is that 22 million was to study that

2207
01:16:46,719 --> 01:16:50,719
then we have atip which is like an

2208
01:16:48,479 --> 01:16:52,158
auxiliary kind of program of military

2209
01:16:50,719 --> 01:16:55,198
settings like commander framers and that

2210
01:16:52,158 --> 01:16:57,119
sort of thing this document is just one

2211
01:16:55,198 --> 01:16:59,519
of those things that has now come

2212
01:16:57,119 --> 01:17:01,519
forward that through the bigelow studies

2213
01:16:59,520 --> 01:17:03,120
it was government funded and then it was

2214
01:17:01,520 --> 01:17:04,400
personally funded and then government

2215
01:17:03,119 --> 01:17:06,079
funded

2216
01:17:04,399 --> 01:17:08,079
it's just one of those things that kind

2217
01:17:06,079 --> 01:17:11,198
of shakes you because you got this

2218
01:17:08,079 --> 01:17:12,960
military guy who can't get access

2219
01:17:11,198 --> 01:17:14,319
because of the private industry that's

2220
01:17:12,960 --> 01:17:16,158
holding these

2221
01:17:14,319 --> 01:17:18,960
non-terrestrial materials that they

2222
01:17:16,158 --> 01:17:21,198
can't study it so that's the the claim

2223
01:17:18,960 --> 01:17:22,880
right now give it some time let people

2224
01:17:21,198 --> 01:17:24,719
dig more into this

2225
01:17:22,880 --> 01:17:25,760
it's fascinating man

2226
01:17:24,719 --> 01:17:28,000
so

2227
01:17:25,760 --> 01:17:29,360
you are

2228
01:17:28,000 --> 01:17:30,640
essentially

2229
01:17:29,359 --> 01:17:32,559
you're you're

2230
01:17:30,640 --> 01:17:34,640
you're kicked out right you're you're

2231
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:37,199
out of the this program you can't work

2232
01:17:34,640 --> 01:17:40,320
with these crafts anymore and

2233
01:17:37,198 --> 01:17:42,639
do they give you any threats do they

2234
01:17:40,319 --> 01:17:43,679
tell you what you have to do from here

2235
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:47,280
on out

2236
01:17:43,679 --> 01:17:49,440
yeah well i mean the way it ended was

2237
01:17:47,279 --> 01:17:52,079
um i told george knapp

2238
01:17:49,439 --> 01:17:53,919
all this stuff and um you know he said

2239
01:17:52,079 --> 01:17:55,359
well let's just get it on tape should

2240
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:58,800
something happen at least we have a

2241
01:17:55,359 --> 01:18:01,439
record of it and um i don't remember

2242
01:17:58,800 --> 01:18:03,840
what the emphasis was but um at some

2243
01:18:01,439 --> 01:18:04,719
point george wanted to air it and he

2244
01:18:03,840 --> 01:18:07,039
said

2245
01:18:04,719 --> 01:18:09,439
you know you make the call on it

2246
01:18:07,039 --> 01:18:10,399
and look if at any point you change your

2247
01:18:09,439 --> 01:18:13,279
mind

2248
01:18:10,399 --> 01:18:15,039
we won't air it and it came down to the

2249
01:18:13,279 --> 01:18:16,639
day where george wants to put her on the

2250
01:18:15,039 --> 01:18:18,079
five o'clock news he said hey this is

2251
01:18:16,640 --> 01:18:21,039
important stuff people have to know

2252
01:18:18,079 --> 01:18:22,800
about it and i thought it was too either

2253
01:18:21,039 --> 01:18:24,880
it's kind of a crime i know you've got

2254
01:18:22,800 --> 01:18:27,440
to keep the technology secret but you

2255
01:18:24,880 --> 01:18:30,159
can't not tell everybody that this stuff

2256
01:18:27,439 --> 01:18:32,158
is going on that we have you know actual

2257
01:18:30,158 --> 01:18:34,960
hardware from another civilization it's

2258
01:18:32,158 --> 01:18:36,879
a big [ __ ] deal you know probably the

2259
01:18:34,960 --> 01:18:38,960
biggest one there ever was

2260
01:18:36,880 --> 01:18:40,480
and um

2261
01:18:38,960 --> 01:18:42,158
george

2262
01:18:40,479 --> 01:18:44,000
said you know today's the day we got to

2263
01:18:42,158 --> 01:18:45,839
put it on the news or something to that

2264
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:47,600
effect and when it came

2265
01:18:45,840 --> 01:18:50,000
right down to the time to air it i

2266
01:18:47,600 --> 01:18:51,600
changed my mind and i said

2267
01:18:50,000 --> 01:18:53,920
we're not doing it

2268
01:18:51,600 --> 01:18:56,079
and that's what turned into the famous

2269
01:18:53,920 --> 01:18:57,920
wrestling match between me and george

2270
01:18:56,079 --> 01:19:00,000
trying to get the tape but he won

2271
01:18:57,920 --> 01:19:01,679
because he was a bigger guy so he

2272
01:19:00,000 --> 01:19:03,359
actually physically wrestled well i

2273
01:19:01,679 --> 01:19:04,560
think it was more of a pulling match we

2274
01:19:03,359 --> 01:19:06,238
were i don't think we ever hit the

2275
01:19:04,560 --> 01:19:08,080
ground but

2276
01:19:06,238 --> 01:19:10,079
he got the tape he put it in the player

2277
01:19:08,079 --> 01:19:11,198
and boom five o'clock news was on and

2278
01:19:10,079 --> 01:19:13,760
then um

2279
01:19:11,198 --> 01:19:15,678
i got a call after that and they said it

2280
01:19:13,760 --> 01:19:17,840
was from dennis he said you have any

2281
01:19:15,679 --> 01:19:19,520
idea what we're gonna do to you now and

2282
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:22,400
he hung up the phone that was the last

2283
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:24,960
communication i had with him

2284
01:19:22,399 --> 01:19:27,599
and what has happened to you since then

2285
01:19:24,960 --> 01:19:27,600
after that

2286
01:19:29,359 --> 01:19:34,000
a lot of people i've known

2287
01:19:32,399 --> 01:19:37,119
either were

2288
01:19:34,000 --> 01:19:39,279
audited by the irs people had anybody i

2289
01:19:37,119 --> 01:19:41,519
know that had clearances that worked in

2290
01:19:39,279 --> 01:19:44,399
secure programs had the clearances

2291
01:19:41,520 --> 01:19:45,520
pulled one of them uh

2292
01:19:44,399 --> 01:19:47,519
friendly

2293
01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:49,120
one of mine that jeremy knows he's going

2294
01:19:47,520 --> 01:19:51,280
on camera with me soon he'll tell the

2295
01:19:49,119 --> 01:19:53,439
story now that he's out of work up there

2296
01:19:51,279 --> 01:19:55,119
he was working up at the tonopah test

2297
01:19:53,439 --> 01:19:57,039
range waiting for his clearance to come

2298
01:19:55,119 --> 01:19:59,599
through and you know they they pulled

2299
01:19:57,039 --> 01:20:01,119
that it would it became it's like if

2300
01:19:59,600 --> 01:20:04,320
they can't get the person that's

2301
01:20:01,119 --> 01:20:07,119
involved they just create a problem for

2302
01:20:04,319 --> 01:20:09,119
everybody that surrounds them and so i

2303
01:20:07,119 --> 01:20:11,760
mean the way it turns out it hurt a lot

2304
01:20:09,119 --> 01:20:12,559
of people's lives that i was connected

2305
01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:15,280
to

2306
01:20:12,560 --> 01:20:17,679
and that's an effective way of shutting

2307
01:20:15,279 --> 01:20:19,198
someone up did you feel that by coming

2308
01:20:17,679 --> 01:20:21,039
forward and going public they couldn't

2309
01:20:19,198 --> 01:20:22,799
just snuff you out that was i mean

2310
01:20:21,039 --> 01:20:24,719
that's what i was told and george and

2311
01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:26,400
everybody you know said that you got oh

2312
01:20:24,719 --> 01:20:28,319
it's you know it's public there's you

2313
01:20:26,399 --> 01:20:32,879
know no one will touch you and i i you

2314
01:20:28,319 --> 01:20:36,238
know i i fell for it um

2315
01:20:32,880 --> 01:20:37,920
and i i wish you didn't yeah sometimes

2316
01:20:36,238 --> 01:20:40,079
sometimes when it's just over stress and

2317
01:20:37,920 --> 01:20:42,319
people are camping on your lawn yeah but

2318
01:20:40,079 --> 01:20:44,840
it's this is gonna make things worse

2319
01:20:42,319 --> 01:20:47,198
doing this no this is gonna make things

2320
01:20:44,840 --> 01:20:48,960
better i was trying to tell them how is

2321
01:20:47,198 --> 01:20:50,719
this gonna make things better because

2322
01:20:48,960 --> 01:20:53,039
you're getting a real chance to explain

2323
01:20:50,719 --> 01:20:56,079
yourself in a way that's going to

2324
01:20:53,039 --> 01:20:58,399
make people who are not only work in the

2325
01:20:56,079 --> 01:21:00,719
government people that are

2326
01:20:58,399 --> 01:21:02,719
police officers and firefighters and

2327
01:21:00,719 --> 01:21:04,880
first responders and doctors and

2328
01:21:02,719 --> 01:21:06,239
scientists they're going to empathize

2329
01:21:04,880 --> 01:21:10,719
emphasize

2330
01:21:06,238 --> 01:21:10,718
empathize and and empathize with

2331
01:21:10,800 --> 01:21:15,920
what it must be like to be a person like

2332
01:21:12,960 --> 01:21:18,079
you in your 20s who gets thrust into

2333
01:21:15,920 --> 01:21:20,560
this world unknowingly

2334
01:21:18,079 --> 01:21:22,960
and confronted with

2335
01:21:20,560 --> 01:21:25,679
one of the most if not the most

2336
01:21:22,960 --> 01:21:28,399
important discovery in the history of

2337
01:21:25,679 --> 01:21:30,480
human beings the big question

2338
01:21:28,399 --> 01:21:32,479
are we alone it's the number one

2339
01:21:30,479 --> 01:21:34,158
question there's two questions right

2340
01:21:32,479 --> 01:21:36,319
what happens when we die and are we

2341
01:21:34,158 --> 01:21:37,119
alone those are the two big questions

2342
01:21:36,319 --> 01:21:40,799
right

2343
01:21:37,119 --> 01:21:43,599
and if we're not alone and someone knows

2344
01:21:40,800 --> 01:21:45,840
we're not alone and these some people

2345
01:21:43,600 --> 01:21:47,360
who know we're not alone are these

2346
01:21:45,840 --> 01:21:49,760
bungling

2347
01:21:47,359 --> 01:21:52,158
sort of even if they weren't it's a

2348
01:21:49,760 --> 01:21:54,480
crime that they're not telling the rest

2349
01:21:52,158 --> 01:21:56,000
of us but i mean i don't mean bungling

2350
01:21:54,479 --> 01:21:58,479
in terms they're incompetent i mean they

2351
01:21:56,000 --> 01:22:00,000
can't be competent it seems to me to

2352
01:21:58,479 --> 01:22:02,079
what you're describing that no one can

2353
01:22:00,000 --> 01:22:05,920
be competent with this technology

2354
01:22:02,079 --> 01:22:08,319
like the victoria victorian era scholars

2355
01:22:05,920 --> 01:22:10,239
analyzing some sort of a nuclear reactor

2356
01:22:08,319 --> 01:22:11,439
there's there's no way why do you think

2357
01:22:10,238 --> 01:22:12,879
beyond that why do you think they're not

2358
01:22:11,439 --> 01:22:14,799
telling us let's just make an assumption

2359
01:22:12,880 --> 01:22:17,039
that this is true right now

2360
01:22:14,800 --> 01:22:18,400
why do you think that they're not

2361
01:22:17,039 --> 01:22:20,158
telling us that our government doesn't

2362
01:22:18,399 --> 01:22:21,119
tell us what's your best well let me put

2363
01:22:20,158 --> 01:22:24,479
it into

2364
01:22:21,119 --> 01:22:26,399
what would you do if i'm the president

2365
01:22:24,479 --> 01:22:27,839
okay and i get this information what do

2366
01:22:26,399 --> 01:22:29,519
i do with this what do i do with this

2367
01:22:27,840 --> 01:22:31,119
there's something that we don't know

2368
01:22:29,520 --> 01:22:32,400
there's something we don't understand

2369
01:22:31,119 --> 01:22:34,000
there's something that came from another

2370
01:22:32,399 --> 01:22:35,920
world we got it tucked away in the

2371
01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:37,679
mountains and uh just wanted you guys to

2372
01:22:35,920 --> 01:22:39,279
know about it hey sleep tight hey

2373
01:22:37,679 --> 01:22:40,880
american motto's on tonight who do you

2374
01:22:39,279 --> 01:22:43,359
think's going to win yeah who's going to

2375
01:22:40,880 --> 01:22:43,359
win america

2376
01:22:44,800 --> 01:22:47,920
one is uncertainty and the other one is

2377
01:22:46,319 --> 01:22:50,079
what bob and i have talked about a lot

2378
01:22:47,920 --> 01:22:51,119
absolutely not knowing what to tell

2379
01:22:50,079 --> 01:22:52,479
people because you don't really

2380
01:22:51,119 --> 01:22:54,079
understand it yourself even though

2381
01:22:52,479 --> 01:22:55,599
you've got what do you say if you want

2382
01:22:54,079 --> 01:22:56,880
to run a government you want to get

2383
01:22:55,600 --> 01:22:58,239
people to pay their taxes but there's

2384
01:22:56,880 --> 01:22:59,359
something else yeah

2385
01:22:58,238 --> 01:23:01,519
what do you say so you have these

2386
01:22:59,359 --> 01:23:02,960
objects fine with impunity right and you

2387
01:23:01,520 --> 01:23:05,120
that you have something else well not

2388
01:23:02,960 --> 01:23:06,800
only that what can you say like how much

2389
01:23:05,119 --> 01:23:08,639
do you really know i think it's mainly

2390
01:23:06,800 --> 01:23:10,719
the technology yeah they just want to

2391
01:23:08,639 --> 01:23:11,600
keep the technology secret because if

2392
01:23:10,719 --> 01:23:14,319
there's

2393
01:23:11,600 --> 01:23:16,320
yeah whoever gets this dude yeah

2394
01:23:14,319 --> 01:23:18,559
you you control the where you become you

2395
01:23:16,319 --> 01:23:20,799
literally become invincible once you

2396
01:23:18,560 --> 01:23:23,440
master the technology you can't you

2397
01:23:20,800 --> 01:23:25,440
cannot penetrate a field like that so

2398
01:23:23,439 --> 01:23:27,119
imagine that's i know it's all science

2399
01:23:25,439 --> 01:23:29,359
fiction but science fiction turns into

2400
01:23:27,119 --> 01:23:31,840
science fact if you have

2401
01:23:29,359 --> 01:23:33,119
real force fields around aircraft and

2402
01:23:31,840 --> 01:23:34,800
battleships

2403
01:23:33,119 --> 01:23:36,719
you you win

2404
01:23:34,800 --> 01:23:38,880
you win you can force your will upon

2405
01:23:36,719 --> 01:23:40,319
anybody and uh

2406
01:23:38,880 --> 01:23:42,400
like i said there's so much more to the

2407
01:23:40,319 --> 01:23:43,679
story when i was first there

2408
01:23:42,399 --> 01:23:46,479
um

2409
01:23:43,679 --> 01:23:48,399
there were russian scientists at s4 that

2410
01:23:46,479 --> 01:23:50,238
was this was early on in the project so

2411
01:23:48,399 --> 01:23:51,920
this was before operation paper clip

2412
01:23:50,238 --> 01:23:53,678
became public as well right so i would

2413
01:23:51,920 --> 01:23:55,199
imagine that was i don't know what the

2414
01:23:53,679 --> 01:23:56,158
date yeah when was that when did was

2415
01:23:55,198 --> 01:23:58,879
that

2416
01:23:56,158 --> 01:24:00,559
98 i think 98 yeah yeah i don't know the

2417
01:23:58,880 --> 01:24:02,800
dates on it so it's roughly 10 years

2418
01:24:00,560 --> 01:24:04,159
later operation paperclip becomes

2419
01:24:02,800 --> 01:24:06,079
freedom of information actually it's

2420
01:24:04,158 --> 01:24:08,000
about russia not germany he's not a

2421
01:24:06,079 --> 01:24:09,679
russian scientist yeah but i mean

2422
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:12,158
russian scientists a lot of them came

2423
01:24:09,679 --> 01:24:14,000
from germany a lot of those those rocket

2424
01:24:12,158 --> 01:24:16,719
scientists that work with nasa they all

2425
01:24:14,000 --> 01:24:18,238
came from nazi scientists got it so some

2426
01:24:16,719 --> 01:24:20,800
russians got some of them i just know

2427
01:24:18,238 --> 01:24:23,919
that and at some point there was intense

2428
01:24:20,800 --> 01:24:26,000
cooperation with even exchanging some

2429
01:24:23,920 --> 01:24:28,158
ideas on nuclear weapons and you know

2430
01:24:26,000 --> 01:24:29,760
emp tests and stuff things we would

2431
01:24:28,158 --> 01:24:32,638
never have discussed with them but at

2432
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:35,039
the same time it was in the late 80s uh

2433
01:24:32,639 --> 01:24:38,000
they were involved and actually in the

2434
01:24:35,039 --> 01:24:39,359
area at s4 with us so you got to

2435
01:24:38,000 --> 01:24:41,279
communicate with these guys or you saw

2436
01:24:39,359 --> 01:24:42,880
them no i knew they were there barry

2437
01:24:41,279 --> 01:24:45,119
barry would talk about the commies that

2438
01:24:42,880 --> 01:24:47,039
were there the communities the commies

2439
01:24:45,119 --> 01:24:49,359
and um that was back when they were the

2440
01:24:47,039 --> 01:24:49,359
commies

2441
01:24:50,319 --> 01:24:52,639
and

2442
01:24:52,880 --> 01:24:57,840
at some point it wasn't our group but at

2443
01:24:55,119 --> 01:24:58,880
some point there was a big discovery

2444
01:24:57,840 --> 01:25:01,039
made

2445
01:24:58,880 --> 01:25:03,359
and this did not happen when i was there

2446
01:25:01,039 --> 01:25:05,840
it happened in between my trips to there

2447
01:25:03,359 --> 01:25:07,599
and after that apparently they decided

2448
01:25:05,840 --> 01:25:09,279
it was just too cool to share with

2449
01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:11,360
anybody and the russians were never

2450
01:25:09,279 --> 01:25:12,559
allowed back on the base after that but

2451
01:25:11,359 --> 01:25:14,559
you don't know what that discovery was

2452
01:25:12,560 --> 01:25:17,199
no no like i said it wasn't my group so

2453
01:25:14,560 --> 01:25:18,400
one of the other groups really found out

2454
01:25:17,198 --> 01:25:20,158
something

2455
01:25:18,399 --> 01:25:22,158
but the you know

2456
01:25:20,158 --> 01:25:23,839
in typical american fashion is all right

2457
01:25:22,158 --> 01:25:26,638
this is ours you guys get the hell out

2458
01:25:23,840 --> 01:25:29,600
of here was there any inkling that any

2459
01:25:26,639 --> 01:25:31,840
other government had something similar

2460
01:25:29,600 --> 01:25:33,360
no no nothing that i had heard see that

2461
01:25:31,840 --> 01:25:36,880
was the thing that always freaked me out

2462
01:25:33,359 --> 01:25:38,158
was why if if something was so superior

2463
01:25:36,880 --> 01:25:40,560
to human beings it's almost like

2464
01:25:38,158 --> 01:25:41,920
visiting an ant colony like why would

2465
01:25:40,560 --> 01:25:44,000
you go to the queen i don't give a [ __ ]

2466
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:45,840
who the queen is i'm a human i'm so

2467
01:25:44,000 --> 01:25:47,520
superior to ants i don't care who you

2468
01:25:45,840 --> 01:25:50,239
have running your hive i'm just gonna

2469
01:25:47,520 --> 01:25:51,600
study it i think it's who got it who got

2470
01:25:50,238 --> 01:25:53,599
it look at the

2471
01:25:51,600 --> 01:25:55,840
you know rocket technology in germany

2472
01:25:53,600 --> 01:25:57,920
but they got nine of them

2473
01:25:55,840 --> 01:26:00,239
yeah that doesn't make sense to me

2474
01:25:57,920 --> 01:26:01,279
either so they were either in the same

2475
01:26:00,238 --> 01:26:03,439
area

2476
01:26:01,279 --> 01:26:04,880
or you know one had clues to where

2477
01:26:03,439 --> 01:26:06,638
others were

2478
01:26:04,880 --> 01:26:08,079
i mean i don't know you you have to fill

2479
01:26:06,639 --> 01:26:11,279
that in there but you're right i mean

2480
01:26:08,079 --> 01:26:13,198
nine of them that's a that's a a big dig

2481
01:26:11,279 --> 01:26:14,960
if it was archaeological well one of the

2482
01:26:13,198 --> 01:26:17,279
more recent

2483
01:26:14,960 --> 01:26:18,800
recent sightings and the these

2484
01:26:17,279 --> 01:26:21,039
discussions that have been coming out

2485
01:26:18,800 --> 01:26:22,400
recently from air force pilots and navy

2486
01:26:21,039 --> 01:26:24,079
pilots they've been talking about things

2487
01:26:22,399 --> 01:26:25,759
happening in the ocean

2488
01:26:24,079 --> 01:26:28,158
and that that something

2489
01:26:25,760 --> 01:26:29,440
go literally goes into the water or

2490
01:26:28,158 --> 01:26:31,759
something maybe below the surface

2491
01:26:29,439 --> 01:26:33,519
thinking about water 2004 tic tac nimitz

2492
01:26:31,760 --> 01:26:35,039
case so that's when george knapp and i

2493
01:26:33,520 --> 01:26:36,400
broke on the radio twice before the new

2494
01:26:35,039 --> 01:26:38,960
york times so i know this one really

2495
01:26:36,399 --> 01:26:40,158
well commander fravor and those pilots

2496
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:42,480
there was

2497
01:26:40,158 --> 01:26:43,519
a disturbance on the surface of the

2498
01:26:42,479 --> 01:26:45,839
water

2499
01:26:43,520 --> 01:26:48,239
commander fravor visually saw what

2500
01:26:45,840 --> 01:26:50,239
looked like similar to across some

2501
01:26:48,238 --> 01:26:51,519
object so it's like as if you have some

2502
01:26:50,238 --> 01:26:54,000
like coral under the water and you've

2503
01:26:51,520 --> 01:26:56,800
got it's breaking over right the tic tac

2504
01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:58,479
is doing this crazy maneuver that defies

2505
01:26:56,800 --> 01:26:59,920
it's a gravity-propelled system they saw

2506
01:26:58,479 --> 01:27:02,000
it in the sky before they saw in the

2507
01:26:59,920 --> 01:27:03,600
water right yeah so there was um there

2508
01:27:02,000 --> 01:27:05,359
were radar that was picking this these

2509
01:27:03,600 --> 01:27:07,280
things coming down from 80 000 feet

2510
01:27:05,359 --> 01:27:09,359
dropping to 50 feet in less than a

2511
01:27:07,279 --> 01:27:10,880
second this is it jamie what is this

2512
01:27:09,359 --> 01:27:12,559
this is actually on the news today there

2513
01:27:10,880 --> 01:27:14,639
was a briefing so a lot of people get

2514
01:27:12,560 --> 01:27:15,600
this confused not this one then either

2515
01:27:14,639 --> 01:27:17,600
no so

2516
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:19,920
that is called the gimbal so there's

2517
01:27:17,600 --> 01:27:21,440
three videos released by the pentagon

2518
01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:23,279
that are all active play and keep the

2519
01:27:21,439 --> 01:27:24,719
volume off

2520
01:27:23,279 --> 01:27:26,399
i i would i would really just pay

2521
01:27:24,719 --> 01:27:28,480
attention to the source video so you've

2522
01:27:26,399 --> 01:27:30,799
got the tic tac which is this object the

2523
01:27:28,479 --> 01:27:33,678
commander fravor saw another pilot

2524
01:27:30,800 --> 01:27:35,360
filmed it with a flir pod and it goes

2525
01:27:33,679 --> 01:27:38,480
but this one you see is really important

2526
01:27:35,359 --> 01:27:41,359
to bob's story the gimbal craft it's

2527
01:27:38,479 --> 01:27:44,079
been recently analyzed it's fleer not

2528
01:27:41,359 --> 01:27:46,799
only does it it's definitive that it's

2529
01:27:44,079 --> 01:27:48,639
not a conventional anything by the by

2530
01:27:46,800 --> 01:27:49,920
its movements but there's a pocket of

2531
01:27:48,639 --> 01:27:52,159
cold air

2532
01:27:49,920 --> 01:27:55,119
around a propulsion source

2533
01:27:52,158 --> 01:27:58,079
so this object by the way sat stationary

2534
01:27:55,119 --> 01:28:00,238
for days if not weeks it sat stationary

2535
01:27:58,079 --> 01:28:01,760
yeah they found it 11 hours later and

2536
01:28:00,238 --> 01:28:03,839
they were saying there's no way this

2537
01:28:01,760 --> 01:28:05,920
thing using that kind of energy to go

2538
01:28:03,840 --> 01:28:08,000
that fast could just hover the amount of

2539
01:28:05,920 --> 01:28:10,079
time and by the way you're seeing a very

2540
01:28:08,000 --> 01:28:12,319
small part of what happened that day

2541
01:28:10,079 --> 01:28:14,719
this object was not alone

2542
01:28:12,319 --> 01:28:16,960
and so hopefully that information comes

2543
01:28:14,719 --> 01:28:18,480
out and we can i mean i wish we had

2544
01:28:16,960 --> 01:28:19,600
video of it i'm sure we'd all want to

2545
01:28:18,479 --> 01:28:21,198
see it

2546
01:28:19,600 --> 01:28:22,560
but that's called the gimbal that was

2547
01:28:21,198 --> 01:28:24,960
east coast

2548
01:28:22,560 --> 01:28:27,600
right 2015.

2549
01:28:24,960 --> 01:28:29,600
west coast 2004 was the tic tac

2550
01:28:27,600 --> 01:28:31,120
the disturbance on the water commander

2551
01:28:29,600 --> 01:28:33,039
fraber believes there was something

2552
01:28:31,119 --> 01:28:34,479
under that water that was causing that

2553
01:28:33,039 --> 01:28:35,840
disturbance when the tic tac was coming

2554
01:28:34,479 --> 01:28:37,678
around to doing it

2555
01:28:35,840 --> 01:28:39,679
with inside the the people that are

2556
01:28:37,679 --> 01:28:41,520
studying this they're thinking maybe the

2557
01:28:39,679 --> 01:28:42,399
tic tac system was causing the

2558
01:28:41,520 --> 01:28:45,440
disturbance

2559
01:28:42,399 --> 01:28:48,479
but the uso unidentified submerged

2560
01:28:45,439 --> 01:28:49,919
object that he visually saw

2561
01:28:48,479 --> 01:28:52,319
uh the whole interesting thing about

2562
01:28:49,920 --> 01:28:54,560
that is i would love bob to describe it

2563
01:28:52,319 --> 01:28:55,519
is why it doesn't matter if these craft

2564
01:28:54,560 --> 01:28:56,560
are in

2565
01:28:55,520 --> 01:28:58,800
space

2566
01:28:56,560 --> 01:29:00,960
air or water why doesn't it matter i

2567
01:28:58,800 --> 01:29:02,800
love when he talks about this [ __ ]

2568
01:29:00,960 --> 01:29:05,760
well first of all commander fravor was

2569
01:29:02,800 --> 01:29:07,600
the f-18 pilot off the nimitz that was

2570
01:29:05,760 --> 01:29:10,800
sent out to find out what this stuff is

2571
01:29:07,600 --> 01:29:13,440
but and it wasn't just i got a chance to

2572
01:29:10,800 --> 01:29:15,760
talk to him recently and it wasn't just

2573
01:29:13,439 --> 01:29:18,799
a radar image i mean commander fravor

2574
01:29:15,760 --> 01:29:21,360
had eyes on it for over five minutes

2575
01:29:18,800 --> 01:29:23,279
watching this thing as four other pilots

2576
01:29:21,359 --> 01:29:24,880
did so this wasn't a radar blip or

2577
01:29:23,279 --> 01:29:27,679
anything i mean these guys were watching

2578
01:29:24,880 --> 01:29:29,199
this thing but

2579
01:29:27,679 --> 01:29:31,840
you know one of the things i think in

2580
01:29:29,198 --> 01:29:34,799
the gimbal video

2581
01:29:31,840 --> 01:29:36,239
the way the craft that we worked on

2582
01:29:34,800 --> 01:29:39,279
flies

2583
01:29:36,238 --> 01:29:41,519
is it doesn't fly like

2584
01:29:39,279 --> 01:29:43,920
a conventional aircraft does and it

2585
01:29:41,520 --> 01:29:47,760
doesn't fly like a flying saucer with in

2586
01:29:43,920 --> 01:29:50,639
a 1950s movie it flies belly first

2587
01:29:47,760 --> 01:29:53,039
i mean it may set down conventionally

2588
01:29:50,639 --> 01:29:55,039
but it always rotates it does a role

2589
01:29:53,039 --> 01:29:57,279
maneuver puts its belly towards the

2590
01:29:55,039 --> 01:30:00,000
target and then moves away so it's like

2591
01:29:57,279 --> 01:30:00,800
a car flying with the wheels forward

2592
01:30:00,000 --> 01:30:01,679
right

2593
01:30:00,800 --> 01:30:03,600
right

2594
01:30:01,679 --> 01:30:05,600
i mean it may lift land on the wheels

2595
01:30:03,600 --> 01:30:07,679
but at some point when it wants to leave

2596
01:30:05,600 --> 01:30:09,360
flips flips up points the wheels where

2597
01:30:07,679 --> 01:30:12,000
it wants to go and takes off and the

2598
01:30:09,359 --> 01:30:14,479
gimbal video you can see the craft do

2599
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:15,840
the roll maneuver and uh

2600
01:30:14,479 --> 01:30:18,559
it's really interesting it behaves

2601
01:30:15,840 --> 01:30:19,520
exactly like the crafts that i worked on

2602
01:30:18,560 --> 01:30:21,120
so

2603
01:30:19,520 --> 01:30:24,239
much like we have different shaped

2604
01:30:21,119 --> 01:30:27,198
aircrafts and fighter jets and cars they

2605
01:30:24,238 --> 01:30:29,519
probably have different shapes of these

2606
01:30:27,198 --> 01:30:30,719
objects that operate under similar

2607
01:30:29,520 --> 01:30:33,040
principles

2608
01:30:30,719 --> 01:30:34,158
right but they all have the same power

2609
01:30:33,039 --> 01:30:36,479
source they all have the same power

2610
01:30:34,158 --> 01:30:38,799
source and we're also dealing with

2611
01:30:36,479 --> 01:30:41,759
if you think about

2612
01:30:38,800 --> 01:30:43,520
the laws of technological progression

2613
01:30:41,760 --> 01:30:46,320
you know you think of moore's law and

2614
01:30:43,520 --> 01:30:47,920
you think of how things accelerate

2615
01:30:46,319 --> 01:30:50,559
you've got to think that if this

2616
01:30:47,920 --> 01:30:52,239
civilization is who knows how many years

2617
01:30:50,560 --> 01:30:54,800
more advanced than we are

2618
01:30:52,238 --> 01:30:56,238
if not even years i mean i mean we're

2619
01:30:54,800 --> 01:30:57,760
thinking about in terms of conventional

2620
01:30:56,238 --> 01:31:00,399
terms right the way the way we look at

2621
01:30:57,760 --> 01:31:01,199
the world i mean they meet they might be

2622
01:31:00,399 --> 01:31:03,759
just

2623
01:31:01,198 --> 01:31:05,919
superior in terms of their intellect

2624
01:31:03,760 --> 01:31:07,760
they've got to be maybe maybe we don't

2625
01:31:05,920 --> 01:31:11,359
know right well the only reason i

2626
01:31:07,760 --> 01:31:13,679
i say that is because

2627
01:31:11,359 --> 01:31:15,759
look everyone doesn't necessarily start

2628
01:31:13,679 --> 01:31:18,079
at a steam engine right and go to an

2629
01:31:15,760 --> 01:31:20,000
internal combustion engine and then you

2630
01:31:18,079 --> 01:31:22,960
know electric power nuclear power and go

2631
01:31:20,000 --> 01:31:24,960
up the ladder that we right come on um

2632
01:31:22,960 --> 01:31:26,800
you know the binary if the stuff is true

2633
01:31:24,960 --> 01:31:28,560
about the origin and the binary star

2634
01:31:26,800 --> 01:31:30,800
system and they have heavier elements

2635
01:31:28,560 --> 01:31:32,960
that we don't have and this element

2636
01:31:30,800 --> 01:31:34,560
stable element 115 is a naturally

2637
01:31:32,960 --> 01:31:36,158
occurring material

2638
01:31:34,560 --> 01:31:38,080
maybe that's the first thing they

2639
01:31:36,158 --> 01:31:39,759
started experimenting with and the

2640
01:31:38,079 --> 01:31:42,399
version of their steam engine their

2641
01:31:39,760 --> 01:31:44,079
first product was something that

2642
01:31:42,399 --> 01:31:46,479
operated like this and actually when

2643
01:31:44,079 --> 01:31:48,319
they came to earth to look around or you

2644
01:31:46,479 --> 01:31:50,079
know whatever they were amazed at the

2645
01:31:48,319 --> 01:31:51,840
stuff we were doing these guys burned

2646
01:31:50,079 --> 01:31:54,559
stuff and squirted out the back to go

2647
01:31:51,840 --> 01:31:56,079
forward so right um right you know who

2648
01:31:54,560 --> 01:31:58,880
says they follow any kind of normal

2649
01:31:56,079 --> 01:32:01,840
progression like that my my thought was

2650
01:31:58,880 --> 01:32:04,239
if you went back to the 1400s and then

2651
01:32:01,840 --> 01:32:05,600
you went from 1400 to 1500 you're not

2652
01:32:04,238 --> 01:32:08,559
going to see that much of a difference

2653
01:32:05,600 --> 01:32:11,120
technologically right if you go from

2654
01:32:08,560 --> 01:32:13,679
2000 to 3000 i assume there's going to

2655
01:32:11,119 --> 01:32:16,880
be a radical change right well the yeah

2656
01:32:13,679 --> 01:32:19,840
the delta the rate of change is is

2657
01:32:16,880 --> 01:32:22,960
magnificently higher than it used to be

2658
01:32:19,840 --> 01:32:25,520
right so if you think about what they

2659
01:32:22,960 --> 01:32:28,960
had in 1988 and you think about what

2660
01:32:25,520 --> 01:32:30,239
they probably have in 2019

2661
01:32:28,960 --> 01:32:32,639
just

2662
01:32:30,238 --> 01:32:34,399
logically seems like they would advance

2663
01:32:32,639 --> 01:32:35,359
i would think so

2664
01:32:34,399 --> 01:32:36,638
the only

2665
01:32:35,359 --> 01:32:38,639
question is like

2666
01:32:36,639 --> 01:32:40,719
are they living

2667
01:32:38,639 --> 01:32:42,480
is that a living thing in terms of like

2668
01:32:40,719 --> 01:32:45,520
a biological thing

2669
01:32:42,479 --> 01:32:47,839
or are they some sort of an artificially

2670
01:32:45,520 --> 01:32:49,199
created creation like we are working on

2671
01:32:47,840 --> 01:32:52,159
right now i mean we're in the middle of

2672
01:32:49,198 --> 01:32:54,079
working on artificial reality artificial

2673
01:32:52,158 --> 01:32:56,238
beings sentient beings artificial

2674
01:32:54,079 --> 01:32:57,439
intelligence there's cons silicon based

2675
01:32:56,238 --> 01:33:00,000
life forms that they're essentially

2676
01:32:57,439 --> 01:33:02,238
trying to create boston dynamic or was

2677
01:33:00,000 --> 01:33:04,079
it boston dynamics of the company

2678
01:33:02,238 --> 01:33:06,799
robots yeah you can make machines out of

2679
01:33:04,079 --> 01:33:08,238
flesh right so a cyborg or cybernetic

2680
01:33:06,800 --> 01:33:09,679
organism is just that you know that's

2681
01:33:08,238 --> 01:33:11,439
what a lot of people think those like

2682
01:33:09,679 --> 01:33:13,359
gray things are you know that people

2683
01:33:11,439 --> 01:33:16,238
call the grays yeah it's like they were

2684
01:33:13,359 --> 01:33:18,079
like they're machines printed from flash

2685
01:33:16,238 --> 01:33:20,399
so what you're saying is like well they

2686
01:33:18,079 --> 01:33:22,559
could just be no synthetic

2687
01:33:20,399 --> 01:33:24,719
they don't even need to be you know

2688
01:33:22,560 --> 01:33:25,920
machines well they seem to have no sex

2689
01:33:24,719 --> 01:33:27,439
organs the way they're described by

2690
01:33:25,920 --> 01:33:28,880
people that have had interactions with

2691
01:33:27,439 --> 01:33:31,599
them assuming these people aren't liars

2692
01:33:28,880 --> 01:33:34,480
right or crazy or whatever right that

2693
01:33:31,600 --> 01:33:36,639
they have no sex organs and that they

2694
01:33:34,479 --> 01:33:38,879
don't seem to have any muscle that is

2695
01:33:36,639 --> 01:33:42,880
almost like a frame right and they have

2696
01:33:38,880 --> 01:33:45,520
enormous heads i mean if you look at

2697
01:33:42,880 --> 01:33:47,119
australopithecus or depictions of you

2698
01:33:45,520 --> 01:33:48,960
know ancient hominids and then you go to

2699
01:33:47,119 --> 01:33:50,880
human beings one of the things you see

2700
01:33:48,960 --> 01:33:53,039
is bigger heads and weaker bodies well

2701
01:33:50,880 --> 01:33:55,679
you see a clear progression of evolution

2702
01:33:53,039 --> 01:33:58,319
too where for something like that i

2703
01:33:55,679 --> 01:34:00,079
would lean towards a synthetic organism

2704
01:33:58,319 --> 01:34:02,399
because it looks like it was made for a

2705
01:34:00,079 --> 01:34:04,559
specific task there was no reproductive

2706
01:34:02,399 --> 01:34:06,879
organs so i mean that almost kind of

2707
01:34:04,560 --> 01:34:08,880
leaves out any kind of you know physical

2708
01:34:06,880 --> 01:34:10,639
evolution right well that's also our

2709
01:34:08,880 --> 01:34:13,279
bottleneck right our bottleneck is our

2710
01:34:10,639 --> 01:34:16,800
biological imperative the the need to

2711
01:34:13,279 --> 01:34:19,519
breed emotions fear anxiety all these

2712
01:34:16,800 --> 01:34:22,800
different things that exist in order to

2713
01:34:19,520 --> 01:34:24,320
force us into making sure we reproduce i

2714
01:34:22,800 --> 01:34:26,880
mean that's essentially there's human

2715
01:34:24,319 --> 01:34:28,719
reward systems that aren't necessary

2716
01:34:26,880 --> 01:34:31,679
once they can figure out a way to make

2717
01:34:28,719 --> 01:34:33,119
some sort of sentient artificial life

2718
01:34:31,679 --> 01:34:34,800
some sort of thing that doesn't have

2719
01:34:33,119 --> 01:34:36,960
these biological limitations that we

2720
01:34:34,800 --> 01:34:38,159
have by the way these craft all these

2721
01:34:36,960 --> 01:34:39,119
different kinds have been reported

2722
01:34:38,158 --> 01:34:40,559
because it was confusing i always

2723
01:34:39,119 --> 01:34:43,039
thought of flying saucers what i heard

2724
01:34:40,560 --> 01:34:44,719
bob lazar talk about flying saucer right

2725
01:34:43,039 --> 01:34:46,960
but if you look back in history people

2726
01:34:44,719 --> 01:34:49,119
have always reported the weirdest shapes

2727
01:34:46,960 --> 01:34:51,039
like none of them are alike you know

2728
01:34:49,119 --> 01:34:53,119
there are the saucers but you got cigar

2729
01:34:51,039 --> 01:34:56,000
shaped you got you know the top hat

2730
01:34:53,119 --> 01:34:57,760
shape you have orbs why maybe they're

2731
01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:59,279
serving different purposes they're doing

2732
01:34:57,760 --> 01:35:01,840
different things like we'd use different

2733
01:34:59,279 --> 01:35:03,840
tools and i want to be clear the reason

2734
01:35:01,840 --> 01:35:05,520
i know that memo is real is because i

2735
01:35:03,840 --> 01:35:07,360
spent a lot of time with dr edgar

2736
01:35:05,520 --> 01:35:09,360
mitchell six man to walk on the moon

2737
01:35:07,359 --> 01:35:10,319
last guy to film him before he died

2738
01:35:09,359 --> 01:35:11,839
right

2739
01:35:10,319 --> 01:35:13,119
that's how i know i don't want any

2740
01:35:11,840 --> 01:35:14,880
journalists thinking i got it from

2741
01:35:13,119 --> 01:35:16,479
anywhere else i know because of dr

2742
01:35:14,880 --> 01:35:18,480
mitchell and he said the same thing

2743
01:35:16,479 --> 01:35:21,198
maybe these things are

2744
01:35:18,479 --> 01:35:22,959
performing different tasks you know and

2745
01:35:21,198 --> 01:35:25,359
that's what i seem if you if you think

2746
01:35:22,960 --> 01:35:26,158
about what an alien is in terms of our

2747
01:35:25,359 --> 01:35:28,319
our

2748
01:35:26,158 --> 01:35:30,319
the sort of iconic image of an alien

2749
01:35:28,319 --> 01:35:33,679
like the steven spielberg closing cows

2750
01:35:30,319 --> 01:35:35,840
are the third time the third kind alien

2751
01:35:33,679 --> 01:35:37,840
they seem like

2752
01:35:35,840 --> 01:35:39,760
what we'd assume a human being would

2753
01:35:37,840 --> 01:35:41,520
eventually become right

2754
01:35:39,760 --> 01:35:42,719
and if these things are tiny human

2755
01:35:41,520 --> 01:35:43,920
beings are smaller than they've ever

2756
01:35:42,719 --> 01:35:45,359
been before they're weaker than they've

2757
01:35:43,920 --> 01:35:48,079
ever been before and there seems to be a

2758
01:35:45,359 --> 01:35:50,559
trend in that direction and this trend

2759
01:35:48,079 --> 01:35:52,479
seems to be amplified by our

2760
01:35:50,560 --> 01:35:53,520
technological progression

2761
01:35:52,479 --> 01:35:55,839
there our

2762
01:35:53,520 --> 01:35:57,920
lack of need for muscle strength and our

2763
01:35:55,840 --> 01:36:00,319
lack of need for violence and we're

2764
01:35:57,920 --> 01:36:01,760
moving in a society to try to get away

2765
01:36:00,319 --> 01:36:03,840
from all the things that we think are

2766
01:36:01,760 --> 01:36:06,719
abhorrent about human beings and the

2767
01:36:03,840 --> 01:36:10,239
terrible behaviors that we have if we

2768
01:36:06,719 --> 01:36:13,439
one day do give birth to some sort of an

2769
01:36:10,238 --> 01:36:14,399
artificial being like marshall mcluhan's

2770
01:36:13,439 --> 01:36:16,638
uh

2771
01:36:14,399 --> 01:36:18,079
quote we are the sex organs of the

2772
01:36:16,639 --> 01:36:20,560
machine world

2773
01:36:18,079 --> 01:36:23,039
you know that one day okay i'll buy this

2774
01:36:20,560 --> 01:36:24,239
yeah mcloone was brilliant and that that

2775
01:36:23,039 --> 01:36:26,479
quote has always been one of my

2776
01:36:24,238 --> 01:36:28,399
favorites because okay what are we doing

2777
01:36:26,479 --> 01:36:30,638
when we're constantly technologically

2778
01:36:28,399 --> 01:36:32,719
innovating we're constantly looking for

2779
01:36:30,639 --> 01:36:35,039
faster cars better computers bigger

2780
01:36:32,719 --> 01:36:36,560
screens faster more resolution more

2781
01:36:35,039 --> 01:36:39,279
pixels more this more that higher

2782
01:36:36,560 --> 01:36:41,440
bandwidth 5g 10g right what are we doing

2783
01:36:39,279 --> 01:36:43,679
we're moving into this in this if you

2784
01:36:41,439 --> 01:36:45,359
just follow it objectively stay stand

2785
01:36:43,679 --> 01:36:47,039
back don't attach yourself or your

2786
01:36:45,359 --> 01:36:49,679
civilization your culture to it and look

2787
01:36:47,039 --> 01:36:52,319
at what it is we're moving

2788
01:36:49,679 --> 01:36:54,399
a hundred percent towards technological

2789
01:36:52,319 --> 01:36:56,319
innovation if you looked at this species

2790
01:36:54,399 --> 01:36:57,679
from afar and if you weren't a part of

2791
01:36:56,319 --> 01:37:00,000
it you would say what does this species

2792
01:36:57,679 --> 01:37:02,079
do oh they make things they make things

2793
01:37:00,000 --> 01:37:04,000
better every year beehives are the same

2794
01:37:02,079 --> 01:37:05,920
[ __ ] thing that you see 10 years ago

2795
01:37:04,000 --> 01:37:07,279
you go by you see a beehive it's amazing

2796
01:37:05,920 --> 01:37:08,800
it's cool but they're the same [ __ ]

2797
01:37:07,279 --> 01:37:11,118
thing they figured out how to do it they

2798
01:37:08,800 --> 01:37:12,560
make a beehive right we don't do that we

2799
01:37:11,118 --> 01:37:14,719
make better things what would you

2800
01:37:12,560 --> 01:37:16,719
constantly and at some point i think

2801
01:37:14,719 --> 01:37:17,920
that technology is going to fuse with us

2802
01:37:16,719 --> 01:37:19,679
yes and we're going to become it's

2803
01:37:17,920 --> 01:37:21,118
already happening yeah elon musk talked

2804
01:37:19,679 --> 01:37:22,719
about it on my podcast that we are

2805
01:37:21,118 --> 01:37:24,719
cyborgs you just carry it in your pocket

2806
01:37:22,719 --> 01:37:26,480
it's a phone it answers any question you

2807
01:37:24,719 --> 01:37:28,880
want you can talk to it it'll give you

2808
01:37:26,479 --> 01:37:31,118
the answers the answers instantaneously

2809
01:37:28,880 --> 01:37:32,719
it navigates you it has all your phone

2810
01:37:31,118 --> 01:37:33,839
numbers and it has all your contacts you

2811
01:37:32,719 --> 01:37:35,359
can get a hold of people people

2812
01:37:33,840 --> 01:37:37,760
listening to you through it it's

2813
01:37:35,359 --> 01:37:39,279
connecting us in ways even involuntarily

2814
01:37:37,760 --> 01:37:40,800
haptics that kind of thing yeah it's

2815
01:37:39,279 --> 01:37:43,519
also getting on your wrist how many

2816
01:37:40,800 --> 01:37:45,360
people have eye watches apple watches

2817
01:37:43,520 --> 01:37:47,040
right and that's only because we can't

2818
01:37:45,359 --> 01:37:48,399
integrate them yet but you know that

2819
01:37:47,039 --> 01:37:50,079
point is 100

2820
01:37:48,399 --> 01:37:51,920
yeah i didn't joke about it last night

2821
01:37:50,079 --> 01:37:53,679
but i have a bit about it that i do

2822
01:37:51,920 --> 01:37:55,679
about the the integration between humans

2823
01:37:53,679 --> 01:37:58,158
and technology that's what would you do

2824
01:37:55,679 --> 01:37:59,920
if you were a hyper intelligence right

2825
01:37:58,158 --> 01:38:01,759
would you do the work yourself or would

2826
01:37:59,920 --> 01:38:03,920
you create some cool things called like

2827
01:38:01,760 --> 01:38:05,520
humans to do it for you would you create

2828
01:38:03,920 --> 01:38:07,840
things that are cybernetic organisms to

2829
01:38:05,520 --> 01:38:09,840
come in with machines and do it for you

2830
01:38:07,840 --> 01:38:11,760
if you're a hyper intelligence that has

2831
01:38:09,840 --> 01:38:13,840
kind of changed like you've described

2832
01:38:11,760 --> 01:38:16,159
you'd probably create workers right well

2833
01:38:13,840 --> 01:38:17,600
that's a vast conspiracy theory i'm not

2834
01:38:16,158 --> 01:38:19,599
talking about conspiracy but it is a

2835
01:38:17,600 --> 01:38:21,600
kind of a conspiracy i'm asking you well

2836
01:38:19,600 --> 01:38:23,600
i mean i don't think it's necessarily

2837
01:38:21,600 --> 01:38:25,360
that i mean you could look at it that

2838
01:38:23,600 --> 01:38:26,480
way but that is the way a conspiracy

2839
01:38:25,359 --> 01:38:27,519
theorist would look at it the way i

2840
01:38:26,479 --> 01:38:29,359
would look at it is like there's

2841
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:31,679
obviously a progression going on a

2842
01:38:29,359 --> 01:38:33,439
biological progression there's some sort

2843
01:38:31,679 --> 01:38:35,359
of an integration with technology

2844
01:38:33,439 --> 01:38:37,599
there's some sort of imperative this

2845
01:38:35,359 --> 01:38:39,839
need for technological innovation it's

2846
01:38:37,600 --> 01:38:41,440
inescapable everyone has it we and i

2847
01:38:39,840 --> 01:38:43,600
think it's attached to materialism in

2848
01:38:41,439 --> 01:38:45,759
some sort of a strange way because so

2849
01:38:43,600 --> 01:38:47,520
many people work so hard to get new

2850
01:38:45,760 --> 01:38:49,039
things and like god that seems so

2851
01:38:47,520 --> 01:38:50,400
illogical and preposterous and it makes

2852
01:38:49,039 --> 01:38:52,000
people unhappy and depression's on the

2853
01:38:50,399 --> 01:38:54,719
rise but nobody seems to be able to stop

2854
01:38:52,000 --> 01:38:57,760
it like why is that well maybe it's

2855
01:38:54,719 --> 01:38:59,679
because we are the

2856
01:38:57,760 --> 01:39:02,079
caterpillars that give birth to the

2857
01:38:59,679 --> 01:39:04,480
butterfly maybe that's what we're doing

2858
01:39:02,079 --> 01:39:06,479
very well what our job is to do is to

2859
01:39:04,479 --> 01:39:08,399
make some sort of a cocoon and we don't

2860
01:39:06,479 --> 01:39:10,158
even know we're doing it while we're

2861
01:39:08,399 --> 01:39:11,839
doing it do you think a caterpillar is

2862
01:39:10,158 --> 01:39:14,158
well hey caterpillar what are you doing

2863
01:39:11,840 --> 01:39:15,600
man just i'm doing my thing it's my job

2864
01:39:14,158 --> 01:39:17,279
i have to make a cocoon then become like

2865
01:39:15,600 --> 01:39:18,960
a body this could be a natural part of

2866
01:39:17,279 --> 01:39:20,960
evolution it could be that we're just

2867
01:39:18,960 --> 01:39:21,920
supposed to do this exactly and make the

2868
01:39:20,960 --> 01:39:24,239
jump to

2869
01:39:21,920 --> 01:39:27,440
some sort of mechanized right

2870
01:39:24,238 --> 01:39:30,238
yeah non-biological an orangutan that is

2871
01:39:27,439 --> 01:39:32,799
uh fishing with a spear

2872
01:39:30,238 --> 01:39:34,319
no they they've figured out how to fish

2873
01:39:32,800 --> 01:39:36,079
with spears there's

2874
01:39:34,319 --> 01:39:37,439
uh there's um

2875
01:39:36,079 --> 01:39:39,039
primatologists

2876
01:39:37,439 --> 01:39:41,118
without somebody showing them how to

2877
01:39:39,039 --> 01:39:43,439
fish no they've imitated human beings

2878
01:39:41,118 --> 01:39:45,679
doing it and now they do it but they do

2879
01:39:43,439 --> 01:39:47,439
it independently they're not trained

2880
01:39:45,679 --> 01:39:48,960
orangutans they're wild around look at

2881
01:39:47,439 --> 01:39:50,399
that

2882
01:39:48,960 --> 01:39:53,359
there's a wild rice okay that's

2883
01:39:50,399 --> 01:39:54,960
impressive very impressive well there's

2884
01:39:53,359 --> 01:39:56,639
these primatologists i guess you would

2885
01:39:54,960 --> 01:39:58,639
call them primatologists that's a term

2886
01:39:56,639 --> 01:40:00,319
that's a great biologist biologists that

2887
01:39:58,639 --> 01:40:02,239
believe that

2888
01:40:00,319 --> 01:40:04,639
monkeys and chimps

2889
01:40:02,238 --> 01:40:06,079
and some of the great apes are moving

2890
01:40:04,639 --> 01:40:08,159
into the stone age that they've

2891
01:40:06,079 --> 01:40:10,880
currently entered the stone age like

2892
01:40:08,158 --> 01:40:12,559
they're not staying what they were a

2893
01:40:10,880 --> 01:40:14,000
hundred thousand years ago or five

2894
01:40:12,560 --> 01:40:16,000
hundred thousand years ago but they're

2895
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:17,760
actively using tools and they're

2896
01:40:16,000 --> 01:40:19,840
experimenting with different different

2897
01:40:17,760 --> 01:40:21,760
ways to use those tools and then they're

2898
01:40:19,840 --> 01:40:23,279
making tools out of stone they're making

2899
01:40:21,760 --> 01:40:24,560
tools out of sticks and they're they're

2900
01:40:23,279 --> 01:40:27,920
using them

2901
01:40:24,560 --> 01:40:30,480
well this might just be what happens

2902
01:40:27,920 --> 01:40:32,560
this might just be what happens

2903
01:40:30,479 --> 01:40:34,799
i mean why else why would why the [ __ ]

2904
01:40:32,560 --> 01:40:36,880
we work so hard i mean i i was i was

2905
01:40:34,800 --> 01:40:38,960
driving to la this morning um i had a

2906
01:40:36,880 --> 01:40:40,960
doctor's appointment so i was on the 405

2907
01:40:38,960 --> 01:40:43,118
at uh eight in the morning like jesus

2908
01:40:40,960 --> 01:40:44,639
christ like this is so crazy when you're

2909
01:40:43,118 --> 01:40:46,319
in the 405 in l.a at eight o'clock in

2910
01:40:44,639 --> 01:40:47,199
the morning you see literally a million

2911
01:40:46,319 --> 01:40:49,118
cars

2912
01:40:47,198 --> 01:40:52,000
and this is everywhere you go as people

2913
01:40:49,118 --> 01:40:54,238
but and also i'm in a tesla so i have it

2914
01:40:52,000 --> 01:40:56,399
on autopilot so i'm there sitting i'm

2915
01:40:54,238 --> 01:40:58,238
listening to a podcast i barely have my

2916
01:40:56,399 --> 01:41:00,719
hand on the wheel i'm not touching [ __ ]

2917
01:40:58,238 --> 01:41:02,879
this car's driving me along i'm not even

2918
01:41:00,719 --> 01:41:04,560
doing anything i'm just i'm just hanging

2919
01:41:02,880 --> 01:41:06,239
out it's so much less stressful by the

2920
01:41:04,560 --> 01:41:08,639
way to do that that way right so it

2921
01:41:06,238 --> 01:41:11,198
encourages you to innovate it encourages

2922
01:41:08,639 --> 01:41:12,880
you to embrace this new technology i got

2923
01:41:11,198 --> 01:41:15,118
this giant screen it's showing me the

2924
01:41:12,880 --> 01:41:17,118
navigation in front of me i'll be there

2925
01:41:15,118 --> 01:41:19,759
five minutes early excellent and i'm

2926
01:41:17,118 --> 01:41:22,000
listening to a podcast wirelessly it's

2927
01:41:19,760 --> 01:41:24,159
bluetooth screen streaming from my phone

2928
01:41:22,000 --> 01:41:26,479
and i pulled that podcast which came out

2929
01:41:24,158 --> 01:41:28,238
today out of the [ __ ] sky and i'm

2930
01:41:26,479 --> 01:41:30,158
listening to it and i'm all comfortable

2931
01:41:28,238 --> 01:41:31,599
in my nice little car just driving on my

2932
01:41:30,158 --> 01:41:33,439
way to the doctor's office this is

2933
01:41:31,600 --> 01:41:35,360
irresistible stuff yeah yeah different

2934
01:41:33,439 --> 01:41:37,039
than your walkman yeah you know that can

2935
01:41:35,359 --> 01:41:38,799
be irresistible

2936
01:41:37,039 --> 01:41:40,399
it is a resistance it's frighteningly

2937
01:41:38,800 --> 01:41:42,079
irresistible but is it frightening i

2938
01:41:40,399 --> 01:41:44,559
mean if you were a monkey right if you

2939
01:41:42,079 --> 01:41:46,079
were um an australiopithecus would you

2940
01:41:44,560 --> 01:41:48,320
go man i don't want to [ __ ] be a

2941
01:41:46,079 --> 01:41:50,559
person i live in a house that's [ __ ]

2942
01:41:48,319 --> 01:41:52,399
i like just swinging around on trees i

2943
01:41:50,560 --> 01:41:54,480
like uh running from jaguars this is

2944
01:41:52,399 --> 01:41:56,000
life guys life is running from

2945
01:41:54,479 --> 01:41:57,678
crocodiles it's not living in a [ __ ]

2946
01:41:56,000 --> 01:41:59,920
suburban there's probably some that are

2947
01:41:57,679 --> 01:42:00,880
like that yeah i don't think so i think

2948
01:41:59,920 --> 01:42:02,560
i think

2949
01:42:00,880 --> 01:42:03,920
when it comes we're going to embrace it

2950
01:42:02,560 --> 01:42:05,840
we're going to embrace it the same way

2951
01:42:03,920 --> 01:42:07,440
you embrace cell phones the same way

2952
01:42:05,840 --> 01:42:08,960
embrace television there's going to be a

2953
01:42:07,439 --> 01:42:10,879
few holdouts i don't even have an email

2954
01:42:08,960 --> 01:42:12,480
address man those are those there's a

2955
01:42:10,880 --> 01:42:14,239
few and far between the good luck with

2956
01:42:12,479 --> 01:42:16,158
that [ __ ] face go move to the woods ted

2957
01:42:14,238 --> 01:42:17,279
kaczynski yeah i was just going to throw

2958
01:42:16,158 --> 01:42:18,879
ted's against

2959
01:42:17,279 --> 01:42:20,238
ted kaczynski was right this is

2960
01:42:18,880 --> 01:42:22,159
something that i think about sometimes

2961
01:42:20,238 --> 01:42:25,198
when i get really high that ted

2962
01:42:22,158 --> 01:42:26,879
kaczynski was a part of the harvard lsd

2963
01:42:25,198 --> 01:42:29,118
studies this has been proven ted

2964
01:42:26,880 --> 01:42:30,800
kaczynski they cooked his [ __ ] brain

2965
01:42:29,118 --> 01:42:32,000
when he was at harvard and then when he

2966
01:42:30,800 --> 01:42:33,920
went over to berkeley and became a

2967
01:42:32,000 --> 01:42:35,359
professor his goal was to make enough

2968
01:42:33,920 --> 01:42:37,118
money so that he could

2969
01:42:35,359 --> 01:42:39,118
implement this program and live in the

2970
01:42:37,118 --> 01:42:41,198
woods and then write his manifesto and

2971
01:42:39,118 --> 01:42:43,118
start killing people that were involved

2972
01:42:41,198 --> 01:42:46,479
in propagating technology he was

2973
01:42:43,118 --> 01:42:47,759
expunged from the harvard uh logs by the

2974
01:42:46,479 --> 01:42:50,238
way this is something my friend just

2975
01:42:47,760 --> 01:42:52,719
called me about so there's like this uh

2976
01:42:50,238 --> 01:42:54,158
private library and they used to print

2977
01:42:52,719 --> 01:42:55,920
people's names whenever they were part

2978
01:42:54,158 --> 01:42:58,158
of a university and he was one of a

2979
01:42:55,920 --> 01:43:00,079
handful of people that were expunged

2980
01:42:58,158 --> 01:43:01,439
from it i want to jump back to the one

2981
01:43:00,079 --> 01:43:02,960
thing joe

2982
01:43:01,439 --> 01:43:04,638
i want to be very careful with that word

2983
01:43:02,960 --> 01:43:06,639
conspiracy theorist

2984
01:43:04,639 --> 01:43:08,960
what i was what i was saying to you was

2985
01:43:06,639 --> 01:43:10,719
we we terraform our earth right

2986
01:43:08,960 --> 01:43:12,480
we terraform we change the environment

2987
01:43:10,719 --> 01:43:14,639
we do all this innovation

2988
01:43:12,479 --> 01:43:16,399
what is stopping us from thinking that

2989
01:43:14,639 --> 01:43:18,079
that's not being done i'm not saying it

2990
01:43:16,399 --> 01:43:20,000
is i'm saying what's stopping us from

2991
01:43:18,079 --> 01:43:22,559
thinking that that's being done on a

2992
01:43:20,000 --> 01:43:24,238
much bigger level on a cosmic level you

2993
01:43:22,560 --> 01:43:26,320
mean like aliens coming down doing that

2994
01:43:24,238 --> 01:43:28,399
to humans i'm telling you that there is

2995
01:43:26,319 --> 01:43:30,399
something here that's there's a fact you

2996
01:43:28,399 --> 01:43:31,920
know there's something there a craft

2997
01:43:30,399 --> 01:43:34,238
they're here they're not ours they're

2998
01:43:31,920 --> 01:43:35,920
here so the question is

2999
01:43:34,238 --> 01:43:37,279
what is that about and i'm just looking

3000
01:43:35,920 --> 01:43:39,199
at what we do with what you're

3001
01:43:37,279 --> 01:43:41,359
describing with technology

3002
01:43:39,198 --> 01:43:43,759
i think it's much more likely that the

3003
01:43:41,359 --> 01:43:45,679
same way we observe chimps and we

3004
01:43:43,760 --> 01:43:47,679
observed that they are now in the stone

3005
01:43:45,679 --> 01:43:49,039
age that they're observing us and that

3006
01:43:47,679 --> 01:43:51,279
they're recognizing that there is a

3007
01:43:49,039 --> 01:43:53,439
pattern that there is uh there's steps

3008
01:43:51,279 --> 01:43:54,960
that happen i mean carl sagan talked

3009
01:43:53,439 --> 01:43:56,638
about the different levels of

3010
01:43:54,960 --> 01:43:58,560
civilization and that you know if we

3011
01:43:56,639 --> 01:44:00,639
don't get past certain levels we're

3012
01:43:58,560 --> 01:44:01,920
never going to reach this i mean we're

3013
01:44:00,639 --> 01:44:03,520
in type 1 civilization we're going to

3014
01:44:01,920 --> 01:44:04,719
stay at type zero well we're in this

3015
01:44:03,520 --> 01:44:07,679
warring

3016
01:44:04,719 --> 01:44:08,960
polluting yeah pillaging we're awesome

3017
01:44:07,679 --> 01:44:10,480
civilizations

3018
01:44:08,960 --> 01:44:12,000
are awesome it's like well we're awesome

3019
01:44:10,479 --> 01:44:14,000
in a lot of ways you know but in that

3020
01:44:12,000 --> 01:44:16,079
way we're not well yeah we're we're

3021
01:44:14,000 --> 01:44:17,920
children that have immense power that we

3022
01:44:16,079 --> 01:44:20,158
didn't really the other thing is you're

3023
01:44:17,920 --> 01:44:22,079
using the immense power that other

3024
01:44:20,158 --> 01:44:23,198
people have created right i mean even

3025
01:44:22,079 --> 01:44:25,359
when you're driving a car you're

3026
01:44:23,198 --> 01:44:27,279
stomping on the gas like whew you didn't

3027
01:44:25,359 --> 01:44:29,198
invent the [ __ ] engine you didn't

3028
01:44:27,279 --> 01:44:31,359
invent tires there's all these things

3029
01:44:29,198 --> 01:44:33,599
that were in involved in the creation of

3030
01:44:31,359 --> 01:44:34,789
this thing that is

3031
01:44:33,600 --> 01:44:35,920
really outside of your

3032
01:44:34,789 --> 01:44:38,158
[Music]

3033
01:44:35,920 --> 01:44:39,760
grasp of understanding but yet you have

3034
01:44:38,158 --> 01:44:41,759
the ability to use it like a person with

3035
01:44:39,760 --> 01:44:43,679
a gun i'm just gonna bang bang bang

3036
01:44:41,760 --> 01:44:45,600
people you don't you didn't invent a gun

3037
01:44:43,679 --> 01:44:49,760
so like you've you've without the

3038
01:44:45,600 --> 01:44:52,159
intellect to craft and engineer and and

3039
01:44:49,760 --> 01:44:53,520
and manifest these creations you just

3040
01:44:52,158 --> 01:44:55,359
have access to them because you have

3041
01:44:53,520 --> 01:44:56,719
paper or you have bitcoin or you have

3042
01:44:55,359 --> 01:44:58,880
whatever the [ __ ] you're using using a

3043
01:44:56,719 --> 01:45:01,279
credit card now you have

3044
01:44:58,880 --> 01:45:03,359
almost no responsibility you just you

3045
01:45:01,279 --> 01:45:04,559
could just flippantly use these things

3046
01:45:03,359 --> 01:45:05,679
which is why

3047
01:45:04,560 --> 01:45:07,440
we uh

3048
01:45:05,679 --> 01:45:10,319
you know we're very childlike in our

3049
01:45:07,439 --> 01:45:12,000
actions because we haven't had to earn

3050
01:45:10,319 --> 01:45:14,399
the responsibility we haven't had to

3051
01:45:12,000 --> 01:45:16,238
earn these things that we've been able

3052
01:45:14,399 --> 01:45:18,238
to have and you've only been able to

3053
01:45:16,238 --> 01:45:20,000
have them because other people have

3054
01:45:18,238 --> 01:45:22,238
innovated and spent

3055
01:45:20,000 --> 01:45:24,319
ungodly amounts of time and effort and

3056
01:45:22,238 --> 01:45:26,158
focus in the lab to create these things

3057
01:45:24,319 --> 01:45:27,920
and then they've all put them together

3058
01:45:26,158 --> 01:45:29,439
and then what is the what's the reason

3059
01:45:27,920 --> 01:45:31,039
to put them together to profit well

3060
01:45:29,439 --> 01:45:32,079
what's the reason of prop well why are

3061
01:45:31,039 --> 01:45:34,158
you doing this so you can buy more

3062
01:45:32,079 --> 01:45:36,399
things what are we doing what are we

3063
01:45:34,158 --> 01:45:38,158
doing we're making better things that's

3064
01:45:36,399 --> 01:45:39,679
what we do that's all that's all we do

3065
01:45:38,158 --> 01:45:41,359
is make better things yeah why the [ __ ]

3066
01:45:39,679 --> 01:45:43,679
do we need oil why do we need oil why

3067
01:45:41,359 --> 01:45:45,839
can't we just burn wood and stay home

3068
01:45:43,679 --> 01:45:47,600
why can't we grow chickens and food in

3069
01:45:45,840 --> 01:45:49,679
the backyard why can't we do well we

3070
01:45:47,600 --> 01:45:52,239
[ __ ] can we certainly can people do

3071
01:45:49,679 --> 01:45:54,158
do it but we decide to make that almost

3072
01:45:52,238 --> 01:45:56,559
impossible our preferred way of living

3073
01:45:54,158 --> 01:45:57,920
is to stuff everyone into a very small

3074
01:45:56,560 --> 01:45:59,119
area where no one grows anything other

3075
01:45:57,920 --> 01:46:02,079
than weed

3076
01:45:59,118 --> 01:46:04,559
this is what la is la is 20 million

3077
01:46:02,079 --> 01:46:06,399
people with hard surfaces as many hard

3078
01:46:04,560 --> 01:46:08,480
surfaces as you can boy if you've got an

3079
01:46:06,399 --> 01:46:10,638
acre backyard in l.a holy [ __ ] look at

3080
01:46:08,479 --> 01:46:13,279
all that green this is amazing well no

3081
01:46:10,639 --> 01:46:15,920
that's the [ __ ] earth coming through

3082
01:46:13,279 --> 01:46:17,759
this weird sort of creation that we've

3083
01:46:15,920 --> 01:46:19,520
put on top of the earth but the goal is

3084
01:46:17,760 --> 01:46:21,360
that like new york city that's there's

3085
01:46:19,520 --> 01:46:23,199
none of it right you just got you've got

3086
01:46:21,359 --> 01:46:25,599
central park and they just got human

3087
01:46:23,198 --> 01:46:27,839
[ __ ] you stacked up no one's growing

3088
01:46:25,600 --> 01:46:30,800
anything and then constant work

3089
01:46:27,840 --> 01:46:33,199
everyone's up early go go go

3090
01:46:30,800 --> 01:46:35,840
innovate progress make that money so you

3091
01:46:33,198 --> 01:46:38,000
can buy more things and every year hey

3092
01:46:35,840 --> 01:46:40,319
apple where's this [ __ ] new phone as

3093
01:46:38,000 --> 01:46:42,158
if your phone isn't good enough yeah

3094
01:46:40,319 --> 01:46:44,559
like your phone's taking pictures and

3095
01:46:42,158 --> 01:46:46,158
videos and people are calling you and

3096
01:46:44,560 --> 01:46:48,000
you got applications to tell you which

3097
01:46:46,158 --> 01:46:49,920
way the wind's blowing it's not good

3098
01:46:48,000 --> 01:46:51,439
enough a blink of an eye blink of an eye

3099
01:46:49,920 --> 01:46:53,600
it's all gone though that you know like

3100
01:46:51,439 --> 01:46:55,198
10 000 years and the hoover dam goes or

3101
01:46:53,600 --> 01:46:57,199
whatever you know mount rushmore

3102
01:46:55,198 --> 01:46:58,960
disintegrates so it's amazing because we

3103
01:46:57,198 --> 01:47:00,399
have created that and and everything's

3104
01:46:58,960 --> 01:47:02,480
trying to spring up through that we keep

3105
01:47:00,399 --> 01:47:04,399
it maintenance down but we're we're a

3106
01:47:02,479 --> 01:47:05,839
blink man something hits

3107
01:47:04,399 --> 01:47:07,599
but we don't think that way well you

3108
01:47:05,840 --> 01:47:09,199
know you think in terms of your own life

3109
01:47:07,600 --> 01:47:11,360
right you think in terms of what you

3110
01:47:09,198 --> 01:47:14,000
want and what you need right now

3111
01:47:11,359 --> 01:47:16,799
you know what it's we are in many ways

3112
01:47:14,000 --> 01:47:18,639
this combination of this weird primitive

3113
01:47:16,800 --> 01:47:19,679
ape-like thing

3114
01:47:18,639 --> 01:47:22,719
with

3115
01:47:19,679 --> 01:47:24,480
the ability to calculate and manipulate

3116
01:47:22,719 --> 01:47:26,079
our world and our environment that makes

3117
01:47:24,479 --> 01:47:28,959
us wholly unique on top of that with

3118
01:47:26,079 --> 01:47:30,238
existential angst and and fear so what

3119
01:47:28,960 --> 01:47:32,319
do you do with that we [ __ ] water it

3120
01:47:30,238 --> 01:47:33,519
down with the anti-depressants give

3121
01:47:32,319 --> 01:47:34,719
these [ __ ] people some [ __ ] that

3122
01:47:33,520 --> 01:47:36,000
keeps them moving

3123
01:47:34,719 --> 01:47:37,520
they're worried about the future they're

3124
01:47:36,000 --> 01:47:39,439
trying to figure out what reality is if

3125
01:47:37,520 --> 01:47:41,199
this you're on a goddamn convertible

3126
01:47:39,439 --> 01:47:43,759
spaceship spinning a thousand miles an

3127
01:47:41,198 --> 01:47:45,439
hour hurling through infinity there's no

3128
01:47:43,760 --> 01:47:48,719
meaning to this thing just keep making

3129
01:47:45,439 --> 01:47:49,919
[ __ ] keep making stuff and then one day

3130
01:47:48,719 --> 01:47:53,039
they're going to be able to hit that

3131
01:47:49,920 --> 01:47:56,158
switch and this life will be born out of

3132
01:47:53,039 --> 01:47:59,279
innovation and thinking and progress and

3133
01:47:56,158 --> 01:48:01,039
technology and more than likely it's

3134
01:47:59,279 --> 01:48:03,279
probably going to be what we're seeing

3135
01:48:01,039 --> 01:48:04,560
that these things are that you're you're

3136
01:48:03,279 --> 01:48:06,079
observing

3137
01:48:04,560 --> 01:48:07,199
i'm not observing them but yeah

3138
01:48:06,079 --> 01:48:09,118
someone's obviously

3139
01:48:07,198 --> 01:48:11,039
are you implying that they're us

3140
01:48:09,118 --> 01:48:13,519
i don't think they are us but i think

3141
01:48:11,039 --> 01:48:15,039
they are what happens when things keep

3142
01:48:13,520 --> 01:48:16,960
going

3143
01:48:15,039 --> 01:48:19,039
it's not us just like we're not monkeys

3144
01:48:16,960 --> 01:48:20,239
right i'm not a chimp

3145
01:48:19,039 --> 01:48:23,279
oh that'd be cool

3146
01:48:20,238 --> 01:48:25,039
they're from here is your idea no no no

3147
01:48:23,279 --> 01:48:26,960
that this is what happens all over the

3148
01:48:25,039 --> 01:48:28,560
universe right yeah this is what

3149
01:48:26,960 --> 01:48:31,359
happened look here's the thing you know

3150
01:48:28,560 --> 01:48:34,639
i went to see brian cox's um

3151
01:48:31,359 --> 01:48:35,920
he has this amazing live show with robin

3152
01:48:34,639 --> 01:48:39,199
ins where they

3153
01:48:35,920 --> 01:48:42,000
they have these led screens these huge

3154
01:48:39,198 --> 01:48:43,599
screens with high resolution depictions

3155
01:48:42,000 --> 01:48:45,679
of the cosmos and one of the most

3156
01:48:43,600 --> 01:48:48,719
mind-blowing things

3157
01:48:45,679 --> 01:48:51,520
was he has this large-scale image of the

3158
01:48:48,719 --> 01:48:52,880
universe and it shows all the individual

3159
01:48:51,520 --> 01:48:55,040
galaxies of the universe and it just

3160
01:48:52,880 --> 01:48:56,400
keeps moving through all these galaxies

3161
01:48:55,039 --> 01:48:58,560
in three dimensions

3162
01:48:56,399 --> 01:49:01,198
and it's [ __ ] incredible but what's

3163
01:48:58,560 --> 01:49:03,440
stunning is the relative uniformity of

3164
01:49:01,198 --> 01:49:05,519
it even at you know i mean you're

3165
01:49:03,439 --> 01:49:07,919
obviously looking at

3166
01:49:05,520 --> 01:49:10,000
an incredibly small depiction of

3167
01:49:07,920 --> 01:49:11,760
something that's immensely large like a

3168
01:49:10,000 --> 01:49:13,600
galaxy of hundreds of billions of stars

3169
01:49:11,760 --> 01:49:16,159
you're seeing it as this little dot but

3170
01:49:13,600 --> 01:49:18,719
this little dot that's flying through

3171
01:49:16,158 --> 01:49:22,079
space surrounded by other little darts

3172
01:49:18,719 --> 01:49:23,359
with very similarly spaced distances

3173
01:49:22,079 --> 01:49:25,840
yeah

3174
01:49:23,359 --> 01:49:28,319
yeah so mike if we see uniformity in

3175
01:49:25,840 --> 01:49:30,639
that form in terms of like the distance

3176
01:49:28,319 --> 01:49:32,960
between galaxy so many galaxies is so

3177
01:49:30,639 --> 01:49:34,400
it's so similar they might vary slightly

3178
01:49:32,960 --> 01:49:36,399
and that slightly might be hundreds of

3179
01:49:34,399 --> 01:49:38,879
millions of light years right but but

3180
01:49:36,399 --> 01:49:41,039
but there's so much uniformity why would

3181
01:49:38,880 --> 01:49:43,118
we not assume that that uniformity

3182
01:49:41,039 --> 01:49:44,560
exists pretty much everywhere and that

3183
01:49:43,118 --> 01:49:47,198
all these things that you're seeing that

3184
01:49:44,560 --> 01:49:49,199
are so similar you do see binary star

3185
01:49:47,198 --> 01:49:50,879
systems you do see single star systems

3186
01:49:49,198 --> 01:49:52,479
like star but there's also some some

3187
01:49:50,880 --> 01:49:54,480
speculation that earth and that our

3188
01:49:52,479 --> 01:49:56,238
solar system is one time was a binary

3189
01:49:54,479 --> 01:49:58,399
star system right i mean that's one of

3190
01:49:56,238 --> 01:50:00,399
the the speculations about that that

3191
01:49:58,399 --> 01:50:01,920
object that they find outside the kuiper

3192
01:50:00,399 --> 01:50:03,198
belt that they think is 10 times larger

3193
01:50:01,920 --> 01:50:06,000
than earth they think it might have been

3194
01:50:03,198 --> 01:50:07,839
at one point in time a star but this

3195
01:50:06,000 --> 01:50:09,359
this uniformity that you see why

3196
01:50:07,840 --> 01:50:11,760
wouldn't we think that that

3197
01:50:09,359 --> 01:50:13,839
that has its same implications

3198
01:50:11,760 --> 01:50:15,840
biologically that there's some sort of a

3199
01:50:13,840 --> 01:50:16,880
biological uniformity and that this

3200
01:50:15,840 --> 01:50:19,440
happens

3201
01:50:16,880 --> 01:50:20,800
given the right sets of circumstances

3202
01:50:19,439 --> 01:50:22,879
you should tell them some of the stuff

3203
01:50:20,800 --> 01:50:24,960
that you read that you don't know is

3204
01:50:22,880 --> 01:50:26,159
true i mean if the the stuff was true

3205
01:50:24,960 --> 01:50:28,158
about the

3206
01:50:26,158 --> 01:50:29,439
propulsion stuff i mean anyway he well

3207
01:50:28,158 --> 01:50:31,679
what have you read

3208
01:50:29,439 --> 01:50:34,000
what you saw too and you know what are

3209
01:50:31,679 --> 01:50:36,158
you talking about

3210
01:50:34,000 --> 01:50:37,600
spill the beans bob

3211
01:50:36,158 --> 01:50:39,839
i gotta poke the bear here let's get

3212
01:50:37,600 --> 01:50:42,079
some more liquor in you

3213
01:50:39,840 --> 01:50:43,679
the um

3214
01:50:42,079 --> 01:50:46,319
well i mean

3215
01:50:43,679 --> 01:50:49,840
the again the the only thing i could

3216
01:50:46,319 --> 01:50:51,039
verify was what i had my hands on um

3217
01:50:49,840 --> 01:50:52,719
they were

3218
01:50:51,039 --> 01:50:54,319
you know there was talk of weapon

3219
01:50:52,719 --> 01:50:56,800
systems that there were different

3220
01:50:54,319 --> 01:50:58,319
projects project galileo project

3221
01:50:56,800 --> 01:51:00,960
sidekick was supposed to be weapon

3222
01:50:58,319 --> 01:51:03,198
applications of the craft

3223
01:51:00,960 --> 01:51:05,600
project looking glass had to do with

3224
01:51:03,198 --> 01:51:07,599
time any effects of time in the craft

3225
01:51:05,600 --> 01:51:09,679
now i don't think we're not

3226
01:51:07,600 --> 01:51:11,600
talking about making a time machine like

3227
01:51:09,679 --> 01:51:13,440
in science fiction but we're talking

3228
01:51:11,600 --> 01:51:15,840
about you know small distortions

3229
01:51:13,439 --> 01:51:16,960
intentional distortions of time and how

3230
01:51:15,840 --> 01:51:18,000
that can be

3231
01:51:16,960 --> 01:51:21,198
used

3232
01:51:18,000 --> 01:51:22,800
you know as a uh not as a well it was

3233
01:51:21,198 --> 01:51:24,479
part of a weapon program how are you

3234
01:51:22,800 --> 01:51:26,239
informed in this these again where

3235
01:51:24,479 --> 01:51:27,919
there's just those small briefings that

3236
01:51:26,238 --> 01:51:29,599
i read but

3237
01:51:27,920 --> 01:51:30,880
again i don't really like to talk about

3238
01:51:29,600 --> 01:51:32,719
those because i don't have any

3239
01:51:30,880 --> 01:51:34,480
information on them and it was just you

3240
01:51:32,719 --> 01:51:36,639
know small briefings but he told

3241
01:51:34,479 --> 01:51:39,359
commander fravor that what he saw might

3242
01:51:36,639 --> 01:51:41,520
have been a time dilation

3243
01:51:39,359 --> 01:51:43,679
well it could be because gravity affects

3244
01:51:41,520 --> 01:51:46,400
time you know space time i'm sure you've

3245
01:51:43,679 --> 01:51:49,199
heard of that and um

3246
01:51:46,399 --> 01:51:52,238
you know what what commander fraber saw

3247
01:51:49,198 --> 01:51:54,960
as he was in the f-18 approaching it he

3248
01:51:52,238 --> 01:51:56,638
said that he described it as a

3249
01:51:54,960 --> 01:51:59,039
ping-pong ball in a cup and shaking it

3250
01:51:56,639 --> 01:52:00,800
back and forth it was moving that fast

3251
01:51:59,039 --> 01:52:01,599
now obviously if there's anything inside

3252
01:52:00,800 --> 01:52:04,400
there

3253
01:52:01,599 --> 01:52:07,039
it it's going to be battered to hell but

3254
01:52:04,399 --> 01:52:08,559
you know my point was was that well one

3255
01:52:07,039 --> 01:52:10,719
of two things

3256
01:52:08,560 --> 01:52:13,199
either there's a gravitational envelope

3257
01:52:10,719 --> 01:52:14,158
in there which negates any inertia

3258
01:52:13,198 --> 01:52:15,598
effects

3259
01:52:14,158 --> 01:52:17,519
or

3260
01:52:15,599 --> 01:52:19,520
you are seeing through a gravity

3261
01:52:17,520 --> 01:52:21,360
distortion field

3262
01:52:19,520 --> 01:52:22,080
so you know just like you're looking at

3263
01:52:21,359 --> 01:52:24,799
a

3264
01:52:22,079 --> 01:52:26,960
a hot highway and you see

3265
01:52:24,800 --> 01:52:28,239
you know an optical distortion going

3266
01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:30,239
through there well the same thing

3267
01:52:28,238 --> 01:52:32,238
happens in gravity and the craft may not

3268
01:52:30,238 --> 01:52:34,799
actually be moving like that it may just

3269
01:52:32,238 --> 01:52:37,678
look like it because you're seeing you

3270
01:52:34,800 --> 01:52:40,239
can only see it through the field so it

3271
01:52:37,679 --> 01:52:42,719
may be making much more gentle moves i'm

3272
01:52:40,238 --> 01:52:44,399
not saying that's it but it has to be

3273
01:52:42,719 --> 01:52:46,800
one of the two

3274
01:52:44,399 --> 01:52:49,920
and the thing shows up 60 miles away

3275
01:52:46,800 --> 01:52:52,400
they noticed it on radar 60 seconds

3276
01:52:49,920 --> 01:52:54,239
after left commander favor but it was at

3277
01:52:52,399 --> 01:52:56,079
his cap point which is the next point he

3278
01:52:54,238 --> 01:53:00,319
was destined to go to

3279
01:52:56,079 --> 01:53:03,679
60 miles away and in 60 seconds on radar

3280
01:53:00,319 --> 01:53:05,920
the same object ends up there so it's

3281
01:53:03,679 --> 01:53:08,000
going a mile a second no

3282
01:53:05,920 --> 01:53:09,599
they i think the radar just picked it up

3283
01:53:08,000 --> 01:53:11,118
in 60 seconds

3284
01:53:09,599 --> 01:53:13,440
yeah it could have been there instantly

3285
01:53:11,118 --> 01:53:15,359
but yeah we don't know the cycle time

3286
01:53:13,439 --> 01:53:18,238
nobody knows that that's whole thing oh

3287
01:53:15,359 --> 01:53:20,479
so it cycles like radar cycles yeah it

3288
01:53:18,238 --> 01:53:22,799
doesn't it doesn't sweep but i mean it

3289
01:53:20,479 --> 01:53:23,519
scans yeah it's a planar array so it

3290
01:53:22,800 --> 01:53:24,320
just

3291
01:53:23,520 --> 01:53:26,080
you know

3292
01:53:24,319 --> 01:53:28,158
scans around it at random places that's

3293
01:53:26,079 --> 01:53:30,319
a spy one does the really cool yeah it

3294
01:53:28,158 --> 01:53:32,319
doesn't do the whole loop anymore right

3295
01:53:30,319 --> 01:53:35,439
the point uh the point is though that

3296
01:53:32,319 --> 01:53:38,079
the craft moved to his next location

3297
01:53:35,439 --> 01:53:41,118
before he knew where his next location

3298
01:53:38,079 --> 01:53:42,079
was gonna be jesus and

3299
01:53:41,118 --> 01:53:44,719
that's

3300
01:53:42,079 --> 01:53:47,359
i mean that's well documented

3301
01:53:44,719 --> 01:53:49,439
so that's uh that's a pretty shocking

3302
01:53:47,359 --> 01:53:50,880
piece of information what's fascinating

3303
01:53:49,439 --> 01:53:55,039
to me too is that you were discussing

3304
01:53:50,880 --> 01:53:56,560
this um the the way this reactor worked

3305
01:53:55,039 --> 01:53:58,000
and that these things were not really

3306
01:53:56,560 --> 01:54:00,320
connected

3307
01:53:58,000 --> 01:54:04,479
no nothing is connected

3308
01:54:00,319 --> 01:54:04,479
there's no wiring at all

3309
01:54:04,880 --> 01:54:08,880
that freaks me the [ __ ] out charge your

3310
01:54:06,639 --> 01:54:09,760
iphone you know yeah one wireless

3311
01:54:08,880 --> 01:54:12,079
yeah

3312
01:54:09,760 --> 01:54:13,599
yeah i mean that's the that's a simple

3313
01:54:12,079 --> 01:54:15,519
electromagnetic

3314
01:54:13,599 --> 01:54:17,679
yeah i know again but that's just simple

3315
01:54:15,520 --> 01:54:19,599
electromagnet magnetic induction right

3316
01:54:17,679 --> 01:54:22,719
but i mean tesla the scientist had this

3317
01:54:19,599 --> 01:54:22,719
concept of right

3318
01:54:24,079 --> 01:54:27,760
he wanted to send

3319
01:54:25,599 --> 01:54:29,199
wireless electricity through the sky and

3320
01:54:27,760 --> 01:54:30,800
westinghouse was like get the [ __ ] out

3321
01:54:29,198 --> 01:54:32,799
of here with that like when anybody

3322
01:54:30,800 --> 01:54:34,400
could just pull electricity out of this

3323
01:54:32,800 --> 01:54:35,760
meter yeah they couldn't they couldn't

3324
01:54:34,399 --> 01:54:36,960
just talk in the car right over and

3325
01:54:35,760 --> 01:54:38,719
trying to chill him out you know we're

3326
01:54:36,960 --> 01:54:40,239
talking about tesla and how he you know

3327
01:54:38,719 --> 01:54:42,239
he couldn't be metered and how it all

3328
01:54:40,238 --> 01:54:45,359
went down so it's funny bring it up yeah

3329
01:54:42,238 --> 01:54:46,718
yeah that that i mean who knows what

3330
01:54:45,359 --> 01:54:48,479
would have happened in terms of

3331
01:54:46,719 --> 01:54:50,560
innovation had he been allowed to go

3332
01:54:48,479 --> 01:54:52,158
forward with that well we probably

3333
01:54:50,560 --> 01:54:53,440
wouldn't have computers

3334
01:54:52,158 --> 01:54:55,439
you think

3335
01:54:53,439 --> 01:54:57,519
yeah i'm pretty positive i mean forget

3336
01:54:55,439 --> 01:55:00,079
about microelectronics well this is

3337
01:54:57,520 --> 01:55:01,920
dumping huge amounts of electromagnetic

3338
01:55:00,079 --> 01:55:06,000
energy in the air and yeah we'd be able

3339
01:55:01,920 --> 01:55:07,920
to wirelessly turn on our lights but

3340
01:55:06,000 --> 01:55:09,520
there'd be no radio communication the

3341
01:55:07,920 --> 01:55:11,920
interference would be something we could

3342
01:55:09,520 --> 01:55:13,760
would be overwhelming it would induce

3343
01:55:11,920 --> 01:55:16,000
electric currents in anything with a

3344
01:55:13,760 --> 01:55:17,840
small wire on it so integrated circuits

3345
01:55:16,000 --> 01:55:20,319
transistors would be disintegrated

3346
01:55:17,840 --> 01:55:23,039
before they were even you know tested

3347
01:55:20,319 --> 01:55:25,198
for operation so it it would it would

3348
01:55:23,039 --> 01:55:27,279
destroy [ __ ] us up yeah it would have

3349
01:55:25,198 --> 01:55:29,039
stopped us dead we'd have it'd be great

3350
01:55:27,279 --> 01:55:30,719
you could turn lighters on and heaters

3351
01:55:29,039 --> 01:55:33,039
from all over the place with no wires

3352
01:55:30,719 --> 01:55:34,719
but it would stop modern electronics and

3353
01:55:33,039 --> 01:55:37,118
if we became dependent on it it would

3354
01:55:34,719 --> 01:55:38,800
almost be like our dependence on fossil

3355
01:55:37,118 --> 01:55:40,319
fuels although it's destructive it's

3356
01:55:38,800 --> 01:55:41,679
very difficult for us to get off the

3357
01:55:40,319 --> 01:55:42,960
nipple

3358
01:55:41,679 --> 01:55:44,480
it would have changed the course of how

3359
01:55:42,960 --> 01:55:46,399
we developed which is so interesting

3360
01:55:44,479 --> 01:55:48,238
when you talk about if a civilization

3361
01:55:46,399 --> 01:55:50,399
another star system didn't even start

3362
01:55:48,238 --> 01:55:51,839
with fossil fuels they had 115 naturally

3363
01:55:50,399 --> 01:55:53,759
on their planet and they're like cool

3364
01:55:51,840 --> 01:55:55,440
anti-gravity is pretty awesome well the

3365
01:55:53,760 --> 01:55:58,079
fact that i think it's important that

3366
01:55:55,439 --> 01:55:59,598
that actually happened yeah

3367
01:55:58,079 --> 01:56:00,960
it might have been stopped in its tracks

3368
01:55:59,599 --> 01:56:02,480
for a reason

3369
01:56:00,960 --> 01:56:04,480
whoa

3370
01:56:02,479 --> 01:56:06,638
and

3371
01:56:04,479 --> 01:56:08,319
it's just it's i think it's incredibly

3372
01:56:06,639 --> 01:56:10,239
difficult for us to imagine

3373
01:56:08,319 --> 01:56:11,439
technological progression under another

3374
01:56:10,238 --> 01:56:14,479
timeline other than the one that we've

3375
01:56:11,439 --> 01:56:16,879
experienced yeah that's difficult

3376
01:56:14,479 --> 01:56:19,279
if we imagine what this

3377
01:56:16,880 --> 01:56:20,800
alien race must have been like and

3378
01:56:19,279 --> 01:56:23,359
i mean god

3379
01:56:20,800 --> 01:56:25,039
just just to be able to see something

3380
01:56:23,359 --> 01:56:26,639
take like i mean obviously we've seen it

3381
01:56:25,039 --> 01:56:28,560
in different life forms right like we

3382
01:56:26,639 --> 01:56:30,719
see the life of certain beetles in

3383
01:56:28,560 --> 01:56:32,639
comparison to the life of certain fish

3384
01:56:30,719 --> 01:56:35,520
very very different existence very

3385
01:56:32,639 --> 01:56:37,440
different life cycles octopus yeah

3386
01:56:35,520 --> 01:56:38,719
octopus yeah i mean we see all these

3387
01:56:37,439 --> 01:56:41,118
different variables in terms of

3388
01:56:38,719 --> 01:56:42,880
biological entities on earth but we

3389
01:56:41,118 --> 01:56:45,039
don't see it in terms of technological

3390
01:56:42,880 --> 01:56:47,118
innovation as we're the only one that's

3391
01:56:45,039 --> 01:56:48,800
intelligent that can innovate when we

3392
01:56:47,118 --> 01:56:50,399
have intelligent creatures but they're

3393
01:56:48,800 --> 01:56:52,000
in the ocean the only other thing that

3394
01:56:50,399 --> 01:56:54,000
are like us are dolphins and orcas and

3395
01:56:52,000 --> 01:56:55,520
whales and they don't have the ability

3396
01:56:54,000 --> 01:56:57,359
to manipulate their environment and

3397
01:56:55,520 --> 01:56:59,280
subsequently because they don't have the

3398
01:56:57,359 --> 01:57:01,359
ability to manipulate their environment

3399
01:56:59,279 --> 01:57:03,599
we put them in fish tanks and we're like

3400
01:57:01,359 --> 01:57:05,920
get in the tank do some tricks right

3401
01:57:03,599 --> 01:57:08,159
you know the only thing he saw in the

3402
01:57:05,920 --> 01:57:09,840
craft if we were considering bob's story

3403
01:57:08,158 --> 01:57:11,759
the only thing that you he saw in the

3404
01:57:09,840 --> 01:57:13,520
craft that he related to that looked

3405
01:57:11,760 --> 01:57:15,360
like a human could make was this

3406
01:57:13,520 --> 01:57:17,520
honeycomb hatch and i always loved that

3407
01:57:15,359 --> 01:57:19,198
because you're like obsessed with this

3408
01:57:17,520 --> 01:57:21,280
thing that you could recognize you know

3409
01:57:19,198 --> 01:57:23,759
the re yeah i i only focus on that

3410
01:57:21,279 --> 01:57:25,759
because it was the one thing that i

3411
01:57:23,760 --> 01:57:27,679
understood how it worked what was it and

3412
01:57:25,760 --> 01:57:28,639
it was it was the access to the level

3413
01:57:27,679 --> 01:57:29,599
below

3414
01:57:28,639 --> 01:57:31,679
and

3415
01:57:29,599 --> 01:57:33,599
it was um

3416
01:57:31,679 --> 01:57:35,840
well you know if you take uh

3417
01:57:33,599 --> 01:57:37,679
you have a six pack of beer and you take

3418
01:57:35,840 --> 01:57:40,079
out the cardboard dividers

3419
01:57:37,679 --> 01:57:42,399
set it on the table you can put a lot of

3420
01:57:40,079 --> 01:57:44,079
pressure on the top

3421
01:57:42,399 --> 01:57:45,598
but if you push it from the sides it

3422
01:57:44,079 --> 01:57:47,198
collapses flat

3423
01:57:45,599 --> 01:57:49,520
so it was something like that in a

3424
01:57:47,198 --> 01:57:52,719
honeycomb shape that was essentially

3425
01:57:49,520 --> 01:57:54,719
some sort of sheet metal and you could

3426
01:57:52,719 --> 01:57:57,118
walk on that in the upper layer but if

3427
01:57:54,719 --> 01:57:59,840
you took the corner stuck your finger in

3428
01:57:57,118 --> 01:58:01,920
and pushed it collapsed and made a

3429
01:57:59,840 --> 01:58:04,480
an entryway so i thought that was a

3430
01:58:01,920 --> 01:58:06,000
really unique i'd never seen that before

3431
01:58:04,479 --> 01:58:08,079
and it was the only thing in the craft

3432
01:58:06,000 --> 01:58:10,479
that made absolute sense to me i said ah

3433
01:58:08,079 --> 01:58:13,118
we can make that and all that is is a

3434
01:58:10,479 --> 01:58:15,198
hatchway was there any discussion about

3435
01:58:13,118 --> 01:58:16,238
the materials that were used to make the

3436
01:58:15,198 --> 01:58:17,839
craft

3437
01:58:16,238 --> 01:58:19,598
i'm sure there was but that was a

3438
01:58:17,840 --> 01:58:22,079
metallurgy division had nothing to do

3439
01:58:19,599 --> 01:58:23,679
with us so you never got a

3440
01:58:22,079 --> 01:58:25,279
not even the slightest briefing i don't

3441
01:58:23,679 --> 01:58:28,158
even know if it was metal or it was

3442
01:58:25,279 --> 01:58:30,319
ceramic it's i think it there's a fine

3443
01:58:28,158 --> 01:58:32,319
line between the two

3444
01:58:30,319 --> 01:58:34,719
now one of the things that's happened to

3445
01:58:32,319 --> 01:58:36,158
you that has allowed people to discredit

3446
01:58:34,719 --> 01:58:38,480
you was

3447
01:58:36,158 --> 01:58:40,799
there's obviously been some sort of an

3448
01:58:38,479 --> 01:58:43,519
effort to erase your past

3449
01:58:40,800 --> 01:58:46,000
yeah some sort of a ref uh an effort to

3450
01:58:43,520 --> 01:58:48,719
erase your education history your

3451
01:58:46,000 --> 01:58:50,479
employment history at los alamos in fact

3452
01:58:48,719 --> 01:58:52,239
the only way your employment history was

3453
01:58:50,479 --> 01:58:54,638
proven at los alamos is someone got a

3454
01:58:52,238 --> 01:58:55,839
list a directory of the employees from

3455
01:58:54,639 --> 01:58:57,359
the past

3456
01:58:55,840 --> 01:58:58,960
and read into it and you were on that

3457
01:58:57,359 --> 01:59:00,158
list so it proved that you worked there

3458
01:58:58,960 --> 01:59:01,279
even though people were trying to deny

3459
01:59:00,158 --> 01:59:02,799
and they were trying to use that as a

3460
01:59:01,279 --> 01:59:04,559
way to discredit you that you never did

3461
01:59:02,800 --> 01:59:06,000
work at los alamos you weren't really a

3462
01:59:04,560 --> 01:59:08,159
scientist

3463
01:59:06,000 --> 01:59:09,279
what was what was that like to

3464
01:59:08,158 --> 01:59:12,079
experience i mean of course we're

3465
01:59:09,279 --> 01:59:13,679
talking about the 1980s the 1990s when

3466
01:59:12,079 --> 01:59:14,960
you could get away with something like

3467
01:59:13,679 --> 01:59:17,520
that

3468
01:59:14,960 --> 01:59:18,719
yeah obviously there are a lot less

3469
01:59:17,520 --> 01:59:20,719
uh

3470
01:59:18,719 --> 01:59:22,880
a lot less records on computers at that

3471
01:59:20,719 --> 01:59:25,599
time it was still file cabinets and

3472
01:59:22,880 --> 01:59:28,800
folders but uh yeah that was frightening

3473
01:59:25,599 --> 01:59:28,800
that was one of the first things

3474
01:59:28,960 --> 01:59:32,719
i think it's i think george knapp was

3475
01:59:30,719 --> 01:59:35,679
the first one that uncovered that i mean

3476
01:59:32,719 --> 01:59:38,079
he saw my birth certificate disappear he

3477
01:59:35,679 --> 01:59:39,520
um it disappeared yeah there was no

3478
01:59:38,079 --> 01:59:42,238
record of you yeah there was there was

3479
01:59:39,520 --> 01:59:44,320
no record of that there was uh no record

3480
01:59:42,238 --> 01:59:46,799
his mom tells me about that like it was

3481
01:59:44,319 --> 01:59:48,238
frightening for her for he's got a real

3482
01:59:46,800 --> 01:59:49,760
family you know he's a real person it's

3483
01:59:48,238 --> 01:59:51,759
frightening for her

3484
01:59:49,760 --> 01:59:54,159
but if the los alamos thing really

3485
01:59:51,760 --> 01:59:56,159
surprised me and that they were so

3486
01:59:54,158 --> 01:59:58,000
adamant that no this guy never worked

3487
01:59:56,158 --> 02:00:00,000
here don't be ridiculous and george went

3488
01:59:58,000 --> 02:00:02,238
back and forth you know for i got the

3489
02:00:00,000 --> 02:00:03,920
letters on the wall yeah months i mean

3490
02:00:02,238 --> 02:00:06,879
it was ridiculous but fortunately

3491
02:00:03,920 --> 02:00:09,599
somebody came up with a 1982 phone book

3492
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:12,960
directory i mean and also

3493
02:00:09,599 --> 02:00:14,639
uh originally i told you uh

3494
02:00:12,960 --> 02:00:16,639
you know when i worked there i was on

3495
02:00:14,639 --> 02:00:18,880
the front page of the the paper so they

3496
02:00:16,639 --> 02:00:20,480
were still able to archive you know

3497
02:00:18,880 --> 02:00:22,159
bring that back from the archives and

3498
02:00:20,479 --> 02:00:24,638
you know bob lazar a physicist working

3499
02:00:22,158 --> 02:00:27,598
here at los alamos so there was at least

3500
02:00:24,639 --> 02:00:29,599
something there but uh somehow george

3501
02:00:27,599 --> 02:00:32,480
came up with the phone director and then

3502
02:00:29,599 --> 02:00:35,199
george then bob took george with cameras

3503
02:00:32,479 --> 02:00:37,279
into los alamos oh yeah yeah so we flew

3504
02:00:35,198 --> 02:00:39,279
out there and i said look come on in

3505
02:00:37,279 --> 02:00:41,118
i'll show you where i worked we'll go in

3506
02:00:39,279 --> 02:00:43,039
we'll meet people and george went with

3507
02:00:41,118 --> 02:00:44,960
me and you know

3508
02:00:43,039 --> 02:00:47,760
i navigate the place oh yeah and you

3509
02:00:44,960 --> 02:00:50,719
know met people and you know and almost

3510
02:00:47,760 --> 02:00:53,199
was also the place where they had the

3511
02:00:50,719 --> 02:00:55,520
machine that was able to read the the

3512
02:00:53,198 --> 02:00:57,759
size of your digits no no that wasn't

3513
02:00:55,520 --> 02:00:59,440
awesome that was s4 that was s4 and

3514
02:00:57,760 --> 02:01:00,320
explain that

3515
02:00:59,439 --> 02:01:02,238
so

3516
02:01:00,319 --> 02:01:04,399
now this was back in the 80s and this is

3517
02:01:02,238 --> 02:01:06,799
back in the 80s where when you discuss

3518
02:01:04,399 --> 02:01:09,839
this people like this doesn't even exist

3519
02:01:06,800 --> 02:01:11,119
yeah okay what was it it was a way

3520
02:01:09,840 --> 02:01:12,480
you know this is before fingerprint

3521
02:01:11,118 --> 02:01:15,598
scanners and

3522
02:01:12,479 --> 02:01:17,598
you know and anything of

3523
02:01:15,599 --> 02:01:19,840
anything any high resolution scanner at

3524
02:01:17,599 --> 02:01:22,239
that time so what it was was a device

3525
02:01:19,840 --> 02:01:24,880
that uh had a little picture of a hand

3526
02:01:22,238 --> 02:01:26,879
on a glass plate with pins in it so you

3527
02:01:24,880 --> 02:01:28,880
could jam your hand in there and there

3528
02:01:26,880 --> 02:01:31,440
was a bright light above it and a sensor

3529
02:01:28,880 --> 02:01:33,520
underneath and when you put your hand in

3530
02:01:31,439 --> 02:01:36,000
there the light would turn on and it

3531
02:01:33,520 --> 02:01:37,599
would measure the bones in your finger

3532
02:01:36,000 --> 02:01:38,639
because the light shown through your

3533
02:01:37,599 --> 02:01:41,679
bones

3534
02:01:38,639 --> 02:01:43,440
and apparently

3535
02:01:41,679 --> 02:01:46,079
the length of the bones in your fingers

3536
02:01:43,439 --> 02:01:48,238
are extremely unique and easy to measure

3537
02:01:46,079 --> 02:01:49,760
and they use that when you put your

3538
02:01:48,238 --> 02:01:51,519
hands on there the light would turn on

3539
02:01:49,760 --> 02:01:53,520
and your badge would pop out there's it

3540
02:01:51,520 --> 02:01:55,760
right oh there it is that's that's it

3541
02:01:53,520 --> 02:01:57,599
and i tried to describe this um to

3542
02:01:55,760 --> 02:01:59,679
people and they said that is the most

3543
02:01:57,599 --> 02:02:00,960
ridiculous thing we've ever heard

3544
02:01:59,679 --> 02:02:02,960
and um

3545
02:02:00,960 --> 02:02:05,118
i said hey that my badge came out of

3546
02:02:02,960 --> 02:02:06,639
that thing i put my hand on it badge

3547
02:02:05,118 --> 02:02:08,559
popped out and that's how i could open

3548
02:02:06,639 --> 02:02:10,719
the doors and get into s4

3549
02:02:08,560 --> 02:02:12,000
and um you know and everybody

3550
02:02:10,719 --> 02:02:13,760
discredited that they said it was

3551
02:02:12,000 --> 02:02:15,760
[ __ ] it was science fiction and

3552
02:02:13,760 --> 02:02:17,520
jeremy you found this

3553
02:02:15,760 --> 02:02:19,440
i i found it through a good friend of

3554
02:02:17,520 --> 02:02:21,679
mine named tyler rogoway and he had some

3555
02:02:19,439 --> 02:02:24,079
good sources inside of area 52 where

3556
02:02:21,679 --> 02:02:26,319
they also used these for the stealth

3557
02:02:24,079 --> 02:02:27,599
program right around that time so now

3558
02:02:26,319 --> 02:02:30,399
i've got all these people that worked

3559
02:02:27,599 --> 02:02:32,319
within who you know said only if you're

3560
02:02:30,399 --> 02:02:33,598
in certain programs would we use this

3561
02:02:32,319 --> 02:02:34,799
technology it's kind of [ __ ] actually

3562
02:02:33,599 --> 02:02:36,719
they didn't keep it for very long

3563
02:02:34,800 --> 02:02:38,719
beginning of biometrics so i was able to

3564
02:02:36,719 --> 02:02:41,279
reveal it in my film i kept my mouth

3565
02:02:38,719 --> 02:02:43,039
shut until i showed it to bob you know

3566
02:02:41,279 --> 02:02:44,639
the movie is the first time he saw it

3567
02:02:43,039 --> 02:02:46,079
was how you see it in the documentary

3568
02:02:44,639 --> 02:02:47,840
that's his genuine reaction i'm getting

3569
02:02:46,079 --> 02:02:49,039
goosebumps that was a great idea the way

3570
02:02:47,840 --> 02:02:50,560
you did it thank you man because you

3571
02:02:49,039 --> 02:02:52,319
know what guess what i'm actually trying

3572
02:02:50,560 --> 02:02:53,840
to see if he's telling the truth that's

3573
02:02:52,319 --> 02:02:55,198
how i started you know that's how i

3574
02:02:53,840 --> 02:02:57,760
started so it was really cool to see

3575
02:02:55,198 --> 02:03:00,158
that that you get to see it his actual

3576
02:02:57,760 --> 02:03:01,840
reaction has that been verified by other

3577
02:03:00,158 --> 02:03:04,879
people yeah so

3578
02:03:01,840 --> 02:03:06,400
yeah so to me it has uh personally i get

3579
02:03:04,880 --> 02:03:08,079
emails every day and people are telling

3580
02:03:06,399 --> 02:03:09,759
me where these are used and how they're

3581
02:03:08,079 --> 02:03:11,279
used and send me photos i got a lot of

3582
02:03:09,760 --> 02:03:12,719
photos of identity mats now well how

3583
02:03:11,279 --> 02:03:15,039
they were used right they're not how

3584
02:03:12,719 --> 02:03:16,800
they were used yeah but uh i don't the

3585
02:03:15,039 --> 02:03:18,158
most recent one was

3586
02:03:16,800 --> 02:03:20,159
way more recent than i thought in

3587
02:03:18,158 --> 02:03:23,279
another country but yeah that technology

3588
02:03:20,158 --> 02:03:24,238
was used so what's so funny is

3589
02:03:23,279 --> 02:03:28,079
um

3590
02:03:24,238 --> 02:03:29,678
that this technology even in the area 52

3591
02:03:28,079 --> 02:03:31,679
where they'd use him for tonopah one of

3592
02:03:29,679 --> 02:03:33,920
the guys who will go on camera with me

3593
02:03:31,679 --> 02:03:36,000
he will do an interview with me he was a

3594
02:03:33,920 --> 02:03:37,840
technician for one of these and and he

3595
02:03:36,000 --> 02:03:39,920
hated them because they were really bad

3596
02:03:37,840 --> 02:03:41,679
they always broke down and never and he

3597
02:03:39,920 --> 02:03:44,319
was a technician for him now he won't

3598
02:03:41,679 --> 02:03:46,000
tell me where if he worked at area 52 so

3599
02:03:44,319 --> 02:03:48,000
it's probably tonopah

3600
02:03:46,000 --> 02:03:49,439
it's very separated even on base but

3601
02:03:48,000 --> 02:03:52,479
yeah so

3602
02:03:49,439 --> 02:03:55,279
there was that yeah there is your

3603
02:03:52,479 --> 02:03:57,678
education record that was also like what

3604
02:03:55,279 --> 02:04:00,000
happened with that

3605
02:03:57,679 --> 02:04:02,800
well that disappeared also you know that

3606
02:04:00,000 --> 02:04:05,679
i i've i've never gone

3607
02:04:02,800 --> 02:04:07,760
i've never gone anywhere for education

3608
02:04:05,679 --> 02:04:09,520
i've never gone i never attended any

3609
02:04:07,760 --> 02:04:11,760
classes at caltech i never attended

3610
02:04:09,520 --> 02:04:14,000
anything at mit

3611
02:04:11,760 --> 02:04:15,760
you did attend classes in those places i

3612
02:04:14,000 --> 02:04:17,279
did attend classes in those places do

3613
02:04:15,760 --> 02:04:18,159
you know anybody that you went to school

3614
02:04:17,279 --> 02:04:20,399
with

3615
02:04:18,158 --> 02:04:21,920
yes i do and have they verified that

3616
02:04:20,399 --> 02:04:24,719
they went to school with you well i gave

3617
02:04:21,920 --> 02:04:27,359
jeremy some names but people yeah i the

3618
02:04:24,719 --> 02:04:30,239
reason i don't say these names publicly

3619
02:04:27,359 --> 02:04:32,319
is because every single time i mention a

3620
02:04:30,238 --> 02:04:36,079
name somebody gets injured they don't

3621
02:04:32,319 --> 02:04:38,399
want to be of course yeah yeah of course

3622
02:04:36,079 --> 02:04:41,039
um but what what is that experience like

3623
02:04:38,399 --> 02:04:43,039
seeing your birth certificate erased

3624
02:04:41,039 --> 02:04:45,118
seeing your employment well it's

3625
02:04:43,039 --> 02:04:46,880
frightening it's it's absolutely

3626
02:04:45,118 --> 02:04:49,118
frightening it's also the fuel that the

3627
02:04:46,880 --> 02:04:51,760
debunkers use the so-called air quote

3628
02:04:49,118 --> 02:04:53,039
skeptics i don't like the term skeptics

3629
02:04:51,760 --> 02:04:54,800
i'm going to say this publicly because i

3630
02:04:53,039 --> 02:04:57,760
really only said this privately i think

3631
02:04:54,800 --> 02:05:00,079
it's a sloppy lazy way to look at things

3632
02:04:57,760 --> 02:05:02,320
to just be a skeptic

3633
02:05:00,079 --> 02:05:04,639
i want people to be objective

3634
02:05:02,319 --> 02:05:07,039
and i think there's a lot of things you

3635
02:05:04,639 --> 02:05:09,440
should be skeptical of i think you

3636
02:05:07,039 --> 02:05:11,118
should you should look at things and

3637
02:05:09,439 --> 02:05:13,678
look at things

3638
02:05:11,118 --> 02:05:15,839
from a hard-line science perspective you

3639
02:05:13,679 --> 02:05:17,440
should be subjective but the idea of

3640
02:05:15,840 --> 02:05:19,279
skeptics the problem with that is you're

3641
02:05:17,439 --> 02:05:20,879
always looking for things to be [ __ ]

3642
02:05:19,279 --> 02:05:22,238
yeah and i think that's dangerous

3643
02:05:20,880 --> 02:05:23,840
because i think some things aren't

3644
02:05:22,238 --> 02:05:25,359
[ __ ] it's confirmation bias on the

3645
02:05:23,840 --> 02:05:26,880
other end you're just deciding to take a

3646
02:05:25,359 --> 02:05:29,118
square thing and put it around hold no

3647
02:05:26,880 --> 02:05:30,239
matter what and i find a lot of them to

3648
02:05:29,118 --> 02:05:32,079
be lazy

3649
02:05:30,238 --> 02:05:33,839
a lot of them to be lazy thinkers sure

3650
02:05:32,079 --> 02:05:36,479
because they're always putting it into

3651
02:05:33,840 --> 02:05:38,400
that box instead of going hmm

3652
02:05:36,479 --> 02:05:40,079
instead of just separating their ego

3653
02:05:38,399 --> 02:05:42,158
they're trying they're playing a game

3654
02:05:40,079 --> 02:05:44,238
and the game is calling [ __ ] i want

3655
02:05:42,158 --> 02:05:45,920
to call [ __ ] and i'm gonna line up

3656
02:05:44,238 --> 02:05:47,678
all these reasons why it's [ __ ] and

3657
02:05:45,920 --> 02:05:50,000
i'm gonna ignore anything that might be

3658
02:05:47,679 --> 02:05:51,279
contrary to that definition yeah

3659
02:05:50,000 --> 02:05:52,880
every time i'm thinking i'm going to

3660
02:05:51,279 --> 02:05:55,439
catch him in something you know all

3661
02:05:52,880 --> 02:05:56,639
along this process um i found dr krangle

3662
02:05:55,439 --> 02:05:58,479
he came forward and said i was in

3663
02:05:56,639 --> 02:06:00,400
security briefings with bob lazar the

3664
02:05:58,479 --> 02:06:02,158
physicist at los angeles he went on the

3665
02:06:00,399 --> 02:06:03,679
record with me now the other people i

3666
02:06:02,158 --> 02:06:05,279
talked with why won't they go on the

3667
02:06:03,679 --> 02:06:07,039
record with me because they're still

3668
02:06:05,279 --> 02:06:08,479
working there

3669
02:06:07,039 --> 02:06:10,238
so that that's the difference right what

3670
02:06:08,479 --> 02:06:11,519
is that what can the public have right

3671
02:06:10,238 --> 02:06:12,718
or even if they're not working there

3672
02:06:11,520 --> 02:06:14,560
that you know they want to live their

3673
02:06:12,719 --> 02:06:17,840
lives why i mean obviously people have

3674
02:06:14,560 --> 02:06:20,320
seen what's happened to you mike thigpen

3675
02:06:17,840 --> 02:06:23,039
after 30 years yeah really if you look

3676
02:06:20,319 --> 02:06:25,599
at all the information on

3677
02:06:23,039 --> 02:06:27,519
you know concerning my accounts that's

3678
02:06:25,599 --> 02:06:30,159
that's verifiable

3679
02:06:27,520 --> 02:06:32,800
it can't possibly be a [ __ ] story

3680
02:06:30,158 --> 02:06:35,439
anymore it's really way past that point

3681
02:06:32,800 --> 02:06:38,560
yeah i mean that was my big pin is i

3682
02:06:35,439 --> 02:06:40,799
mean how could i possibly know

3683
02:06:38,560 --> 02:06:42,800
uh so mike fig pin

3684
02:06:40,800 --> 02:06:44,880
was the guy that did the security

3685
02:06:42,800 --> 02:06:46,159
clearances to go to the bait one of the

3686
02:06:44,880 --> 02:06:48,239
guys that was this is the guy that you

3687
02:06:46,158 --> 02:06:50,399
worked with he said he did

3688
02:06:48,238 --> 02:06:52,000
right and and george knapp you know

3689
02:06:50,399 --> 02:06:54,479
george didn't believe him george put him

3690
02:06:52,000 --> 02:06:56,960
through four polygraph tests right he

3691
02:06:54,479 --> 02:06:58,799
tried to see man this is a big risk it

3692
02:06:56,960 --> 02:07:01,439
sounds interesting but let's see if he's

3693
02:06:58,800 --> 02:07:02,560
telling the truth one of the things was

3694
02:07:01,439 --> 02:07:04,158
bob said there's a guy named mike

3695
02:07:02,560 --> 02:07:06,480
thigpen he did security clearances for

3696
02:07:04,158 --> 02:07:07,920
the base and that's a weird name it's

3697
02:07:06,479 --> 02:07:10,238
very specific

3698
02:07:07,920 --> 02:07:12,000
for 30 years george

3699
02:07:10,238 --> 02:07:13,519
found this guy in this weird department

3700
02:07:12,000 --> 02:07:15,359
that he didn't even know it was my big

3701
02:07:13,520 --> 02:07:17,360
pin the guy wouldn't talk to me ghosted

3702
02:07:15,359 --> 02:07:19,359
him totally ghosting for 30 years used

3703
02:07:17,359 --> 02:07:21,359
facebook and google image match through

3704
02:07:19,359 --> 02:07:23,598
his children i was able to find him

3705
02:07:21,359 --> 02:07:25,519
after 30 years and i talked to him three

3706
02:07:23,599 --> 02:07:28,159
times on the phone he lives on the east

3707
02:07:25,520 --> 02:07:29,520
coast he almost went on camera with me

3708
02:07:28,158 --> 02:07:31,598
confirmed that he did security

3709
02:07:29,520 --> 02:07:34,159
clearances for the base in 1989

3710
02:07:31,599 --> 02:07:35,520
confirmed he remembers bob lazar and

3711
02:07:34,158 --> 02:07:37,519
what you don't know is there's a

3712
02:07:35,520 --> 02:07:40,239
handwritten note that a friend of yours

3713
02:07:37,520 --> 02:07:42,000
has from mike what i know i'm gonna give

3714
02:07:40,238 --> 02:07:43,519
it to you later i don't but that is real

3715
02:07:42,000 --> 02:07:45,039
that is actual so a handwritten note

3716
02:07:43,520 --> 02:07:47,599
that says what you know like this is new

3717
02:07:45,039 --> 02:07:49,920
to me so when the i

3718
02:07:47,599 --> 02:07:49,920
when you're

3719
02:07:50,479 --> 02:07:53,919
when they do security client clearances

3720
02:07:52,479 --> 02:07:55,198
they go through all your friends and

3721
02:07:53,920 --> 02:07:57,840
they go to your friend's phone yeah yeah

3722
02:07:55,198 --> 02:07:59,279
so this is too bob and

3723
02:07:57,840 --> 02:08:00,719
i had people come to me for a friend of

3724
02:07:59,279 --> 02:08:02,078
mine that's serving and they're doing

3725
02:08:00,719 --> 02:08:04,239
the security clearance for him and even

3726
02:08:02,078 --> 02:08:06,158
though i'm like the ufo guy

3727
02:08:04,238 --> 02:08:08,000
they did you know the fbi come and visit

3728
02:08:06,158 --> 02:08:09,920
my house and make sure that they talk

3729
02:08:08,000 --> 02:08:11,920
about my friend and they lift a little

3730
02:08:09,920 --> 02:08:12,960
card and when my wife told him to get

3731
02:08:11,920 --> 02:08:14,800
away because he didn't know who they

3732
02:08:12,960 --> 02:08:16,960
were they left a little card it's super

3733
02:08:14,800 --> 02:08:18,800
cute now back then it was a handwritten

3734
02:08:16,960 --> 02:08:21,279
note and his friend has it for him that

3735
02:08:18,800 --> 02:08:22,639
you haven't seen in oh my god two

3736
02:08:21,279 --> 02:08:24,078
decades

3737
02:08:22,639 --> 02:08:25,760
so if you're listening

3738
02:08:24,078 --> 02:08:27,279
you're telling me what it is

3739
02:08:25,760 --> 02:08:28,960
what is this card

3740
02:08:27,279 --> 02:08:31,279
it's just a little handwritten note with

3741
02:08:28,960 --> 02:08:32,960
mike thigpen's signature card like like

3742
02:08:31,279 --> 02:08:34,719
a like a postcard

3743
02:08:32,960 --> 02:08:36,639
like a piece of paper that he left on

3744
02:08:34,719 --> 02:08:38,639
the door saying when bob gets back or

3745
02:08:36,639 --> 02:08:40,400
whatever it says on it so it's just

3746
02:08:38,639 --> 02:08:42,078
another little funny thing i found the

3747
02:08:40,399 --> 02:08:43,759
guy he does the security clearances he

3748
02:08:42,078 --> 02:08:45,279
admitted to me he did it and he admitted

3749
02:08:43,760 --> 02:08:46,719
to me he was dodging george knapp

3750
02:08:45,279 --> 02:08:49,279
because when george said his name on the

3751
02:08:46,719 --> 02:08:51,359
writ on the on the news he dropped his

3752
02:08:49,279 --> 02:08:53,279
fork into his steak or into his potatoes

3753
02:08:51,359 --> 02:08:54,799
or whatever and he's looking at his wife

3754
02:08:53,279 --> 02:08:56,078
he was in trouble his name's never

3755
02:08:54,800 --> 02:08:57,840
supposed to be out there like it's just

3756
02:08:56,078 --> 02:09:00,078
a security clearance guy but you don't

3757
02:08:57,840 --> 02:09:02,480
want national attention associated with

3758
02:09:00,078 --> 02:09:05,279
anything bob has to say but anyway this

3759
02:09:02,479 --> 02:09:06,718
unique name bob said for 30 years and

3760
02:09:05,279 --> 02:09:08,639
the guy ghosted george knapp george

3761
02:09:06,719 --> 02:09:10,239
could prove he existed he actually

3762
02:09:08,639 --> 02:09:12,800
talked to me man he talked to me three

3763
02:09:10,238 --> 02:09:14,399
times he almost went on camera with me

3764
02:09:12,800 --> 02:09:16,159
it's just crazy what what do you what

3765
02:09:14,399 --> 02:09:18,879
happens after 30 years you just get more

3766
02:09:16,158 --> 02:09:22,559
info well that's one of the reasons why

3767
02:09:18,880 --> 02:09:24,560
when you and me and jeremy and george

3768
02:09:22,560 --> 02:09:26,880
knapp had that conversation on the phone

3769
02:09:24,560 --> 02:09:28,480
yeah i said i think

3770
02:09:26,880 --> 02:09:30,239
what we can do

3771
02:09:28,479 --> 02:09:33,198
with this podcast

3772
02:09:30,238 --> 02:09:35,759
is important i really do i think it's

3773
02:09:33,198 --> 02:09:39,439
important for people to hear this

3774
02:09:35,760 --> 02:09:43,119
from you in a very clear

3775
02:09:39,439 --> 02:09:46,238
just very concise way

3776
02:09:43,118 --> 02:09:48,238
and if you examine all the information

3777
02:09:46,238 --> 02:09:49,919
that you've said today if you you look

3778
02:09:48,238 --> 02:09:52,638
at all the things that the detractors

3779
02:09:49,920 --> 02:09:54,639
have said if you look at all of the new

3780
02:09:52,639 --> 02:09:56,400
recent evidence that's coming out and

3781
02:09:54,639 --> 02:09:58,560
all these

3782
02:09:56,399 --> 02:10:00,000
really high-level people in the military

3783
02:09:58,560 --> 02:10:01,280
and the government that are discussing

3784
02:10:00,000 --> 02:10:03,760
this

3785
02:10:01,279 --> 02:10:06,319
it gives you

3786
02:10:03,760 --> 02:10:09,360
far more credibility than you would have

3787
02:10:06,319 --> 02:10:12,078
had in the 19 years when this came out

3788
02:10:09,359 --> 02:10:13,839
[ __ ] yes you can't ignore his story just

3789
02:10:12,078 --> 02:10:15,039
because you don't like it anymore that's

3790
02:10:13,840 --> 02:10:17,679
why i thought it was important that you

3791
02:10:15,039 --> 02:10:19,679
come out and refresh the world's memory

3792
02:10:17,679 --> 02:10:21,520
and let people know and like i said i've

3793
02:10:19,679 --> 02:10:23,279
been i mean i want to say i'm a fan of

3794
02:10:21,520 --> 02:10:25,040
yours but i guess i'm a fan of yours as

3795
02:10:23,279 --> 02:10:27,198
a human being i'm a fan of yours but

3796
02:10:25,039 --> 02:10:28,800
i've been following you for decades i've

3797
02:10:27,198 --> 02:10:31,439
been following the story for decades i

3798
02:10:28,800 --> 02:10:33,760
mean i'm kidding i have vhs tapes bob

3799
02:10:31,439 --> 02:10:36,799
like a lot of the world has yeah it's

3800
02:10:33,760 --> 02:10:40,719
crazy well anybody that has any sort of

3801
02:10:36,800 --> 02:10:43,599
uh a vested interest or a just a even uh

3802
02:10:40,719 --> 02:10:46,480
just a fascination with ufos has

3803
02:10:43,599 --> 02:10:48,719
followed your story because there's no

3804
02:10:46,479 --> 02:10:50,559
one else there's no one else that comes

3805
02:10:48,719 --> 02:10:52,000
for this some guy who said i worked

3806
02:10:50,560 --> 02:10:53,599
underground with the aliens they shot my

3807
02:10:52,000 --> 02:10:54,560
hand off like there's a bunch of wacky

3808
02:10:53,599 --> 02:10:55,840
dudes

3809
02:10:54,560 --> 02:10:56,800
they're underground there's bases

3810
02:10:55,840 --> 02:10:58,239
they're shooting lasers through the

3811
02:10:56,800 --> 02:11:00,639
earth's crust and they move them at

3812
02:10:58,238 --> 02:11:02,559
light speed there's a lot of those guys

3813
02:11:00,639 --> 02:11:04,719
they seem schizophrenic they seem crazy

3814
02:11:02,560 --> 02:11:06,639
they might even be disinformation agents

3815
02:11:04,719 --> 02:11:09,118
they might be people that are designed

3816
02:11:06,639 --> 02:11:10,719
to muddy the waters which for sure has

3817
02:11:09,118 --> 02:11:12,559
happened people are coming forward

3818
02:11:10,719 --> 02:11:13,920
though now it's amazing by doing this

3819
02:11:12,560 --> 02:11:16,000
what you're doing you're providing an

3820
02:11:13,920 --> 02:11:18,000
opportunity for bob to tell a story you

3821
02:11:16,000 --> 02:11:20,560
know believe it or not he can tell a

3822
02:11:18,000 --> 02:11:22,399
story it's amazing because more people

3823
02:11:20,560 --> 02:11:24,639
will come forward now

3824
02:11:22,399 --> 02:11:26,158
that are involved with these projects

3825
02:11:24,639 --> 02:11:27,520
they'll come forward to you to me

3826
02:11:26,158 --> 02:11:28,719
they're coming forward and so what

3827
02:11:27,520 --> 02:11:30,880
you've done here is provide that

3828
02:11:28,719 --> 02:11:32,560
opportunity if they need it and it's

3829
02:11:30,880 --> 02:11:34,560
amazing i just want to say bob just

3830
02:11:32,560 --> 02:11:36,800
don't come forward no don't come forward

3831
02:11:34,560 --> 02:11:39,280
to bob

3832
02:11:36,800 --> 02:11:41,440
why were you freaking nauseous at the

3833
02:11:39,279 --> 02:11:43,198
beginning of this like so

3834
02:11:41,439 --> 02:11:44,559
upset why was your why'd you have a

3835
02:11:43,198 --> 02:11:45,759
migraine because that started off so

3836
02:11:44,560 --> 02:11:47,760
hard my god i was sitting here like did

3837
02:11:45,760 --> 02:11:49,760
this why are you asking him why because

3838
02:11:47,760 --> 02:11:51,679
obviously anxiety the guy's gone through

3839
02:11:49,760 --> 02:11:53,280
30 [ __ ] years of being persecuted i

3840
02:11:51,679 --> 02:11:54,639
just want to erase his birth certificate

3841
02:11:53,279 --> 02:11:56,319
i just want to hear what you hear from i

3842
02:11:54,639 --> 02:11:58,159
want to hear him say i want them why did

3843
02:11:56,319 --> 02:12:02,238
i have to say that you don't just set it

3844
02:11:58,158 --> 02:12:02,238
up get it i step out okay settle down

3845
02:12:02,639 --> 02:12:06,400
yeah well i get it you were it was hard

3846
02:12:04,960 --> 02:12:09,599
for you to get them here you know and i

3847
02:12:06,399 --> 02:12:11,118
was for us yeah you you don't you do

3848
02:12:09,599 --> 02:12:13,360
what really annoys me are the people

3849
02:12:11,118 --> 02:12:14,639
that think you know you guys just came

3850
02:12:13,359 --> 02:12:16,078
up with the story to make a bunch of

3851
02:12:14,639 --> 02:12:17,760
money or get a bunch of you know

3852
02:12:16,078 --> 02:12:19,679
attention and that's a good point so

3853
02:12:17,760 --> 02:12:21,920
please explain that first of all i don't

3854
02:12:19,679 --> 02:12:24,239
get any money out of this at all and i

3855
02:12:21,920 --> 02:12:25,679
may i didn't even let you guys buy plane

3856
02:12:24,238 --> 02:12:27,359
tickets for me to come out here or

3857
02:12:25,679 --> 02:12:30,239
anything i mean

3858
02:12:27,359 --> 02:12:33,519
any time like when jeremy

3859
02:12:30,238 --> 02:12:34,479
uh pre-previewed i guess the movie up in

3860
02:12:33,520 --> 02:12:36,480
michigan

3861
02:12:34,479 --> 02:12:38,158
i mean they it brought in like a couple

3862
02:12:36,479 --> 02:12:40,238
thousand dollars i made sure that two

3863
02:12:38,158 --> 02:12:42,559
thousand dollars went to science

3864
02:12:40,238 --> 02:12:44,319
programs at the local high schools there

3865
02:12:42,560 --> 02:12:46,000
dirty money i don't want to touch it i

3866
02:12:44,319 --> 02:12:48,000
don't take any money from this stuff and

3867
02:12:46,000 --> 02:12:51,920
as far as attention

3868
02:12:48,000 --> 02:12:54,000
i hate [ __ ] attention i don't like

3869
02:12:51,920 --> 02:12:55,840
being on shows i just want to kind of

3870
02:12:54,000 --> 02:12:57,840
hide in the corner and do my own thing

3871
02:12:55,840 --> 02:13:01,199
so that's i got enough hugs when i was a

3872
02:12:57,840 --> 02:13:04,319
kid okay i don't need any attention so

3873
02:13:01,198 --> 02:13:06,000
now that if if you if you think somehow

3874
02:13:04,319 --> 02:13:08,238
we came up with this thing then you got

3875
02:13:06,000 --> 02:13:10,000
to tell me why we did it well you've

3876
02:13:08,238 --> 02:13:11,759
done a great job of

3877
02:13:10,000 --> 02:13:13,359
making sure you have your bases covered

3878
02:13:11,760 --> 02:13:14,560
in that regard that you haven't profited

3879
02:13:13,359 --> 02:13:16,158
off of this and like you said that you

3880
02:13:14,560 --> 02:13:18,719
have donated whatever money that came

3881
02:13:16,158 --> 02:13:21,759
your way to science programs it's i mean

3882
02:13:18,719 --> 02:13:23,198
it it doesn't make any sense

3883
02:13:21,760 --> 02:13:25,440
any other way

3884
02:13:23,198 --> 02:13:27,439
i mean what you're what i've gotten out

3885
02:13:25,439 --> 02:13:28,479
of here is what i thought i was going to

3886
02:13:27,439 --> 02:13:30,799
get out of here when i watched the

3887
02:13:28,479 --> 02:13:32,959
documentary that you what you're saying

3888
02:13:30,800 --> 02:13:35,199
makes sense it doesn't make sense that

3889
02:13:32,960 --> 02:13:37,920
it's [ __ ] that happened exactly like

3890
02:13:35,198 --> 02:13:40,238
i said it did joe i believe you

3891
02:13:37,920 --> 02:13:42,800
um in closing is there anything else

3892
02:13:40,238 --> 02:13:42,799
you'd like to say

3893
02:13:42,960 --> 02:13:47,189
no i can't think of anything other than

3894
02:13:44,719 --> 02:13:48,960
really don't come and try to visit me

3895
02:13:47,189 --> 02:13:52,319
[Laughter]

3896
02:13:48,960 --> 02:13:54,639
well um i know that you have paid a huge

3897
02:13:52,319 --> 02:13:56,479
personal cost to get this information

3898
02:13:54,639 --> 02:13:57,679
out and i mean maybe you didn't

3899
02:13:56,479 --> 02:13:59,439
understand what that cost would have

3900
02:13:57,679 --> 02:14:01,840
been when you first initially came

3901
02:13:59,439 --> 02:14:04,078
forward with the story but over the past

3902
02:14:01,840 --> 02:14:05,920
30 years it's been immense it's been

3903
02:14:04,078 --> 02:14:08,158
great and i just want to thank you for

3904
02:14:05,920 --> 02:14:09,440
that and thank you for all these people

3905
02:14:08,158 --> 02:14:11,198
that would not have gotten this

3906
02:14:09,439 --> 02:14:13,598
information and would not have really

3907
02:14:11,198 --> 02:14:15,439
had this story any other way

3908
02:14:13,599 --> 02:14:17,199
oh thanks joe thank you

3909
02:14:15,439 --> 02:14:18,960
and thank you jeremy and one more time

3910
02:14:17,198 --> 02:14:21,439
the documentary is available on netflix

3911
02:14:18,960 --> 02:14:24,239
right now yeah it's called bob lazar

3912
02:14:21,439 --> 02:14:26,199
area 51 and flying saucers all right

3913
02:14:24,238 --> 02:14:31,929
that's it folks good night

3914
02:14:26,199 --> 02:14:31,929
[Music]

3915
02:14:33,489 --> 02:14:38,188
[Applause]

3916
02:14:40,189 --> 02:14:46,109
[Music]